My Black Molly Laying On The Tank Floor

[bb1991]

I know u guys will ask for my aquarium specs before getting into the real problems so let me save u he trouble. Here's everything i see in my tank.
Length = 30cm
Height = 33.5 cm
Width = 30cm
From these dimensions it is a 30 litre tank
- I have a bit of soil in my tank with a small layer of something like volcanic rocks (like coal, cleans the water) that reaches about 5 cm high. The soil is for the plants i have in the tank, there are quite a few plants in my tank. Not fully covered but i would say that if you saw my tank, there's definitely green in my tank but not too much that the plants will compete for space.
- I have an awesome filter that i'm proud of, washed the filters in hot water recently and also added ceramic rings into the filter for bacteria cultivation.
- I bought my fish about 2 days ago, but i left my tank running with everything setup including the plants for a week to hopefully stabilize the small ecosystem. (Didn't use chlorine killer because i heard leaving tap water out in the sun for a day is better than using any chemicals)
- I don't put any salt in, cuz i heard from the shopkeeper that the soil in the tank would try to neutralize the pH or sumthin can't really remember. But basically putting salt in would be like not putting salt cuz of the soil.
- Here are the fish i have:
- 2 Mollys : 1 Black 1 Orange
- 31 Cardinal Tetras (They're very small, the shopkeeper said about 1 month of age)
- 2 dwarf sucker fishes that won't grow larger than 2.5 cm
- 7 dwarf cherry shimps that won't grow larger than 1.5 cm
- 1 yamamoto (i think) shrimp that are about 3 cm in size but won't eat the fish (no claws)
- 2 fish that are roughly the same size as the cardinals (abt 2 cm) but has something like a black hatchet on its side, and is sort of orange
- 3 fish that have pectoral fins that grow to the top of the fish instead of along its side. (about 1.5 cm in size but will grow to 3cm maybe)

- I just changed the water (20% of tank) yesterday without using any chlorine killer (left the water out for a day) and just remembered i will be adding bacteria powder thingee that helps cultivate friendly/helpful bacteria in the tank. (I added some already in the beginning when letting the tank stabilize for a week.)

So here's the problem. I know you're not supposed to have a favorite just like with your children, but i have to admit i love my black molly the most, even the shopkeeper hated black mollies cuz the don't sell well. But today i woke up and instead of finding it swimming around the rim on the tip of tank like a potbelly it is; it is on the tank floor with only its gills moving. (I actually thought it died, and when i tried to net it out, it freaked and swam to another place to lay down.) I've never tested my water quality i truly don't know how because i always thought the kit was a waste of money if i generally took care of the tank well. But i'm starting to think that if i invested this much in everything, i should spend a little more for the safety of the fish. I need help...Please tell me what to do and what should i get for my black molly and the safety of my fish in the future.(Especially what kind of kit i should get to test #105### out, like water, chemicals, etc.) As im just about to finish typing, i saw my black molly swimming to the top, but then dropped down to the floor like a weight. IS IT TIRED?! IS THE WATER HEAVY?!! I NEED HELP SOMEBODY TELL ME #136### IS GOING ON PLEASE!!!!

PS: Sorry panicked abit there, but i forget to tell u guys that i feed my fish twice a day but just enough. Just enough that every fish get atleast 1 flake and just enough that there is none leftover, if there was i would scoop it out. Oh and BTW, yesterday night i put 3 drops (1 per 10 litre) of white spot medicine cuz 2-3 cardinals having early signs of it. No signs of the white spots now.

 

[turtlegirl]

You added all those at once?? You probably have a huge spike of ammonia due to the tank not being filtered. Do a large (50%~) water change.

 

[alistairw]

That tank is 30 litres? You seem to be incredibly over stocked for that.

As turtle girl has said, I think you have an ammonia spike. I would do a massive water change now, 90%, to get your ammonia levels? Knowing your water stats is certainly not a waste of time. That is the only way to know if your tank is cycling ammonia to nitrite and then nitrate. If you want to keep fish, you need to get a liquid based test kit such as API master test kit. You have no idea of your water chemistry without being able to test it. This will also include ph which will help tell you what fish you can keep. You should also know your water hardness.

You need to read the beginners section on here, especially fish less and fish in cycling. It will also tell you the effects of ammonia and nitrite on your fish - essentially, it will kill them.

You really need to take all those fish back to your lfs. That is a huge amount to add to an un-cycled tank. By cycled, I mean all the bacteria is established in your filter media that can process ammonia through the nitrogen cycle to the end product of nitrate (not to be confused with nitrite). It can take a number of weeks to cycle a tank.

I would also use a dechlorinater. Although leaving a bucket out in the sun will get rid of some of the chlorine, how do you know all has gone. Also you are risking contamination from other things that could greatly effect the health of your fish. Best thing to do is add temperature matched water that has been dechlorinated.

When you rinse your filter media, please only use some symphoned off tank water otherwise any bacteria you do have will be killed. Hot water will kill them as will any chlorine.

I think you have been very badly advised by your lfs shop and they should never have sold you that many fish for a brand new 30 litre. I have 10 cardinals in a 90 litre!!!

Do a water change, take those fish back (unless they have died) and PLEASE read the beginners section.

Sorry to frighten you, but you need to take action now!

 

[bb1991]

Wait I'm confused, a 30 litre tank should be able to hold atleast 30 cardinals. I mean 20 of them seem already very little. How can 10 cardinals be visible in a 90 litre tank. And also i don't really understand the "tank not being filtered". This has nothing to do with the filter I have right?...because the filter i have is actually meant for a tank larger than mine. = good filter...plus ceramic rings i put in yesterday plus bacteria powder that i put in a week ago to let friendly bacteria cultivate...Also shouldn't the 5cm soil have an effect on the ammonia and the pH levels?...like decrease it a little?

Just to clarify...30 litres way too small? Cuz my fren said my tank is fine with the amount i have as long as i change the water(about 20%) every week along with adding a teeny bit of salt and the bacteria powder.

 

[phoenixgsd]

Wait I'm confused, a 30 litre tank should be able to hold atleast 30 cardinals. I mean 20 of them seem already very little. How can 10 cardinals be visible in a 90 litre tank. And also i don't really understand the "tank not being filtered". This has nothing to do with the filter I have right?...because the filter i have is actually meant for a tank larger than mine. = good filter...plus ceramic rings i put in yesterday plus bacteria powder that i put in a week ago to let friendly bacteria cultivate...Also shouldn't the 5cm soil have an effect on the ammonia and the pH levels?...like decrease it a little?

Just to clarify...30 litres way too small? Cuz my fren said my tank is fine with the amount i have as long as i change the water(about 20%) every week along with adding a teeny bit of salt and the bacteria powder.

you have been seriously misinformed by your local shopkeeper have a read here http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/277264-beginners-resource-center/ this will tell you all you need to know about cycling your filter, 30Lt is suitable for maybe 8-10 small fish max, you need to return either all the fish and do a fishless cycle or keep a few a do a fish in cycle which requires alot of daily maintenence to keep your fish alive, 50% water changes every day, which is why fishless cycling is mostly recomended
also you dont need to add salt or bacteria powder to your tank, save your money, you only need temperature matched dechlorinated water

 

[bb1991]

Ok, after witnessing my black molly suffering and what looks like inevitability, i believe i have made a huge mistake. And because even though PETA is f'in annoying to me, i think i have crossed the line. I have read through the guides you gave me and i guess i gotta right my wrongings. Man this is going to be difficult for me. Anyways, since i have quite few plants (plus i small moss like plant i layed on the soil floor). can i keep the shrimps? they look effin awesome on the moss-like plant..I'll probably take 20 tetras out so that leaves me less than 20 fish. Is that ok?

 

[turtlegirl]

Ok, after witnessing my black molly suffering and what looks like inevitability, i believe i have made a huge mistake. And because even though PETA is f'in annoying to me, i think i have crossed the line. I have read through the guides you gave me and i guess i gotta right my wrongings. Man this is going to be difficult for me. Anyways, since i have quite few plants (plus i small moss like plant i layed on the soil floor). can i keep the shrimps? they look effin awesome on the moss-like plant..I'll probably take 20 tetras out so that leaves me less than 20 fish. Is that ok?

No, "less than 20 fish" is too many for a brand new tank. I would take all but 3-4 back and then and ONLY then, after you've fully cycled your tank (test it often) add maybe 4 more fish. It is plain mean to keep fish in an overcrowded tank.

Get some dechlorinator and do a huge water change as suggested above, if you haven't already. What kind/size filter do you have? You have to be careful with shrimp and very small fish not getting sucked into the filter, assuming its an HOB type.

There is absolutely no harm in keeping your plants while you cycle your tank.

Also, do your research on shrimp as they need to be cared for differently from tropical fish. I believe they require a heavily planted tank for hiding, etc and a brand new tank generally cannot support that unless you've spent a fortune on live plants. Most shrimps I know of will grow to be around 5cm. (Someone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong on this)
ETA: I did a quick search on shrimp and they can not be kept in an uncycled tank from what I read.

I believe your "dwarf suckers" are probably oto's in which case they can get bigger than 4cm and prefer to live in groups of 3 or more.

Please post water test results ASAP for us to help you with that. My recommendation would be to take everything back to your LFS and grab a master test kit like suggested post what your results are and we can help you with what will work best with your water as some fish have requirements that others don't for water conditions.

 

[alistairw]

I agree with Turtlegirl again, take the lot back to your LFS, buy a bottle of pure ammonia from a hardware store and do a fishless cycle. It will save you a great deal of hassle than trying to do a fish in cycle.....believe me, I have done one. You will have weeks ofydoing 90% water changes once, sometimes twice a day, every day for weeks, to keep your ammonia at 0ppm. Do not underestimate what ammonia will do to you fish. I think there is a calculator somewhere in the beginners section to tell you how much ammonia to add.

Do you know anybody that has mature filter media? You could ask them for some to seed tour filter, kickstarting the process. This should save you a couple of weeks and in the mean time, you can do some research into the fish that you can put in your tank, based on the tank size and water parameters.

The cardinal tetras you have are schooling fish and need to be kept in groups of at least 6. I know you have 31 which is great for a 200lt tank, but not a 30litre...there is just not enough room for them, especially with other fish and shrimp. The thing about small tanks like yours is that things can quickly get out of control because you have less water to diffuse the ammonia etc.

How have you worked out the number of fish that can fit into your tank? Remember, any calculations you do need to be based on there full grown size. It doesn't matter that they are small now...they won't be for long. For example, the CT can reach a max of 3 or 4 cm!! You have 124cm of CT alone in a tank which is 30cm accross!! Have a search in the forum for calculating numbers of fish in a tank. You should probably only have between 5 and 10 max of small fish.

As TG says, please post your water test results on here so we can advise. You have done the right thing by coming on here. We have all been in there!

 

[allan078]

The number of fish you have for a 30 litre tank is far too many. I don't know how they can even move in that! 30 litres? I'd say 6-10 fish at the very most. Not before you have had it running for a minimum of 2 weeks, doing regular water changes throughout.

Just because your filter is for a bigger tank than the one you have, doesn't mean it's doing any good whatsoever unless it is cycled.