My 64 Litre Tank Wish List

[JezTaylor]

Hi all,
 
Completely new to the forum and to the hobby. I set up my tank on Saturday and looking forward to getting my first fish soon (my local store recommended starting with Neon Tetras as a first fish).
 
Of course, at this stage it's all very exciting and I'm getting ahead of myself by thinking what my tank will look like in a few months time. I know it's not the important thing right now, but I'd love some thoughts as to which fish to get as 64 litres isn't exactly the biggest tank!
 
After a bit of research, my initial thoughts look something like this:

• 6 Neon Tetras
• 2 or 3 Platies
• 2 Guppies or 1 Siamese Fighter
• 1 Male Gourami

I'd also like a couple to occupy the lower part of the tank, but it looks like Cory’s and Dwarf Pleco’s prefer bigger groups. Are there any other options? I guess even shrimp would work.
 
Your feedback would be very much appreciated!
 
Jez

 

[ReddSamurai]

i wouldnt go for neons first... if anything go for the platies first, other than how are you cycling the tank...a lot of pet shops suggest a fish in cycle, but a lot of people here including me suggest doing a fishless cycle which is longer but better...far better in the long run

 

[zoopkamol]

+1 ReddSam on fishless cycle. takes time but no fish suffer.
 
Platties great first fish. or tiger barbs(my favorite) nice in a good size shoal.
 
tank size will limit number and type of fish but theres hundreds of fish that work in smaller tanks.
 
once again go fishless cycle please and good luck with your tank.
you will always remember your 1st tank.....
and you will more than likely get another and another and.....its very addictive.

 

[TallTree01]

I agree with the comments regarding fishless cycle. I'm not sure I would trust a gourami with betta. You should choose one or the other. 
Zoopkamol - I don't think that tigers would be happy in a 64 liter tbh. A betta with platies could be a bad idea also. I think that a betta with 6-7 neons and shrimps would be nice. 

 
Welcome to the addiction hobby.

 

 

[JezTaylor]

Thank you all for the welcome. I can well imagine this being the first tank of many, though I could do with a slightly larger flat before getting a slightly larger tank!
 
I'm pleased that I wasn't met with cries of "that's way too many fish" as I've seen in other discussions. The temptation to start talking about angels and so on is hard to resist.
 
Thanks for the advice about the betta TallTree01, perhaps I should go with a couple of guppies instead. Do you think they'd be ok with neons, a couple of platies and a gourami, or is the gourami taking it too far?
 
Also appreciate the advice about the cycle. Despite having a good reputation, my local store suggested that most tanks are ok within 48 hours. I was planning on leaving it for a week, but perhaps I should give it a bit longer. 

 

[ReddSamurai]

if its any use ill try describe the cycle and the reasoning for fishless cycle(for my first tank i did a fish in cycle and regret it as i still  get nitrite spikes).
 
but basically fish produce waste...ammonia which then you have bacteria that breaks that down into nitrite and then more bacteria that break that down into nitrate.
 
the bacteria needs time to reproduce to be able to break down the waste.
 
with fishless cycle you put some form of ammonia in the tank to simulate fish waste and wait for that to go down which means there is enough bacteria to break the ammonia down, then the second stage the nitrite increases and will start to slowly decrease once bacteria to break that down has been established and once that disappears, your nitrate will go up but that's less harmful to fish than ammonia and nitrite, but once this happens your tank is fully cycled and you can put fish in.
 
with a fish in cycle you are using the fish instead of the ammonia mentioned above to cycle the tank, so when the ammonia builds up their wont be sufficient bacteria to break that ammonia down quick enough which will cause a ammonia spike and cause damage to the fish long term, once you get past that you have a build up of nitrite which wont have established bacteria to break that down so it will be harming the fish long term again.
 
i could be wrong but this is how i understood it, and with the nitrate the only way to get rid of that is by water changes and live plants.
 
i have no idea if this is of any use to you but good luck

 

[zoopkamol]

ReddSam i think you pretty much hit the nail on the head.
I think we all did the fish in cycle or know someone that has done it.
why make fish suffer when you can do w/o fish.
some tanks take a week or bit more and others can take 4-6 weeks
but in long run its worth the wait. As you wait for cycling to complete do some research on fish interested in.
You would be surprised with little research you will find

  you never though about.
 
wish you luck with tank.

and

  to forum

 

[JezTaylor]

Thanks all! You'll be pleased to hear that the tank is still fishless and I've ordered my test kit. I've also added a couple of plants in the hope that it will get things going.

In the meantime, I'm still busy researching what fish I could end up with. I'm very keen to get a couple of bottom dwellers, but with some of the other fish I want I wouldn't be able to accommodate the 4 or 5 I'd need to keep Cory's or Drawf Pleco's happy. Does anybody have a suggestions for any that would work well in a pair?

 

[the_lock_man]

I would go further than TallTree, in that Gouramis and Siamese Fighters are conspecific - it's a case of "when" they attack each other, not "if".
 
Guppies are an odd one, really, they don't need to be in groups the way shoaling fish do, but they are very boisterous fish and in a pair, one will often dominate the other too much, so from that point of view, 4 or 5 male guppies is better, as it spreads out the aggression. They can occasionally confuse a boisterous Fighter into thinking they are also Fighters, and he can then try to attack them too.
 
My stocking suggestion would be
 
1 x Siamese Fighting Fish
6 x Salt & Pepper Cories (c.habrosus) or Dwarf Cory (c.hastatus)
6 x micro shoaling fish, eg Celestial Pearl Danio or Chilli Rasbora
4 x Male Endlers
 
Sadly, your hope that introducing plants would start off the cycle is a forlorn one. Living healthy plants consume ammonia, not release it. If the plants were to die, they would release ammonia as part of the decomposition process, and that would help, but the only (sensible) way to start off a nitrogen cycle without fish is to input liquid ammonia.

 

[N0body Of The Goat]

As a ballpark, look to a stocking that as adults, will give ~32cm of sedate moving fish.
 
Platties are too boisterous/aggressive/active for a typical ~60cm long tank long term, in terms of common livebearer species, Guppies or Endlers could live in a tank this size for life. A group of 5/6 males will provide colour and will not provide an uncontrollable population explosion in such a tank.
 
A ~60cm long tank is only really suitable for one of the three miniture Corydoras species long term (hastatus; hasbrosus; pygmeus), they are far happier in 10+ numbers (i.e. the vast majority of the ~32cm stocking) and they spend time midwater as well as on the tank.floor.
 
In conclusion, I suggest the following stocking from what has been mentioned to date...
1x Honey Gourami or 1x male Siamese Fighter or 3x female Siamese Fighter or 6x Endler or 6x Guppy
10x miniture Corydoras spp.

 

[JezTaylor]

I would go further than TallTree, in that Gouramis and Siamese Fighters are conspecific - it's a case of "when" they attack each other, not "if".
 
Guppies are an odd one, really, they don't need to be in groups the way shoaling fish do, but they are very boisterous fish and in a pair, one will often dominate the other too much, so from that point of view, 4 or 5 male guppies is better, as it spreads out the aggression. They can occasionally confuse a boisterous Fighter into thinking they are also Fighters, and he can then try to attack them too.
 
My stocking suggestion would be
 
1 x Siamese Fighting Fish
6 x Salt & Pepper Cories (c.habrosus) or Dwarf Cory (c.hastatus)
6 x micro shoaling fish, eg Celestial Pearl Danio or Chilli Rasbora
4 x Male Endlers
 
Sadly, your hope that introducing plants would start off the cycle is a forlorn one. Living healthy plants consume ammonia, not release it. If the plants were to die, they would release ammonia as part of the decomposition process, and that would help, but the only (sensible) way to start off a nitrogen cycle without fish is to input liquid ammonia.

 
Thanks for the advice - particularly about the Siamese Fighters. Taking on board everyone's comments, I've narrowed it down to 2 options:
 
2 platies
6 neon tetra's
1 beta
6 salt and pepper cories
 
Or...
 
2 platies
5 male guppies
1 dwarf gourami
6 salt and pepper cories
 
Has anyone had any problems with mixing platies and a beta?
 
With regards to the cycling, does a second hand tank need to be cycled in the same way? The tank, filter, ornaments and heater are all pre-owned so will they already have the good bacteria, or will it have been destroyed when the tank wasn't being used (none of it was washed in tap water)?

 

[Shelster]

Neon tetras really need to be introduced into an established tank ie one which has been running for a good 6 months to thrive. They CAN be a bit sensitive and die, however mine have been around 8months or so and are doing good (shoal of 7)

I also like honeys - as you can tell from my profile pic. Male in profile, female in signature.

May I suggest one male honey gourami, 2 or 3 females.

I also have a betta - love them HOWEVER you may want to get one when you treat yourself to another and have him on his own? They really quite like it.

I wouldn't personally add 3 female bettas into a community tank as I have no personal experience but have read from those that do, that they will gang up on fish and kill them off (a bit like killer whales really) and then will eventually turn on each other.

Good luck in your stocking and let us know what you decide to do.

Regards your second hand filter: has it been kept wet in tank water? When was it last used? These are the deciding factors

Welcome to the forum

 

[JezTaylor]

Neon tetras really need to be introduced into an established tank ie one which has been running for a good 6 months to thrive. They CAN be a bit sensitive and die, however mine have been around 8months or so and are doing good (shoal of 7)

I also like honeys - as you can tell from my profile pic. Male in profile, female in signature.

May I suggest one male honey gourami, 2 or 3 females.

I also have a betta - love them HOWEVER you may want to get one when you treat yourself to another and have him on his own? They really quite like it.

I wouldn't personally add 3 female bettas into a community tank as I have no personal experience but have read from those that do, that they will gang up on fish and kill them off (a bit like killer whales really) and then will eventually turn on each other.

Good luck in your stocking and let us know what you decide to do.

Regards your second hand filter: has it been kept wet in tank water? When was it last used? These are the deciding factors

Welcome to the forum

 
Thanks Shelster,

My tank has cycled and my 2 Platies are settling in nicely. They're very active little things!
 
Once the tank is a bit more established I'll look to add 6 neons and some salt and pepper cories. I'm still in a dilemma about the final addition. I was thinking a betta, but lots of people seem to agree that they don't really enjoy a community tank. That's steering me more towards Gourami's, but the honey's look a little big for a 64l. Do you think they'd be all right? Alternatively, my LFS has some lovely looking Dwarf Gourami's.

I'd appreciate some advice on group sizes as I think I'd be overstocking if I went for 3. I've read that they're quite happy going solo or in pairs. Would you agree? If they're ok in pairs, would 1 male and 1 female be ok, or is 2 females better?
One other thing... my LFS has both Red Neon Dwarf Gourami's and Sky Blue Dwarf Gourami's. For the sake of variation, would I be ok to get one of each or would they only get on with their own?

 

[the_lock_man]

They are different colour morphs of the same fish, they won't be able to tell the difference. 2 males will probably squabble in a 64l, and you probably aren't seeing any females as they aren't so colourful.

 

[JezTaylor]

They are different colour morphs of the same fish, they won't be able to tell the difference. 2 males will probably squabble in a 64l, and you probably aren't seeing any females as they aren't so colourful.

 
Thanks again Lock Man. Do you think a solo male would be a better option? Completely open to other suggestions of fish that would be suitable in a pair or solo.