Bruce Leyland-Jones
Fish Aficionado
The tank wasn't cycled.
Lost some Penguin Tetras (original title 'lost some cardinal penguins')
- Thread starter imw
- Start date
Yet, the ammonia, nitrIte, and nitrAte readings are currently all zero?
Confirmed by both the OP and the LFS?
Bruce Leyland-Jones
Fish Aficionado
I pour clean water into a brand new tank and my ammonia, nitrite and nitrate readings are zero.
...And you're saying that my tank is cycled?!?
I would change 50-75% of the water every day for a week. Make sure the water is de-chlorinated (prime is fine for this) and a similar temp to the water you take out. This will help if it is a cycling or contamination issue. For now take the wood out to be on the safe side. You mention in another post that your pH is 6.5 and the LFS gave you something to increase the pH. Do NOT use this. As has been mentioned in that thread tetras naturally occur in low pH, which is what I would expect you to have in Yorkshire. Importantly ammonia is toxic in a pH of 7 or above. At 6.5 it is not toxic, or significantly less toxic. Lots of fast growing plants will really help. At a pH of 6.5 your tank is almost certainly not cycled as the bacteria do not thrive in low pH and will grow very slowly. This is not a problem with lots of plants. I have 3 tanks with a pH of 6 or lower. These tanks have never cycled (because they can't, the bacteria die in those conditions), but are full of healthy fish because the plants deal with the ammonium they produce before it can turn into nitrite.
Note: Ammonia (NH3, toxic to fish) is produced in neutral or basic water and ammonium (NH4, not toxic to fish) in acidic water. That is why @Essjay and others in that thread recommended you don't mess with the pH.
Note: Ammonia (NH3, toxic to fish) is produced in neutral or basic water and ammonium (NH4, not toxic to fish) in acidic water. That is why @Essjay and others in that thread recommended you don't mess with the pH.
My test readings backed up b
added
Ok Bruce it is out - I will do a big water change tomorrow am - water is NOT CLOUDY, trick of light and rubbish camera on old smart phone - my fish count left was in error - make it 3 left _ they are good at hiding.Ouchy.
Normally, unless assured otherwise, it's safe to assume that wood is untreated.
To 'treat it', in usually needs submerging for a week or so, usually in a tub or bucket outside, with occasional water changes.
This drowns and hidden creepy-crawlies and ensures that the wood is going to sink and stay sunk.
One thing that often happens when you do this is that there's a 'bloom' of bacteria on the wood, which will eventually dissipate. (This could also be a reason for your apparently cloudy water). Your shop should've advised you of this, when taking your money for the wood.
Sometimes, you can buy wood that has already been treated, though this is usually substantially more expensive.
That tank doesn't have fish in it.
To date 15 plants in - plus some floating plants - all doing well to date - fuval aquasky on plant boost modE - using flourish one a week.
15 plants in plus 4 types of floating plants - fluval aquasky on plant boost mode - doing well so far.
ATB
If driftwood develops white gunk on it, take the wood out and hose it off, then do a big water change on the tank. Some types of wood can develop poisonous fungus and it can kill the fish and other inhabitants. You should also wipe the inside of the glass down before doing the water change.
If you have any carbon, add some to the filter.
I read this thread from post 1, and when I got to the photos immediately saw the issue.
The white slime/fungus on that wood is highly toxic and it will kill fish. The cloudiness is part of this. I had the same thing several years ago from a similar piece of wood. [Grapewood (as it is called) is notorious for this toxic fungus, but other types may be involved.]
Take the wood out, do a 85-90% water change. I guarantee the remaining fish if still alive will recover.
The white slime/fungus on that wood is highly toxic and it will kill fish. The cloudiness is part of this. I had the same thing several years ago from a similar piece of wood. [Grapewood (as it is called) is notorious for this toxic fungus, but other types may be involved.]
Take the wood out, do a 85-90% water change. I guarantee the remaining fish if still alive will recover.
Hi,
Just a bit of an update. I have done a 60% water change - prime was added.
Temp is 25c
Ammonia - no reading detected
Nitrate - No reading detected
Nitrite - No reading detected.
pH - 7
All tests done using API master test kit.
2 fish remain - I fed them a tiny amount which they polished off.
Hopefully with a little luck I can move forward now.
Thank you to all who helped - it has been very much appreciated.
ATB
Just a bit of an update. I have done a 60% water change - prime was added.
Temp is 25c
Ammonia - no reading detected
Nitrate - No reading detected
Nitrite - No reading detected.
pH - 7
All tests done using API master test kit.
2 fish remain - I fed them a tiny amount which they polished off.
Hopefully with a little luck I can move forward now.
Thank you to all who helped - it has been very much appreciated.
ATB
DoubleDutch
Fish Gatherer
Still wondering why the questions about the way of cycling aren't answered.
There seems some annoyance about these questions which I don't exactly understand.
There seems some annoyance about these questions which I don't exactly understand.
The reason we ask about the way a tank has been cycled is there is often a mis-conception about what cycling is. We need to know what has been done to cycle the tank so we know if the tank has actually been cycled.
Some think that just letting a tank run for a few weeks is cycling. (This only cycles a tank when it is heavily planted as it allows the plants to become established - a plant or silent cycle).
Some think that adding a bottled bacteria product instantly cycles a tank, but even the best speed up a cycle, it's not instant.
Some think cycling is another word for doing water changes and they have no idea it really means growing bacteria.
In these examples, a member may believe that they have cycled the tank so when we ask, they say yes the tank has been cycled.
Some think that just letting a tank run for a few weeks is cycling. (This only cycles a tank when it is heavily planted as it allows the plants to become established - a plant or silent cycle).
Some think that adding a bottled bacteria product instantly cycles a tank, but even the best speed up a cycle, it's not instant.
Some think cycling is another word for doing water changes and they have no idea it really means growing bacteria.
In these examples, a member may believe that they have cycled the tank so when we ask, they say yes the tank has been cycled.
Thanks Essay,
so to put the record straight I will detail what I did below.
Set up tank 8th August. I took (removed) jewel internal filter out and added a Oase Thermo 350. Bottom tray was filled with filter floss, next was sponge next was Ceramic filter media (fluval), reminder of trays were left as supplied by Oase.
I used Play sand which was non toxic and pre washed - I washed again my self. The temp was set up at 25c.
I planted 5 plants (I added prime) when filling up). Also added some rocks and bog wood and a piece of wood purchased from LFS.
I used the internal filter to run some activated carbon and some mature filter material.
I left internal and external running until 14th August. I added some more plants Friday 20th August.
I removed internal from the tank. External left running.
I tested tank for Ammonia. Nitrate and Nitrite & pH 2 or 3 time during this period - PH 7 rest I got zero readings.
The next day I added 12 Penguin Tetras, (50 gallon tank). They were fine until a few days later (eating and acting in a normal fashion), I then started to loose the fish in front of my eyes. Tested water again (same results as before).
Did a 50% water change (added prime) and added some more plants ( just as a side note I had floating plants as well from the start) Still having fish loss.
Did a 70% water change - tested water- same results as before then on advice given I remove the wood which had a lots of gunk on it and was very slimy to the touch. Did another big water change (only 2 fish remained at this point) - tested water and LFS tested water - results the same as before bar pH which LFS read at 6.5.
This morning 23/08 did another big water change (prime used). Fed fish (they accepted food (tiny amount given).
Tank temp remains at 25c. Water test done by me were the same as before (but my reading of pH was 7.
The 2 fish are still with me.
HTH
Last edited:
D
Deleted member 149562
Guest
One thing jumps out at me....not sure if it had anything to do with what has been happening, might be connected, might not be....however, your filter media.
Ceramics would normally go in the bottom tray since they catch the most good bacterial matter and thus removes the "bad stuff" initially before passing through the layers above. The last layer should be the floss that will catch all the finer crud that the lower levels miss.
So have I read yours right and its upside down?
Ceramics would normally go in the bottom tray since they catch the most good bacterial matter and thus removes the "bad stuff" initially before passing through the layers above. The last layer should be the floss that will catch all the finer crud that the lower levels miss.
So have I read yours right and its upside down?
That's very helpful.
You haven't done a conventional fishless cycle as that involves adding ammonia or fish food to decompose and make ammonia.
But you do have plants, which will help.
Are the plants showing signs of actively growing? Plants need to establish themselves before we can be sure they'll deal with all the ammonia made by fish.
You mention floating plants - these are particularly good at taking up ammonia as long as there are more than the odd one or two tiny specimens. Floating plants are close to the lights and as they are on the surface they can get CO2 from the air.
Last year I bought some Aqua One branchy wood which I left in an old tank in the garden to soak. Within a couple of days it had grown white slime and the water was too cloudy to see through. I changed the water and scrubbed the wood under the outside tap, and next day it was as bad as ever. I cleaned the wood and changed the water almost every day for a couple of weeks which reduced the cloudiness but didn't get rid of it. Google found some hits which claimed that the Aqua One wood I bought killed fish so it is still sitting in the shed, unused, and I bought some different wood. I couldn't take the risk.
(The new wood, labelled mangrove, was fine. I just had to soak it for a cople of weeks until it stopped floating)
You haven't done a conventional fishless cycle as that involves adding ammonia or fish food to decompose and make ammonia.
But you do have plants, which will help.
Are the plants showing signs of actively growing? Plants need to establish themselves before we can be sure they'll deal with all the ammonia made by fish.
You mention floating plants - these are particularly good at taking up ammonia as long as there are more than the odd one or two tiny specimens. Floating plants are close to the lights and as they are on the surface they can get CO2 from the air.
Last year I bought some Aqua One branchy wood which I left in an old tank in the garden to soak. Within a couple of days it had grown white slime and the water was too cloudy to see through. I changed the water and scrubbed the wood under the outside tap, and next day it was as bad as ever. I cleaned the wood and changed the water almost every day for a couple of weeks which reduced the cloudiness but didn't get rid of it. Google found some hits which claimed that the Aqua One wood I bought killed fish so it is still sitting in the shed, unused, and I bought some different wood. I couldn't take the risk.
(The new wood, labelled mangrove, was fine. I just had to soak it for a cople of weeks until it stopped floating)
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