Need Help With Bettas

[gale]

It's been years since I had any fish or bettas. We decided to get a couple but I think the tanks were too small (we put one in each tank). They were around 1.5 gallon filtered tanks. We bought the fish from petsmart and one lasted a day and one lasted 3 days. I think I did everything else right. The water temp was fine, we acclimated them to the new water, used bottled city water with dechlor in it, etc. But the tanks were probably too small and we didn't let the filters run for a few days or anything before putting the fish in. So we went and got 5 gallon filtered tanks and will let them run for a few days first. Also, I read that Novaqua/Amquel is good so I bought that to replace the tetra water safe stuff we had. Just a couple of questions about how to proceed: 
 
Can we reuse the plants/decorations from the first tanks? If so what is the best way to clean them thoroughly? We are planning to get new gravel because the first ones had coarse gravel and we've decided to put at least one live plant in each tank, and I guess finer gravel is better for that? 
 
Does the bottled cycling stuff work well or is it better to cycle it another way? I don't know anyone with an established tank. I wasn't sure how important cycling was in a 5 gallon tank with one betta. 
 
Is it okay to add one more fish, like a small catfish? Or a large shrimp? Or just keep the betta (and a couple of nerite snails) alone? 
 
Should we use tap water? We have a well and a water softener (it uses salt). I also have access to unsoftened water from the same well. 
 
It's kind of frustrating because I know people who buy a betta from walmart, put them in a bowl on their desk at work where the temp is about 70, do nothing else but feed them, and they thrive. I thought we were doing good by using a filtered tank but apparently not.
 
thanks
 

 

[NickAu]

 
used bottled city water with dechlor in it

Please give more details.
 
Most bottled or spring type of water is not fish safe.
 

 
1.5 gallon filtered tanks.

IMO a 1.5 gallon is suitable as a hospital tank only,

 

[Ninjouzata]

It'll be fine to re-use the decorations and plants. You could use sand instead of gravel if you like as well.
 
You can definitely use tap water as long as you use a dechlorinator. I'm not sure if that water softener is an issue or not, hopefully someone with more experience can say.
It would be good to know though what the unsoftened water tests like though. I recommend getting a liquid test kit, API is a popular brand for this.
 
You'll want to do a fishless cycle on the tanks. Even if it's just one betta, 5 gallons is not that much unfortunately, although it is a suitable size for them.

 
These size tanks though are not suitable for any sort of catfish. Shrimp are quite likely to get eaten, but you can try it. I wouldn't get too many snails either due to their bioload but one should be fine.
 
You can read about fishless cycling HERE and more about betta care HERE.
If you want to use bottled bacteria to speed up the process you can order Dr. Tim's One & Only or try some Tetra Safe Start, the first being the better option although also more price-y.
 
I definitely understand the frustration, and I'm sorry for your losses. Hopefully this helps a little, and welcome to the forum

 

[Munroco]

Be assured, the bettas they purchase from walmart or wherever, and keep in a tiny tank aren't thriving. They are clinging on to life. If you are happy to keep keep fish in these conditions then this forum is not the place for you. If however you are prepared to take a little advice and learn to keep fish humanely then welcome.. There are lots of people on this forum who can advise you on betta requirements far better than i can, but I'm certain that none will advocate keeping a betta (or any other fish) in a poopie little bowl. You are asking the right questions so far, hopefully you will get the advice you need.
 
Poopie was NOT the word I used.

 

[gale]

 

 
used bottled city water with dechlor in it

Please give more details.
 
Most bottled or spring type of water is not fish safe.
 

 
1.5 gallon filtered tanks.

IMO a 1.5 gallon is suitable as a hospital tank only,
 


The bottled water is city water that is put through a filter and possibly chlorinated. Which is why I got the dechlor. I have been reading that a lot of people who live in the city use tap water so this was as close as I could find to that. I wasn't sure if water that's been through the softener is okay. 
 
About the tank-I realize that. That's why I bought two 5 gallon tanks. 

It'll be fine to re-use the decorations and plants. You could use sand instead of gravel if you like as well.
 
You can definitely use tap water as long as you use a dechlorinator. I'm not sure if that water softener is an issue or not, hopefully someone with more experience can say.
It would be good to know though what the unsoftened water tests like though. I recommend getting a liquid test kit, API is a popular brand for this.
 
You'll want to do a fishless cycle on the tanks. Even if it's just one betta, 5 gallons is not that much unfortunately, although it is a suitable size for them.

 
These size tanks though are not suitable for any sort of catfish. Shrimp are quite likely to get eaten, but you can try it. I wouldn't get too many snails either due to their bioload but one should be fine.
 
You can read about fishless cycling HERE and more about betta care HERE.
If you want to use bottled bacteria to speed up the process you can order Dr. Tim's One & Only or try some Tetra Safe Start, the first being the better option although also more price-y.
 
I definitely understand the frustration, and I'm sorry for your losses. Hopefully this helps a little, and welcome to the forum

Thank you. It's been about 8-9 yrs since we've had fish and I've apparently forgotten 99% of how it works. I had a pretty decent tank back then but got out of it when my kids had so many activities I didn't have time to mess with the water changes. My kids are older now so we have more time. I'll look through those links. 

 

[Ninjouzata]

I just noticed you're not new at all here, my apologies. I should have said welcome back instead!

 

[gale]

Be assured, the bettas they purchase from walmart or wherever, and keep in a tiny tank aren't thriving. They are clinging on to life. If you are happy to keep keep fish in these conditions then this forum is not the place for you. If however you are prepared to take a little advice and learn to keep fish humanely then welcome.. There are lots of people on this forum who can advise you on betta requirements far better than i can, but I'm certain that none will advocate keeping a betta (or any other fish) in a poopie little bowl. You are asking the right questions so far, hopefully you will get the advice you need.
 
Poopie was NOT the word I used.

I've already mentioned that I bought two 5 gallon tanks in place of the small ones I had. So I'm happy to keep fish in a bigger tank. I've been a forum member since 2004 so I have been around and started keeping fish around 1994 but have been out of the fish hobby for a long time. I wasn't keeping them in a poopie little bowl in the first place though. I thought the tanks we got would be fine since they're filtered. I know now that they aren't so that's why I bought the bigger tanks (fluval specs if that matters) and want to start them out right this time. 
 
As for where to buy, I have walmart and petsense locally and petsmart and petco (both an hour's drive away). There's an aquarium shop about an hour away but they have very few betta fish. And another pet store that has a lot of fish about 50 minutes away. All of these places keep the bettas in tiny cups. Which would be the best? I kind of hate to drive an hour away because it's hard to keep the temperature in the car constant for the entire trip (it's really hot here). 

I just noticed you're not new at all here, my apologies. I should have said welcome back instead!

No worries. I haven't posted since 2008 (I looked at my old posts) so it's as if I'm new. I forget things that I did last week so I'm pretty sure I've forgotten most of the rules of fishkeeping. lol. 
 
eta: the fish store where we got the tanks sold me tetra safe start so I'll use that. 

 

[gale]

I have a new question I just thought of. If I cycle the tank using tetra safe start (plus) will it stay cycled without fish in it? Not a problem for my own tank because I'm not too picky but my daughter is looking for a certain type and color fish and it might be a while before she finds the right one. 

 

[Essjay]

Re the water softener, the salt type is not good for fish as it adds sodium to the water. If there is a bypass tap for human consumption, use that one.
 
You need to add a source of ammonia as well as the bottled bacteria. The bottle will most likely say to add fish at the same time but it is much safer to use a bottle of ammonia solution to simulate fish waste. As Ninjouzata said, these bottled bacteria speed the cycle up (when they work) they don't cycle a tank instantly. You still need to follow the fishless cycle instructions she gave you link to.
This also has the advantage that once the tank has cycled you can use the bottle of ammonia to keep the bacteria fed until your daughter finds the fish she wants.

 

[Ninjouzata]

Yeah, you will still need to use ammonia. Where are you located? If you're in the US you can find some at Ace Hardware. I believe in the UK Kleen-Off brand is the one to use.
 
By the way, have you thought of ordering online? That might give your daughter some more options.

 

[gale]

I'm in the US. I'll check Ace hardware for the ammonia. 
 
I can look into online ordering. I've only ordered snails and plants online but never fish. 

Re the water softener, the salt type is not good for fish as it adds sodium to the water. If there is a bypass tap for human consumption, use that one.
 
You need to add a source of ammonia as well as the bottled bacteria. The bottle will most likely say to add fish at the same time but it is much safer to use a bottle of ammonia solution to simulate fish waste. As Ninjouzata said, these bottled bacteria speed the cycle up (when they work) they don't cycle a tank instantly. You still need to follow the fishless cycle instructions she gave you link to.
This also has the advantage that once the tank has cycled you can use the bottle of ammonia to keep the bacteria fed until your daughter finds the fish she wants.

Is there a chart showing how much to add to maintain the cycle? 

 

[Ninjouzata]

In the cycling article I linked you (can also be found at the top of the forum so you don't have to check this for it) it mentions "snack" doses

 

[omega59]

Iam too starting a new tank. It's almost a month and mines isn't cycled just yet. Iam waiting for nitrites to drop atm. Wish you luck!

 

[gale]

Iam too starting a new tank. It's almost a month and mines isn't cycled just yet. Iam waiting for nitrites to drop atm. Wish you luck!

Did you add anything like safe start to accelerate it or are you just doing the ammonia method? I'm trying to gauge how long ours might take. 

 

[omega59]

Just ammonia. I started a post u can read it through on what's going on with my cycle if you want. It's title is, thinking of starting a tank again.