Media For Fluval 405

[fluvalman]

hey guys new to this site

a quick question

1st what media should i put in my 4 trays in my canister filter( i was thinking 1st sponges/wool 2nd lava rock and noodles 3rd carbon and ammonia remover and nitra zorb 4th matrixs)

going down 2moz guys so faster i get the info back the better

thanks

 

[mwood2]

For all 3 of my canister filters I have mixtures of Bio Balls, Eheim Ehfisubstrat Pro, Wool/pads and fluval pre filter nodes on the bottom of each. I would say carbon is a waste of money unless you need water polishing or to remove extra impurties from the water. As for ammonia remover is most of the time a bad idea unless you have special needs like with a fully planted tank or something like that.

I own a Fluval 104, Eheim Ecco 2234, Eheim Classic 2215 and Marineland C-220 so I have experiance with canister filters kinda.

 

[fluvalman]

thought carbon helped

 

[mwood2]

It can help in some ways but its not necessary. I would prefer to stuff up the canister with the stuff I listed and use a secondary filter for carbon. Another reason for this would be that Carbon needs to be replaced on a regular basis to remain effective and canister filters while a great filter have the downfall of being a pain to open and close on a regular basis. A HOB Filter would allow you to just remove the top, take out carbon and replace in about 2min vs 10-30min depending on canister filter.

 

[fluvalman]

also heard that bio balls do more harm then good i might stay away from them or only get a couple

thinking to buy

lava rock, noodles, wool, matrix


do you reckon thats a good choice??

 

[mwood2]

Not sure but lava rock might effect tank stats like PH or something, don't quote me o that though. You mainly want media that allows bacteria to grow but keeps the chemistry of the water the same UNLESS you intentionality wants certain effects. Matrix I'm guessing is some sort of ammonia/nitrite/nitrate remover of some sort which again would be best to leave alone unless you need for some special reason.

 

[FiSHY79]

This is my current fluval 405 setup, I plan to supplement it with another filter, perhaps a 305 in the near future as I am at the limit for the 405 (100 gallon tall tank) but I prefer over filtering to help grab more detritus etc, unfortunately due to my hood design, I can not supplement with a HOB setup..

Turfed the stock carbon bags as they are good for removing odour and meds from the water, unless you have a NEED for carbon, don't run it, it is exhaustible, and requires regular replacement.

I bought a 2L tub of seachem matrix and i am running that i nthe 2 lower baskets, I filled them up and the remainder I poured over the stock biomax that comes with it in the third basket. My top basket has filter wool (shop didn't have polishing pads in stock) and I put this in the top basket purely for ease of access, this way it still polishes the water to high clarity, and when I need to change it I am not disturbing the remainder of the media by removing all the baskets to get to the pads at the bottom of the stack.

For a while, I was running another THIN filter pad in front and behind the stock fluval foam pads, there is room in there without affecting flow, but when they exhausted I removed them, waiting replacement stock. The "pre filter" thin pads I speak off didn't have a brand name attached, but it was a white "brilo pad" feeling pad, kinda scratchy, and similar to the chemical filter pads you can buy, only about 5mm thick at most, and you can cut a layer to shape to fit othe left and right side of the mech filter pads, this allowed me to have more bio filtration without sacrificing a basket for the pre filter mech media...

If I need to run carbon or some such, I take out the top filter floss and replace with carbon, or purigen or other such media, and again, it is in the top basket, so no need to disturb my biomedia. I have run phosguard in the top basket for a while to lower my phosphates, nice and easy..

In this setup, I can have clear water in a 100 gallon tall tank. There's 2L of matrix in there aswell as the stock biomax, all in all that is more than double what seachem state is required to handle 100 gallons, I also sent off an email to seachem asking their advice of running twice as much media as necessary ( according to their specs ) and they agreed it was a good idea.

I don't have an issue with the matrix clogging yet, only the filter floss does require changing thus far, and buying a bulk pack of filter wool is cheaper than buying fluval polishing pads, you just cut it to size and jam it in there..

1L of matrix should according to the company be ample for a 100 gallon tank, but IMHO you cannot have too much media. I will run a similar setup in my next supplemental filter, but I may change to eheim substrat to see how it is.. I don't really want to run one mech filter and one bio filter, I want to have the bioload evenly spread across the filters so that if one goes down or requires maintenance, the other is still doing it's job and keeping the fish happy, I work in the medical diagnostics industry, so I feel most comfortable with a backup system in place.. Mirrored backups that is..

Don't get me wrong, I am not pushing matrix, i think any quality media will do the trick, just stick with a proven product and you will be fine, matrix, eheim and biomax are all time tested products that work, steer clear of the noname media and you cant have a problem, but you can trial anything you like really.. I just won't experiment at the expense of fish health with unproven products. But for ease of this posts sake, i KNOW for a fact you can fit 2L of matrix in a 405 if you dispense with the carbon, but if you want to run carbon you can, you still have the "top" basket to play with.. A lot of posts recommend your mech filtration stages first, so sponge pads, then filter floss in the bottom basket and media in the top baskets, but i went with ease of access, and have no trouble with the matrix clogging, if I do, I will move the top filter floss basket to the bottom position and the problem is solved..

Hope this helps, let us know what you go with, i would be interested in other 405 setup options..

.

 

[fluvalman]

after reading all this information i am now going to approach this sitution by

having my 1st basket filter wool(have you guys heard if pot scrubbies are good)?

2nd noodles

3 and 4 matrixs

and do you reckon they are in the right baskets example 1st, 2nd 3rd 4th

do you reckon thats a better setup then my previous posts?

the pet shops are saying i should leave the carbon in there but according to the replying post i dont need it.

 

[FiSHY79]

Generally for mechanical filtration, the old rule of thumb is coarse - fine, if you go by traditional stances, SO, on that basis, you should have -

1) foam
2) noodles (pre filter mech)
3) pot scuffles (not a necessity, just a home DIY option)
4) filter wool for final polish

If run in this way, you will not have any debris entering your biological filtration area, so it will need next to no maintenance. You will however have to remove the bio filtration to get to your mech filtration for the maintenance it will require.

Pet shops will tell you to run carbon so they can keep selling it to you ,it is exhaustible, it WILL require replacement if you want to run it all the time, it is NOT needed unless you have a specific reason to run it, for example, removing medications from a tank, or you have nasty odor (but carbon treats the symptom in this case, not the cause) or if you have really cloudy water it can help, but if you do not replace it, it will leach toxins back into the water such as phosphates etc et

If you run matrix, you will buy the 2L and have a bit left over if you use two baskets, or buy 1L and have less media in each basket, choice is yours..

My filter normally runs the coarse foam, then less coarse foam (cut to size) , then media then polishing but that is not the "norm" I do it because it is easier to maintain, this is from experience and because I like easy.. But what you have described would be a great way to run it, but you don't have to have the pot scrubbies, they are just a cheap DIY option.

 

[fluvalman]

thanks every for your time and your info
i will be heading down and getting filter wool, noodles and matirx

 

[FiSHY79]

No worries, hope it helps you out a bit, let us know how you go

If yours is anything like mine, the 405 will take a lot of priming, especially the filter wool and noodles, they trap air like a demon until the filter has run for a good while.. You will know when the 405 is truly primed, it won't sound noisy anymore, but while there is air in there, it will run loud.. Just some gently rocking back and forth will help dislodge air pockets that form inside.. (left and right, back and forth, you'll see the air shoot out from the outflow like a bubble wall).

Just remember to rinse the matrix (and the filter floss) before you put it into action, there's a lot of dust that comes off it (probably your noodles too).

What I found easy to rinse the matrix was either just like your substrate in a bucket, or, put it into each of the filter baskets and run the baskets under the laundry tap, just jiggle it around as you hold the basket under running water.. Just don't over-fill each basket with matrix, they still need to be able to fit together snugly, not balancing ontop of each other.. They kind slot into the basket above and below..

 

[FiSHY79]

Not sure but lava rock might effect tank stats like PH or something, don't quote me o that though. You mainly want media that allows bacteria to grow but keeps the chemistry of the water the same UNLESS you intentionality wants certain effects. Matrix I'm guessing is some sort of ammonia/nitrite/nitrate remover of some sort which again would be best to leave alone unless you need for some special reason.

Matrix is just a normal inert biomedia, it has a consistency of pumice stone, it does the same job they all do, it is claimed thru marketing that it allows beneficial anaerobic bacteria to form aswell because it is dense, and this bacteria helps with the nitrification cycle and can digest nitrates..how accurate that is I don't know, but it works and works well for it's primary purpose as a normal biomedia surface (like eheim, biomax etc) and is rated at 700m2 surface area per liter of matrix, some manufactures do not tell you how much surface area per litre, but if it's rated, at least you know what you're getting..

 

[fluvalman]

just wondering could you guys give me a rough esimate on when i would have to change my matirx, filter wool and noodles

cheers

 

[Mikaila31]

Matrix I think is good indefinitely, same with the noodles... wool/floss can be changed when it starts falling apart.

 

[FiSHY79]

Yup, never change the matrix, it's a stone that will carry your beneficial bacteria, if you change it or clean it under a tap, you will kill the nitrifying bacteria and cause a cycle in your tank. Rinse your foam in old tank water if it is blocked so much that the flow of your fluval slows down, same with the floss, change it or clean it when it falls apart or is restricting your fluval.