Jack Dempsey + Friends

I wouldnt worry about the red eyes, sword tails and hoplos being food they are all pretty big fish. JDs are not that aggressive - the reason they have a reputation is because they are one of the first cichlids into the hobby - no one had seen real aggression like this before where as now they are comparatively calm really... Now for comparisons - the Jag would be a whole different story they really are strong and tough fish that will fight.... and would eat the red eyes and hoplos lol. I would not put a jag with these kind of fish - JDs are not that tough and in a 8x2x2 not going to be a problem at all. But its upto you how you number them up - with the Blue Acaras they wouldnt really form a group, you would either end up with 4 singletons which would work or 2 pairs or 1 pair 2 singletons etc.

As with all cichlid tanks its not an exact science so might not work but you have loads of room and some spare tanks should things look a bit iffy.

Wills
 
Thought I'd post on here instead of starting new thread, how fast do jack dempseys grow, I recently bought one and its currently 1.5'
 
hi ijust though id let you k nowwhat ii have but 1 fish might not work out, just trying it as all cichlids have different personalitys.
I have
1 blue acara,
6 JD's
1 salvini
1 t-bar cichlid
and 1 10" upside down catfish.
like I said im not sure if the salvini will work.

like

like I said

Just out of curiousity Trapidz, what size tank do you have and how do the JD's get along in that number?
 
Just want to thank all those with there thougths and suggestions.....ended up with the below and have added some photo's

2 x Jack Dempseys ( one will probably be re-homed at some stage)
2 x Blue Acara
2 x FireMouths
2 x Orange Head Tapajo's

will also strongly consider some Red horse face cichlids as our LFS has some fry from wild parents.....pricey but they look amazing.

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looks nice, got some updated pics? much changed since last ones?
 
Firemouths will harass the Tapajos, i had this combo before and it didnt end up well.
 
MrCavs said:
MrCavs - Hi, have to admit I have a few concerns,Firstly the mix - the Braziliiensis could dominate that tank even as youngsters they can be tough bolshy fish and are often best kept with similarly tempered fish. The Blue Acaras and JD might be okay they are often similarly matched. Also if your planning to use a tank to grow fish out the planned Pleco would grow much faster than the other fish.Im also wondering why you have gone straight to a monster tank of an 8x2x2 when really even an adult G.Braziliensis would thrive in a 6x2x2 (though obviously bigger is better) and then the BAs and JDs are reasonably sized fish but a standard 55g would be a good size thought again bigger is always better.Wills
Thats why i posted guys thanks, most of the websites say the Braziliensis is relativly peaceful with similar sized fish....guess thats what happens when you believe the internet :) In regards to the tank i built my House with a 10ft flat wall in my Billiards room for a 8 x 2 x 2 Tank, ive been here 5 years and its Time (sick of seeing my 2 x 4fts in that space) Do you have some other stocking suggestions? im all ears.again thanks for the imput.
Brasillienesis are the spawn of satan. Satan fish

Runs away screaming *
 
Ok so 6 months down the track and the Plans are finally back on track, Setup was ordered and deposit placed last friday.
 
Tank ended up being 8.5 x 2.5 x 2.5 ( 300 US Gallons) with a 6ft sump. (115 Us gallons).
 
Ive got about 4 weeks of waiting ahead of me so time to start planning and moving and generally getting ready.
 
Question Time :)
 
With much help from Willis and the rest of the Fishforum.net guys ive got some 2-5 inch fish ready to go into it when it arrives.
Over the past 8 Months i have been slowly buying American Cichlids when the opportunity arose as most of the LFS have the generic varieties.
 
Current stocking over 2 x 4 foot tanks is as follows:
 
1 Pair of Jack Dempseys (Rocio octofasciata)
1 Pair of Blue Acara (Aequidens pulcher)
1 trio of Macaw Cichlids (Hypsophrys nicaraguensis)
4 or 5 Orange head Tapajo's (Geophagus sp. "Tapajos Orange Head" )
1 x Salvini (Cichlasoma salvini)
1 x Gold Severum (Heros efasciatus)
4 x Thorichthys ellioti (Thorichthys ellioti)
4 x Threadfin Acara (Acarichthys heckelii)
3 x Firemouths (Thorichthys meeki) n

At this stage im thinking the fire mouths and Jack Dempseys can stay in there respective 4 footers, with everything else making its way into the new Tank. The sump will have 4 feet of refugium / Grow out area also.
Does anyone have any concerns or queries with this?
 
Now i usually would do a fish in cycle with some feeder fish ( gold Fish) but with a tank this size it could take forever( unless i drop in 100 fish) has anyone used Seachem Stability? From the website and word of mouth ive heard it works but couldnt find anyone who has done a tank this size, Cycled Media will be placed in the sump but only half of whats in the 4 footers now.
 
Now doing my research i came across this.....
 
Seachem American Cichlid Salts
 
Does anybody use this or had experiences with it. Tempted to give it a go but have never used it before.
 
Thanks for any answers in advance, ill get some picks up when everything finally gets here :)
 
 

 
 

 
 
Wow great to hear this is going ahead :)
 
Stocking... I can see a few problems even in an 8 foot tank that is a hell of a lot of cichlids. Lets not forget this is an American tank not an African. There are a lot of groups so the odds of breeding are high which will cause issues and you have some very very nasty fish when breeding in there...
 
Judging a tank of this size is hard, Ive never had a tank this size my biggest is my current 6 footer and there have not been that many tanks this size on the forum in the time Ive been here.... (since 2009ish)
 
So Im going to try and show my thinking as if it were my tank...
 
First question - do I want to keep these fish for their full life span - 7 to 20 years in some cases. - for me this is a yes
 
Second question - how happy am I about rehoming fish - there are a couple of scenarios you need to think about here - are you going to thin out the stock as it grows and the non gregarious fish start to show their colours, specifically the threadfins here.... and how fast can you rehome the fish should you get one particular nightmare or the opposite and you have to rehome an fish that cannot survive in a tougher environment.
 
Third question - do I want to breed and raise the young fish - for me this is a no, it limits the over all number of fish in the tank and can cause aggression and fighting. And then this causes loss of scales and nipped fish which means not only do you risk disease, fungus etc it dulls the fish down through stress - particularly the Tapajos and the Threadfins...
 
Fourth question - how happy are you about mixing central and south americans? Personally I wouldnt do it... again, I was warned by people that had been doing this a lot longer than me that it was a bad idea. I ignored them and it resulted in my loosing a fair few fish over time and ultimately one of my most prized fish of all time... for me now, mixing centrals and souths is a massive no BUT it can work BUT I wouldnt recommend it.... There are also a few exceptions though, but that list for me gets slimmed down when you mix in breeding to the tank.
 
Im sure there are other things to consider but I will put together lists of what I would do.
 
List 1 - Souths
 
1 x Gold Severum
2 x Blue Acara
2 x Threadfin Acaras - (they can be very species intolerant and are near impossible to breed in aquariums but I think 2 could co exist in a tank of this size)
6 x Orange head Tapajo's
 
 
List 2 - Centrals
 
2 x Jack Dempseys
3 x Macaw Cichlids - (these are really a pairing fish but are very very fickle. 100% my favorite fish in the whole world and I would love a 4x2x2 to have some in with no other cichlids. Bearing in mind I just said they are my favorite fish in the whole world - they are an absolute bloody nightmare!! So argumentative but absolutely can not stand up for them selves. More info on them bellow :) )
1 x Salvini
4 x Thorichthys ellioti  or 4 x Firemouths - (again to avoid hybrids)
 
 
List 3 - the mixed tank
 
1 x Gold Severum
2 x Blue Acara
2 x Jack Dempseys
4 x Orange head Tapajo's  or 4 Ellioti or 4 Firemouths.
 
 
If it were me I would go for the Southern tank
 
And then have the Nics in one tank and the JDs and the Salvini in the other. Those three tanks would make me EXTREMELY envious of you and I actually think you are onto a very successful set of tanks.
 
I think the Centrals would be good as well but if I am honest in this tank.... if I was doing centrals I would be doing giant centrals... like Boucourti and Vieja Argentina ;)
 
See which suits you though, I do think you are going to have to cut down on number of cichlids you have in total though - right now you have 28 - I think the magic number for this tank with these fish is around 8-12
 
 
As for cycling - if your using mature media why not just use bottled ammonia rather than any of the bottled products :) Its the best option really. Though if your adding mature media straight to the tank you could just add a few of the fish to keep the filter alive?
 
The Seachem salts - I would skip it - its selling its self on grouping Centrals and Souths together when actually they need different waters - Central water is cooler and harder with a neutral ph where as south is softer warmer and has a lower ph generally. It also sells its self as for South American tanks when it has a picture of a Texas Cichlid - aka one of the most northern found American cichlids out there.... Fortunately in your tank/tanks the fish are quite down the middle and are not overly needy for natural requirements - just dont go using stuff like ocean rock or aragonite like you would find in an African tank as your souths will suffer. 
 
 
Hope thats helped
Wills
 
Wills it always Helps, Doesnt make my choices any easier but it always helps :)
 
 
List 1 - Souths
 
1 x Gold Severum
2 x Blue Acara
2 x Threadfin Acaras - (they can be very species intolerant and are near impossible to breed in aquariums but I think 2 could co exist in a tank of this size)
6 x Orange head Tapajo's
 
Could the Ellioti's work with this group long term? This is a Massive Display and want it to look as good as possible?
 
Rehoming / Selling fish isnt going to be an issue, im not in it for the money and a free fish get snapped up pretty quickly.
 
The next step in the plan is to turn the 2 four footers into 2 5x2x2's (then thats it!!!!)
 
So the other suggestions you have will work down the track, hopefully they dont get to big too quick. Wishful thinking with american cichlids i know but.....
 
Yeah I think Ellioti might work in there - I would go for 2 males or just a singleton if you dont mind the odd character?
 
Or you could look at stuff like Angels or Festivums - these are more open water dwelling cichlids and spend more time towards the top of the tank - I think that one of the artificial strains of the Angels might look good like the black ones or the wild type blues. I think you could add a few Angels which would work pretty nice :)
 
You could probably add an other Severum or maybe 2 more in there as well - get a few different variants and try and get all males it will work out quite nice :)
 
Lets not forget that this is not the end of the stock though - the great thing about American Cichlids is you can build a community around them - obviously you have limitations as to what will and wont work but there are tons of options - the Cichlids are just the start.
 
I always think that in tanks like this limiting the number of species but having large numbers of them create a real spectacle. So the tank is 397 US Gallons which is whats best to help work out stocking for me. Your cichlids are combined around 75 inches so you have a LOT of room :)
 
I would stick with other South American fish for the rest of it - so things like Headstanders, large disk Tetras like Comubians and Bleeding Heart Tetras - Pencil fish could work, big Plecs (like L95, L14, L190) midsized plecs will work great as well if you like them I have a real thing for L240 at the moment but the list is endless. Hoplos, Pictus - Ornate Pictus are nice and big. Spotted Silver Dollars are nice - Hemiodus are a bit different and a good size - big of activity in the upper levels as well. Lima Shovel Noses would be good so long as you got them very small to start with and then let the Geos grow up a bit.
 
Depends on what else you like really :)
 
I really like this guys tanks
 
http://www.youtube.com/user/Haz4rd0?feature=watch
 
His tank is a similar size to yours as well so might help you get some ideas together - I know his tanks have influenced a lot of my fish choices in the past.
 
 
The 5x2x2s sound fantastic and those cichlids in there will look fantastic especially the Nics :D Really wish I could have that!! But despite having a decent sized house only one of the rooms has a concrete floor and thats where the 6 footer is lol :)
 
Wills
 
So i just spent the last 2 hours looking at all his video's....WOW....so many ideas and things to try :)
 

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