Mysterious Clownfish Disapearances

[1entra]

In the last 3weeks or so I have lost 2 clownfish... and this morning I have lost my third!

My first one completely disapeared without trace and I have never seen sign of it. My second one must have got spooked out by something several hours after lights going off as it decided to jump out of the tank and the body was found by myself in the morning.

And today I have my third clownfish and again like the first one there is absolutely no sign of where it has gone! I have searched everywhere possible in the tank (without taking it all apart!) along with all the floor space around the tank, but it seems to have completely vanished like my first one did! Although I have recently upgraded to a new bigger tank, my clownfish seemed healthy and active and was eating properly so its strange how it just disapeared

I have got no more fish in my 45G tank at present, I have however got several small coral frags along with a few hermits, snails, a serpant star and a skunk cleaner shrimp. Non of these have had any nips or cuts where they could have possibly been attacked! Nor did any of my clownfish look like anything had tried to get them before dieing! But I have lost 2 or 3 snails along with 1 of my smaller hermits... coincidence??

I have on several occasions heard soft clicking coming from inside the tank but have never actually seen the critter resposible for the sounds! You do think this could be a predatory mantis shrimp of some sort that may have attacked and killed my clownfish?

I urgently require help as I wish to get a new fish or 2 but darn't if there is something in the tank that is going about attacking and killing my stock.

So what do you people wreckon? Whats the best way to go about seeing and even capturing the potential culprit? Or am I just being paranoid and there is another explanation???

Please post all comments and advice as it is needed and appreciated!

Thank You

 

[n3ont3tra]

It could be a mantis.... Check at night with a red flashlight for anything.. Could also be some kind of crab. What color is the serpent star?

 

[1entra]

As far as I'm aware the serpant star is totally reef safe, it is leathery looking and a greyish white colour with black bands down it's arms. A few weeks ago one of my trochus snails got sucked into one of my powerhead inlets and and died, the serpant star along with about 3 or 4 hermits all got to work eating the carcas and it took them almost a day and a half to finish it between them. This to me says the serpant is a good scavenger but could not possible eat a clownfish whole especially not in such a short time period from when I last seen it to when I cam home from work and noticed it was gone!

Also just to mention all my clownfish have disapeared whilst the tank lights have been off!

Whan I first got my LR i found a right nasty brown/rusty coloured crab in it, it was really vicious and tried to attack my fingers, wern't afraid of me at all. I took it out and put it in my refugium where it is till this day! So its got me thinking what if there was another one (or more) in the tank!!! But Ive never heard or seen it clicking though?!

So say it is a predatory mantis or crab... how do I get it/ get rid of it??

 

[n3ont3tra]

Find it first.

Then try using a trap or dip the wrock in something... I forget what to dip it in, lol. I'll go check.

 

[Lynden]

If you use a trap... it must work the first time. Apparently, they do not fall for it twice.

BUT, if it was a mantis I would expect your other animals to be killed first as they seem easier targets.

 

[1entra]

Wel what else could it be? Iv had 2 mysterious fish disapearances that had completly vanished without trace and another that obviously got spooked enough to try carpet surfing!

This is doing my head in. Iv sat here beside my tank with only my computer screen lighting the room and I have not seen any sign of anything or any movement other than a few bristleworms!

Surely if its a crab or mantis big enough to attack and kill me fish, i would be able to see it moving around the tank!

what traps are failsafe to try and lure and capture a predatory crab or mantis shrimp?

 

[n3ont3tra]

Oh did you check your overflow/sump?

 

[1entra]

I aint got an overflow or sump as instead I'm using a HOB refugium system and yes that was one of the first places I checked!

 

[Lynden]

If you take an acrylic box with a sliding trap door attached to a string, bait the trap and wait for the target to enter before trapping, this should work. You can buy the traps or make them.

 

[SkiFletch]

Well, first, what it might be... If it were a mantis shrimp, those dead snails and hermits would have holes in their shells. If they don't have holes, it's probably not a mantid. Pistol shrimp can also predate on fish and make clicking noise, as can predatory crabs. IMO, best trap for these is the plastic bottle trick. Take a 2L soda bottle, chop the top off basically where its at its widest (near where it becomes a cylinder). Then cut the bottom off so that it's only say 2-3" tall. so you're left with a top, and a bottom of a bottle. Cut the neck off the bottle, and invert it and then secure it to the bottom with some plastic ties of some sort. Then, bait with some shrimp or food and put it on the sand bed near the rockwork. Crabs or shrimp will go into the trap and not be able to crawl back out.

 

[Lynden]

Pistol Shrimp would probably kill cleaner shrimp before they would kill fish, in my opinion. Are you absolutely sure the clowns aren't just dying, then being swept under the rock out of sight (or swimming there, then dying) and being eaten? This to me sounds like the most likely explanation... hitchhikers big and powerful enough to kill fish just don't arrive as much as they are generally understood to, though you could be a 'lucky' one.

Whatever it is, try not to kill it. Besides the ethical reasons many people are looking for these things and if it turned out to be a peacock mantis you could make big bucks off it's sale.

 

[1entra]

Thanks for all you input guys, all advice is highly appreciated!

I do not for defo if there is a predator in the tank at all as I personally have never seen one so it may well be that the clownfish have died for whatever reason and have been eaten by my CUC but my params have always been stable and surely a death would cause a spike in something?

My skunk cleaner shrimp, my serpant star and all my corals seem be fine, there are no visual cuts or marks that may suggest something tried to attack or eat them at all.

I wish to get some more fish for the tank asap but do not wish to suffer any more losses as one can imagine so need to be fully sure that there ain't a predator in my tank that will attack my future livestock and kill them!

After all, making a trap doesn't take much doing and if a perpertrator if caught then I can feel relieved the problem has been solved, but if nothing is found then at least I can have peace of mind correct?! Either way its a win win situation!

Anyways as I work nights I can not be home at all times to wait for a shrimp or crab to enter the trap and pull the string to trap it so unfortunately lynden I can not use your trap. The plastic bottle traps sounds more effecient for myself.

So where would be the best position to place the bottle trap? Should I lie the trap down vertically or horizontly in the sand? How about wedging it in between some LR?

What bait would work best? Would a boiled prawn do?

And finally won't having some uneaten bait in my tank cause my ammonia levels to spike?

 

[tat2life]

how long they do usually last in your tank before they die ? if it was me i would move the serpant star to a holding tank and then add a clown fish to the maintank and leave it however long it usually is before they go missing. i dont think a serpant star would have any trouble eating a clown fish to be honest. i seen some videos of them serpant stars eaitng online and they are like octopuses they kinda attack it and wrap there legs around it and pull it in within a matter on minutes. i dont know how big your star is but i would blame him myself. all you can really do is remove each culprit and add a clown fish and see what happens. or try buying bigger clowns.

 

[n3ont3tra]

Green serpent stars have been known to catch and eat fish, but no other commonly available ones, AFAIK

 

[StaniFish]

okay i have little experience on clownfish or marine fish. However you mentioned that a fish had jumped out of the tank and died, are you sure the other fish could of jumped out too? and maybe then got eaten by a pet eg. a cat or dog?