My first aquarium (Fish, Water, and Feeding)

[TLB1994]

Hello,

I just recently started my tank and I have a Veiltail Betta and a Cory Catfish and I am now down to 1 Black Neon Tetra.

Starting out, I went to bring my fish home and they put my Cory and (then) 5 Black Neon Tetras in a bag together for me to take home. I thought this was odd and wondered why they didn’t bag the Cory separately but thought maybe this was how it was to be done.

I took them home and placed all of them in the tank to float. My Cory pretty much spazzed out the entire time he was in the bag and freaked the tetras out and two of them died from stress before I could even get them into their new home.

My tetras are impossible to get to eat. I don’t know if they are too nervous or freaked out but they haven’t been responding to food. My Betta does just fine and swims up to the top of the tank for food when he sees me coming.

I am down 2 more tetras and I believe my Cory is either sneaking up on them and eating them in the middle of the night or they are dying because they aren’t eating and he’s eating them after. Anyways, I can’t get my Cory to eat any of his actual food that is still sittting at the bottom of the tank. I’m worried about the Ammonia levels spiking due to the uneaten food and btw I have removed the bodies of the dead fish. One was bones and the other had just died and I got him out soon after. How do I get my Cory to eat his actual Food ?

 

[fluttermoth]

Fish can easily go for two weeks without food, so it's very unlikely that your fish are starving; corydoras are very, very peaceful and, while they might eat a fish that is already dead, they will not kill other fish.

Your problem is almost certainly your water. If you didn't 'cycle' your tank, by adding liquid ammonia before you added fish, then it will be a build up of toxic ammonia and/or nitrite that is killing your fish, and the ammonia comes from the fish's wastes, as well as from uneaten food.

You need to change nearly all the water (leave just enough for the fish to swim upright; don't forget to switch your filter and heater off first!), every day (making sure the new water is warmed and dechlorinated), until you can get test kits of your own and can properly monitor the water.

How big is your tank? In the long term, your cory needs at least five friends as they are shoaling fish, like tetras. It often happens that shoaling fish on their own don't have the confidence to come out and feed, but it's not a good idea to add any fish yet, and we need to make sure your tank is big enough.

 

[Byron]

We also need to know the size of your aquarium; volume and also dimensions. You may or may not have sufficient space for all of these fish in suitable numbers. There is also the issue of the Betta which should not be kept with other fish.

Welcome to TFF.

 

[TLB1994]

Fish can easily go for two weeks without food, so it's very unlikely that your fish are starving; corydoras are very, very peaceful and, while they might eat a fish that is already dead, they will not kill other fish.

Your problem is almost certainly your water. If you didn't 'cycle' your tank, by adding liquid ammonia before you added fish, then it will be a build up of toxic ammonia and/or nitrite that is killing your fish, and the ammonia comes from the fish's wastes, as well as from uneaten food.

You need to change nearly all the water (leave just enough for the fish to swim upright; don't forget to switch your filter and heater off first!), every day (making sure the new water is warmed and dechlorinated), until you can get test kits of your own and can properly monitor the water.

How big is your tank? In the long term, your cory needs at least five friends as they are shoaling fish, like tetras. It often happens that shoaling fish on their own don't have the confidence to come out and feed, but it's not a good idea to add any fish yet, and we need to make sure your tank is big enough.

Hanks for

 

[TLB1994]

Thanks for the reply. I really appreciated. I didn’t put anything about water quality in this thread because I see there is a whole other thread for that and wanted to stay on topic.

My tank was dechlorinated for 24 hours which then after I added Tetra Safestart and cycled for about 5 days before adding fish. I was recommended at least 3 for this particular bacteria supplement.

I have a Test kit and tested 2 days ago. My ph is at a 7.6 (I have read the ideal is 7). Nitrate and Nitrite are at 0 and my Ammonia Level is at 0.25 ppm which isn’t ideal by from what I read not out of control either.

I will look into some more tank mates for him. Again, thanks so much!!! Anymore info you can give me from what I’ve written here will be greatly appreciated...

 

[TLB1994]

We also need to know the size of your aquarium; volume and also dimensions. You may or may not have sufficient space for all of these fish in suitable numbers. There is also the issue of the Betta which should not be kept with other fish.

Hi, my tank is 20 in L x 10.1 in W x 12.8 in H. I annoyed a bunch of different employees at Pet stores and they all assured me tetras were okay to love with Bettas and advised me against Neons as their vibrant coloring alone could agitate the Betta. I do have a filter and heater as well. My Betta seems perfectly fine within the tank and I have heavily planted the tank as well and include a bunch of hides as well.

Welcome to TFF.

 

[Byron]

OK, you have a standard 10 gallon (38 liter) aquarium. The Betta, alone, will be fine. I am assuming it is a male. Please do not have other fish with him; this is asking for trouble, either from the Betta or the other fish nipping his fins. A group of cories might work from this aspect, but a 10g is not much space. But certainly no tetras or upper level fish.

The cory must have tankmates of his own species or he will be so stressed he will succumb to other problems and may die prematurely. At least five of the species. I don't know the species you have, so I do not like to suggest acquiring more, but he cannot be alone.

One thing you will quickly learn in this hobby is to question any advice from fish store employees. If the store is an independent and owned and staffed by hobbyists, it can be more reliable. Always, always check with experienced aquarists like those on this forum. It can save a lot of grief.

On the cycling issue, you should be OK with the SafeStart. So no problems there, fortunately.

 

[IHaveADogToo]

Your tank is NOT cycled. When a tank cycles, first ammonia rises, then as nitrites rise ammonia drops, then as nitrates rise nitrites drop. The fact you are getting an ammonia reading of .25 and a your nitrite and nitrate readings are both 0 tells us that the cycle has not occurred yet. Letting the tank run for a week is not cycling it. The water looking clear does not mean the tank is cycled. The ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate readings are the only things that will tell you when it's completely cycled.

Not to worry, as you said, this is your first tank. I think not cycling your first tank is something a LOT of fish hobbyists did. We all have to learn lessons, sometimes. And that seems like a lesson we all learn the hard way.

Your fish will survive in a non-cycled tank. But they will not thrive. You need to do a lot of extra work to make sure they survive the cycle happy and healthy. That means daily water changes, to deal with the ammonia, since you don't have a bacteria colony to deal with that for you.

Without fish in the tank, a tank could take 4-6 weeks to fully cycle and establish a good bacteria colony. With fish in the tank during the cycle, you have to change the water a lot more often. And that means the cycle will take even longer to complete. Probably closer to 8 weeks. This is the price of cycling the tank while fish are in it.

Based on your posts here, there are 2 products that you absolutely need to buy. Prime water conditioner, and a gravel vac. There are all different brands and types of water conditioners out there. I know you have some water conditioner already. But the reason I suggest Prime is because, not only does it remove chlorine/chloramine from the water, but it also suppresses ammonia and nitrites for up to 48 hours. Since your tank didn't get to fully cycle, these toxins are indeed going to be present in your water, and may even spike at times. Doing frequent water changes with prime will help keep those toxins in check. Also, a gravel vac, because you said there is a lot of debris and decaying food on the substrate. It really is so much easier to use a gravel vac for water changes than any other method, as it drains the tank without having to move the tank. I know that disturbing the gravel can sometimes cause an even bigger mess, and that's where a gravel vac really shines. When using a gravel vac, don't stick it down into the gravel, hold it just above the gravel. This will suck the gunk off the gravel without actually picking the gravel up and stirring debris around in the tank. Just point the vac at every piece of debris you see and it will grab it, all while draining the tank of old water. When adding new water, make sure you treat it with Prime first, then pour it into the tank in a way that doesn't stir up the gravel. I pour the water onto a large rock in my tank, as to not disturb and stir the gravel.

That said, you do have a good compatible mix of fish. Neon Tetras (even the regular ones, not just the black ones) are great tank mates for Betta fish, and so are Corydoras. Provided you have enough room. The dimensions of your tank work out to be a 10 gallon (US) tank. 5 gallons is good for a single betta with no tank mates. 10 gallons is a good minimum size for a betta with maybe snails or shrimp as tank mates, as long as it's not overcrowded. The problem is, your corydoras and your tetras are both shoaling fish that each need to be in groups of at least 5 or 6. So, in order for you to house a shoal of each, and a betta, you would need a larger tank. Right now your tank is not overcrowded, but you are not keeping the minimum numbers of either shoaling species, and bringing them up to the minimum numbers overstocks your tank. If you want to keep corys and neons and a betta together, with how many neons and corys you need for them to be happy, you really need to have at least a 15 gallon tank, 20 gallons would be ideal.

Why isn't your corydora eating? Well, he could be depressed and lonely, from not having a shoal. OR, it could be what you're feeding him. Are you feeding one kind of food to all of the fish in the tank? Because corydoras like sinking food, neon tetras like flakes, and bettas like meaty food that floats, like pellets. So you have 3 different species that all have different eating habits and dietary needs/preferences. You can't just put one type of food in and expect everyone to eat it. If you put flakes in, the tetra will eat it, but the cory won't. If you put sinking food in, the cory will eat it, but the tetras won't. You won't find a food they'll both eat, except maybe frozen or live food. I have a community tank with neons and corys in it, as well as several other species, and I have to feed 4 different types of food to the tank to make sure everyone eats.

 

[Byron]

While I do not disagree with the above post (#8) respecting the cycling, it is advocating something that is not necessary in this case. SafeStart is a very reliable product, developed by Dr. Tim Hovanec who is a scientist with enormous practical experience in the field. He identified (1998) the species of bacteria responsible for the nitrification cycle in freshwater, correcting our previous understanding. As the OP has this and used it, I wold seriously doubt nitrite will appear at all. The ammonia may be from chloramine in the tap water, or from the Safe Start. In any event, with live plants and only one or two fish, there would be no problem even without the SafeStart.

Second, tetras should never be combined with a male Betta. Betta are not community fish. I have seen male Betta easily eat neon tetras, and I have seen neons and other tetra enjoy nipping the fins of sedate fish like Betta. If you care about your fish, you will never combine these.

I do agree the Betta alone (thinking fish here) in the 10g is OK. But in a larger tank like a 20g, the Betta cannot be combined with other upper fish. I know some will suggest it can work, but this is the exception not the norm, and with fish being living creatures we should be responsible and assume the fish will be normal, not abnormal, and not risk things.

 

[Colin_T]

Corydoras and other catfishes should always be bagged separately to other fishes. The black neons (Hyphessobrycon herbertaxelrodi) probably got spiked by the cory when you were taking them home. After things have settled down and if you want to get more catfish, make sure the shop puts the catfish in 1 bag, and any other fishes in another bag. You can bag the Corydoras together but don't bag them with other fish.

Watch the people catching the fish. If they are chasing the fish around the tank and it takes more than 20seconds to catch a fish, then you probably don't want those fish because the more they get chased, the more they stress and the more chance of them dying on the way home. Someone who is good at catching fish in an aquarium should use 2 nets and catch the fish in a matter of seconds by using 1 net to carefully guide the fish into the second net.

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Corydoras do not hunt and kill fish, so if the black neons are dying then it is either a water quality issue or a disease. The catfish will eat dead fish that sink to the bottom so if the black neons die, the Corydoras will eat part of them, and so will your Betta.

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If the tetras are not eating and the catfish is stressing out there is a water quality issue. Take a glass full of tank water to the petshop and have them test the water for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, pH, and general hardness (GH). Write the results down (we want numbers for the water sample). You could also take a sample of the tap water with you and have that tested too. Again we want numbers.

Make sure you use a fish only bucket when you do work on the tank. Do not use the fish only bucket for anything except fish. Make sure you don't have any moisturising cream, grease, oil, perfume, deodorant, or anything else on your hands/ arms when feeding the fish or working on their tank.

If the fish are still acting nervous and not eating after a few days, do a 75% water change and gravel clean the substrate. Make sure any new water is free of chlorine/ chloramine before it is added tot he tank. Try to aerate the tap water for 30 minutes or so before adding it to the tank. This allows dechlorinator time to come in contact with all the chlorine/ chloramine molecules in the water, and it allows gasses to stabilise in the water.

 

[IHaveADogToo]

Understood, @Byron. I was speaking from my own experience, as this is currently working for me with female bettas in a 30 gallon with neons and corys. Regardless of our opinions on bettas, we both agree @TLB1994's tank is too small to accommodate shoaling community fish. We do agree that the Betta would rather have that 10 gallon to himself. I say maybe with a nerite snail or a pair of ghost shrimp as tank mates, at most. And those shoaling fish should be kept in shoals in a larger tank. To be clear, I believe bettas can work as community fish when certain requirements are met, but I also believe attempting it with 10 gallons does not meet those requirements, and is setting yourself up for failure. Bettas do coexist with other creatures and other fish in the wild. But they also don't live in 10 gallon aquariums in the wild, and so when keeping them confined to such a space, it is best to keep them in solitude.

I meant no disrespect to SafeStart or it's creator. I only suggested using Prime instead because the tank is just starting it's cycle, and ammonia and nitrites may both spike in the coming weeks. Prime is a good product to have when that happens, as it temporarily neutralizes both ammonia and nitrites. To my knowledge, it is the only product that does this. If you've had great success with SafeStart, though, I understand. I haven't used it, so, again, I'm only speaking from my own experience. None-the-less, I am happy to see the OP using a water conditioner, even if we are suggesting different brands. Far too many first time fish owners just use straight tap water.

@TLB1994, I do suggest you remove all fish except the betta from the 10 gallon tank, and give him lots of plants and rocks and ornaments to keep him occupied. Bettas are surprisingly intelligent, and the more things you put in his tank for him to interact with, the happier he'll be. If you think he's lonely, you can try a nerite snail or a pair of ghost shrimp as tank mates, but observe his behavior closely as even this could be risky, depending on the betta. As for the cory and the tetra, keeping them as they are now is not advised. It's probably best to return them to the pet store. If you got them at PetSmart or Petco, there is a 14 day return policy on fish. If you have a friend that keeps fish, maybe your friend will take them off your hands, if you can't bring yourself to return the fish to the pet store. If you really want to keep the cory and the tetra, you will need to get another tank, of at least 20 gallons, and get more of each species. But, that is another tank that has to cycle with fish in it. That is another tank to do water changes on, daily water changes during the cycle. When you're already dealing with that with your 10 gallon tank. I'm not saying you can't do it, I just want you to be prepared for what doing that would look like. Probably more work than you had in mind when you bought a bag full of fish from the pet store. There is no shame in returning fish to the store. Sometimes things just don't work out the way we thought they would. That's okay. Maybe the next person to buy that fish will buy 20 friends for him, too, and put them all in a 55 gallon tank.

 

[seangee]

It sounds like the main issues here are water quality and / or stress from not being in groups. But you should know:

Corydoras won't rush at the food in that way that tetras or betta do. They sift fthrough the substrate for food. The usual advice to feed what they can eat in x minutes (some say 5, some say 2, I personally use 1) does not apply to Corys as they are slow feeders. I expect there to be no visible food in my tank after 2 hours when feeding my Corys. As @IHaveADogToo says they do prefer different food.

I feed New Life Spectrum micro pellets as my staple food. These float for a short time and then sink. My tetras love these and I feed enough that there is some left for the Corys, its trial and error getting the amount right and as always you have to be careful not to overfeed. On the plus side it is a high quality food that contains no fillers - so is better for water quality. I do also feed pellets and wafers designed for bottom feeders. These dissolve slowly to allow more time for feeding.

 

[Byron]

Understood, @Byron. I was speaking from my own experience, as this is currently working for me with female bettas in a 30 gallon with neons and corys.

Female bettas (as in a sorority) is a very different thing from a male Betta, which I specifically mentioned. A male is a solitary fish.

Bettas do coexist with other creatures and other fish in the wild. But they also don't live in 10 gallon aquariums in the wild, and so when keeping them confined to such a space, it is best to keep them in solitude.

Bettas and other fish in the wild is questionable. SE Asia is not my field of particular expertise, but I would suggest it is unlikely they live in close confines with other species. But even if they do, with commercially raised male Bettas we are dealing with a fish that has been bred specifically to be nasty and fight. This makes quite a difference. But from the perspective of the tetras, your comment on the tank size is very relevant. All characins have teeth, and they will use them; when even normally peaceful species are placed in close confines with a sedate fish with flowing fins, the temptation to nip fins is very strong. We are agreeing, but for the sake of educating others who may wonder, I thought it best to sort this out.

EDIT: Forgot to mention earlier, I agree on the Prime as the conditioner in new tanks. Once the tank is cycled, I would not continue with Prime but change to something less "invasive." But during cycling or initially, it will detoxify ammonia and nitrite though only temporarily (24-36 hours).

 

[Colin_T]

Wild Bettas live in shallow pools or very slow moving creeks and set up territories a couple of feet apart. As the creeks dry up the fish are left in mud puddles and use their labyrinth organ to breath. The short finned males are kept for fighting whereas the long finned varieties are for show. Some of the breeders of long finned fish try to breed for a peaceful nature but others breed specifically for aggression.

Male Betta splendens are naturally aggressive and fight over territory, but lots of other Betta species are peaceful. The male Siamese Fighting fish we buy in the shops are a hybrid between Betta splendens and Betta imbellis and was made 50+ years ago.