My First Loss... Clown Loach!

amatuer

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Well i am sad to report of my first fish loss since i started my obsession about 6 months ago :(

I had finally got round to getting the two fish i really wanted (Red-tailed black shark and a Clown Loach) and as soon as i have them one of the Loaches goes and dies!!

i've got about a 75litre tank, all readings are as you guys suggest on here and i do a 20-25% water change every weekend
With the following:
3 white cloud mountain minnows (although i plan to move these out)
2 neon tetras
2 rummy nose tetras
(the above 7 seem to have developed their own shoal now and go everywhere together)
2 male guppies
3 male swordtails
2 Peppered Cory's
1 red-tailed black shark
----
15
Fed on:
Flakes
Dried bloodworms
Sinking Algae flakes
Peas
Cabbage
Courgette
and now small bladder snails.

At the weekend i decided to get myself 2 Clown Loaches, mainly becasue i love the colour and reading up on the behaviour they sounded pretty cool, and thought i could afford the space in the tank especially given i was about to move my minnows out. I also have a second smaller tank which i am breading snails in so excellent i thought ready made food source for some clown loaches as well.

So off i popped to the shop and got me two lovely and colourful Clowns - Get in!!!

They hid away at first on Saturday (says on here that is normal - so i thought cool no probs). Then i kept seeing one out and about investigating much the same as my corys do (couldn't tell if it was the same one or not). Today (Tuesday) i discover one of my clowns floating at the top behind my pump.

The little fella seemed all coloured up and no white coating etc. He seems to have lost his barbles from around his mouth but that could be the other fish having a nibble?Would you guys mind having a look at these pictures and seeing if you can see anything obviously wrong with him?

Was it a case of a bad specimen from the shop (having only had him 4 days) or am i actually doing anything wrong in terms of feeding / overstocking?
Photo-0010.jpg


For anyone interested the other remaining Clown Loach is doing fine forever out and about - even saw him carry a snail off into his cave in his mouth this morning.

I'm now a bit reserved about getting another one now - or will the remaining one get lonely? (by the way i do plan to upgrade my tank size to accomodate their growth in the future)

Anyway sorry for all the questions, it would be good to hear your guys thoughts.. just a bit gutted i've killed my first fish! :(
Cheers
Matt
 
Sorry for your loss but try not to beat yourself up over this - Clown Loaches are notorious for being very sensitive, especially when moving from one tank to another. They get whitespot like it's going out of fashion, too. Hard to tell from the photo as it's a bit blurred, but could just be he was over-sensitive to the move into your tank.

By the way, he definitely was dead when you removed him, was he? Only they have a habit of hanging in a very strange way around the top of filter or thermometer - really look dead but are not. Many a time I found one or other of mine in these funny positions and thought they'd died - only to see slight movement on closer inspection.

In the end I lost both of mine to whitespot and won't bother getting any more, what with their reputation for it.

Great little fish, though, if you are able to see them through any illness. Very comical to watch.

Athena
 
I am sorry your fish died, I can't see anything in that picture, it is far too blurry. Try taking another photo with your camera set on the closeup (flower) mode.

Unfortunately a 75 litre tank is not big enough for clown loach or Red-tailed black sharks, Clown loach will grow in excess of 8" and can reach up to 12" and the RTBS will grow to around 5", possibly becoming extremely agressive.

You may also find that a RTBS is a very bad tankmate for clown loach, with their torpedo shaped body and bright red tail fin they will look just like another RTBS, which could be why your clown loach died, he may have been killed by your RTBS when you werent looking.
 
thanks for your replies guys,

Sorry didn't realise how poor that photo was, i'll try this one:
Photo-0011.jpg


Athena, i did give him a bit of a nudge with the net handle before i removed him and he just floated about with no movement.

There doesn't appear to be any white marks on him at all which i was worried about having heard about their reputation - maybe i'll see how this one goes on before i get him a friend again - hope he doesn't get too lonely!

maximinimus, At the minute the RTBS is about 1.5 inch and the loaches were about an inch - i had got plans on getting like a 4ft tank for them in the future. Thank you for your advice re: poor tank mates i had been reading up in other areas that said they went well together but maybe the RTBS had had a go at him in the night or something - although at the minute he seems very friendly and follows my peppered cory everywhere :)

Thanks for your thoughts guys, anything else let me know.
matt
 
Much better picture, from the looks he is in very poor shape, extremely thin. It could be the reason he died, but I can't say for sure.

RTBS generally are friendly when they are small, a friend of mine had a 260l tank with 4 clown loach and a RTBS, when the RTBS reached around 4" he was finding a clown loach dead every couple of days, he couldnt explain it at all. A few weeks after losing them he bought some new ones. Because he left the light off that day he could see what was happening, the rtbs was mercilessly attacking the clown loach.

Just something to be aware of, as it may cause problems down the line.
 
Well, it doesn't look like he's been attacked - his colour is faded but then that could just be cos he's dead (or had he faded prior to his death?) Did it look like a thin whitish film over him?

He also looks a bit malnourished - it could be that this fish had suffered white spot at the LFS and been treated for it but never quite recovered. It's very common for this to happen. Add to that the stress of being moved into your tank and it could just have been too much for the little guy.

Athena

ps - Re your RTBS I have one of these and he has been one of the most peaceful fish in the tank! He was first in with two severums, female betta, rainbow shark, 2 clown loaches and 2 ADFs. Was as good as gold in there. After some re-shuffling (to get him away from the Rainbow Shark) he is now in a tank with a sailfin molly, two platys and a bunch of fry - not bothering any of them and keeps himself to himself. So, they are not always aggressive. You will soon notice if yours is compatible with your other fish, just by watching his behaviour daily. My Rainbow Shark is a total bully - whereas the RTBS is a real softie.
 
sorry abou your loss i lost one of my clown loaches about 3 months ago i was gutted we had owned him for a while he was about 4 inches long and his clown loach butty misses him. I lost mine to internal bacteria (what a bummer it was) but we got more but they dont bother much withthe older one, Has for a red tailed black shark with a clown loach mine are best of butties since i lost my other clown loach they seem to have become friends both being about 4-5 inches long and fingers crossed my shark has never shown any signs of attacking any fish but all fish are different and it obvousily goes on your size of tank and hiding places for them, dont be to put off by losing the fish i would wait until you have a bigger tank then get yourself another clown loach.
 
He is EXTREMELY skinny. There is a strong possibility he has internal parasites, which are also common on loaches, or was starved for a long period. That is the likely culprit.
 
I agree with Loachman - his belly looks pinched. Either internal parasites or not eating (which itself could be a symptom of something). Does the other loach or any of your other fish have the same look to them?
 
Youve been warned the RTBS can seem VERY peaceful one day, and murderous the next. Dont think your the one exception.
 
Thanks for all your replies guys.

The skininess (is that a word?) was something that i was concerned about when i first brought them home - however i am happy to report that the remaining clown is actually starting to fatten out a bit now. Here's hoping it was just the lack of feed at the lfs or that he has now recovered from white spot.

I will take all your wise words on board re: a larger tank very soon - hey it sounds like a good excuse to me :)

Cheers
Matt
 
6ft (100g/400l) tank is conciderd about right for a clown loaches :) If you cant go that big, id suggest returning it to the lfs soon as. If you can go that big and do so within a short period of time, you'll need to get it some friends :) C Loach do well in groups.
 
Yes- the absolute bare minimum for most loaches, especially clowns is 3 and 5 or more is bestter. They don't really belong in a tank that small. these are very long lived fish that will get pretty big- 20 years and 12 inches +.

They are virtually all wild caught or else pond raised in asia using hormones to induce spawning. There are almost no documented cases of their spawming in tanks. As a result it is also common that they come in with internal parasites the symptoms of which are wasting- and sunken belly. If not treated they will die from this. In the states we often use food treated with metronidazome. I don't know what is available in the UK.

I have a group of 6 in a 75 gal. - about 284 liters and they have outgrown it and I am looking to upgrade them to a 180 gal- 680 liters. Mine range in age from about 4 to 9 years and from 4 to close to 9 inches total length. They have been together for a number of years which is why they lasted so long in the 75 despite the tank becoming too small.

For your tank I would strongly suggest you try to locate the Yasuhikotakia sidthimunki aka dwarf chain loach, they stay small, under about 2 inches, are very active all over a tank and love to play. They are a very entertaining loach and will eat the heck out of small snails. You could have a group of about 5 in your tank.
 
In my 6 foot tank, I used to have 2 clown loach and rarely ever saw them; I then raised their numbers to 5 and since then they have been constantly active and are always swimming around the front of the tank. There is also a RTBS in with them. The biggest clown loach and the RTBS occasionally have a bit of a scrap but neither of them get injured and it's normally resolved fairly quickly, (the biggest clown is about the same size as the RTBS).

Aaron
 

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