Is my Gourami sick or is this normal?

[AydenD]

Hi all, first things first this is my first post on this site and I wanna say I'm new and happy to be here and this won't be my only post as I hope to over the course of a few years become an experienced aquarist and help others like you all want to help me.

General info:

Tank size: 20 gallons
Nitrates: Practically none
Nitrites: Practically none
pH: 7.0-7.5
Hardnesses (both kinds): Normal
Water temp: 76°F (consistent no variation)
Everything else is normal.
Notes: I use water conditioner and the natural added bacteria as instructed to by the product. There is also some cloudiness in the water as of now but I believe this is from new fish kicking up stuff from when they entered the tank recently.

So now to what is happening, my Blue Gourami that I've had for about two weeks now is acting strange. When I first got him for the first couple days he didn't eat and I chocked that up to adjusting to the new aquarium and everything. After the first few days he began eating normally and started moving a little bit more than what he had been doing (sitting still for hours on end during the day with the tank light on and moving some slowly at night with the tank light off). When I added him to the tank there was currently only two giant danios (one full grown one around 1.5 inches). His tank mates joining him upon entry were two coryadora catfish (one albino and one spotted) and a small-medium sized blue crayfish. The blue crayfish ate both the coryadoras within 8 hours. He has been in the tank up until three days ago until I moved him to my other 20 gallon tank. He now lives there with 4 small-medium African chiclids I added today after letting the tank cycle for a week and a half. Anyways back to the Gourami, he got and gets along well with danios. Yesterday, I added two Clown Loaches, two Weather Loches, and a little bit smaller than him Pearl Gourami. He didn't show any aggression towards any of the fish except the Pearl Gourami who's about 75% of his size (I'd say he's about 4 inches airing on the larger side). I have no idea the sexes of my Gouramis, so I didn't know if it was my Blue Gourami being territorial to another male. After about 4 hours my Blue Gourami stopped chasing the Pearl. For a few hours the Blue Gourami would slowly chase the Pearl but it hardly seemed agressively but the Pearl still seemed frightened. Now the weird behavior, all day today he had been sitting on the rocks at the bottom of the tank. He wasn't sitting on his side or anything he was perfectly straight up and down like he was swimming in the water. He wouldn't breathe for a few seconds and then take a large breath. He would also only do this when the Pearl was near and when she swam away after a few seconds he would stop and act normal. He now still does this but the Pearl stays near him, they also swim with each other 50% or more of the time. Also, all of this behavior stops if I go to feed, they both just swim to the surface and eat and than swim normally. I originally thought it was an air bladder problem because he could be stuck at the bottom but he didn't flip at all and he could swing normal whenever he pleased. I think this is just a mating ritual like displaying but I'm not sure. Hopefully you guys on here will be able to help me out some, AydenD.

I will post photos later.

Update: He didn't come up to feed this morning and is now sitting on the bottom in place 80% of the time regardless of if the Pearl Gourami is around. He also began to sway on the bottom, it looks like he's falling over and catching himself.

 

[Colin_T]

Hi and welcome to the forum

Stop buying fish for a bit and let the tanks and filters settle down.

Crayfish should not be kept with fish because they eat small fish and sometimes get eaten by bigger fish when they shed their skin.

Move one of the gouramis into another tank. Never keep more than one species of Labyrinth (gourami & Bettas) in the same tank because they are territorial and fight with each other. Your pearl gourami is probably being bullied by the blue gourami.

Check the ammonia, nitrite & nitrate levels in the water and post the results (in numbers) here. If you have any ammonia or nitrite, do a 75% water change and gravel clean the substrate each day until the ammonia and nitrite levels are 0.

 

[AydenD]

Hi and welcome to the forum

Stop buying fish for a bit and let the tanks and filters settle down.

Crayfish should not be kept with fish because they eat small fish and sometimes get eaten by bigger fish when they shed their skin.

Move one of the gouramis into another tank. Never keep more than one species of Labyrinth (gourami & Bettas) in the same tank because they are territorial and fight with each other. Your pearl gourami is probably being bullied by the blue gourami.

Check the ammonia, nitrite & nitrate levels in the water and post the results (in numbers) here. If you have any ammonia or nitrite, do a 75% water change and gravel clean the substrate each day until the ammonia and nitrite levels are 0.

I will do a water change when I am home later today, the Pearl Gourami (who is smaller) isn't the issue though, the larger Blue Gourami is the one who is acting strange. The Pearl Gourami has shown 0 aggression at all. I also bought cichlids for the time being that are too large for the Crayfish to eat but no where near big enough to eat him. They were also put in after the Crayfish how has shown dominance and the Cichlids don't bother him. What does it mean that my larger Gourami is the one acting strange and not the small one?

Thank you, AydenD.

 

[Colin_T]

What does it mean that my larger Gourami is the one acting strange and not the small one?

It's usually a water quality issue. However, if the water is good (has 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite and less than 20ppm nitrate) then it could be a disease but we will need a photo of the fish and if it's swimming funny, then make a short 20 second video of it doing whatever, and we can check it out.

 

[AydenD]

Thank you Colin_T I will do everything you've said and post the results later this evening.

Have a good day, AydenD.

 

[AydenD]

It's usually a water quality issue. However, if the water is good (has 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite and less than 20ppm nitrate) then it could be a disease but we will need a photo of the fish and if it's swimming funny, then make a short 20 second video of it doing whatever, and we can check it out.

Update, I changed 50% of the water and the Blue Gourami seems to be doing better, he now only goes to the bottom for a minute (to do what looks like rest) and than swims like normal. Also when he goes to the bottom the Pearl Gourami pushes up next to him (not aggressively almost like a comforting thing). However, looking closely at my tank one of my Clown Loaches now has Ich. It is only him however and I am going to go out to my local Petco (only thing open at 8 o'clock) and am going to pick up some Ich medication. Is there anything I should do specifically for the Ich? I've seen things that say that I should turn the temp in the tank up to around 86 degrees F to help kill the Ich. Also is there some medications that won't work with the fish combination I have in the tank?

Combination is:
2 Giant Danios
2 Clown Loaches (one with Ich one without)
2 Weather Loaches
1 Pearl Gourami
1 Blue Gourami

Thank you for the help to all, AydenD

 

[Colin_T]

If the fish have whitespot (Ichthyophthirius) then just raise the temperature to 30C (86F) and keep it there for 2 weeks. The parasites will die and you don't have to use medications.

Wipe the inside of the glass down, do a 75-80% water change and complete gravel clean. And clean the filter before starting treatment. The big water change will help reduce the number of parasites in the water and there will be fewer that can affect the fish.

Increase surface turbulence/ aeration when increasing the temperature because warm water holds less dissolved oxygen.

If the temperature is less than 27C, only raise the temperature 2-3 degrees each day until you get to 30C.

There's more information about ich at the following link. The first post on page 1 and second post on page 2 are worth reading.
http://www.fishforums.net/threads/what-is-ich.7092/page-2

 

[AydenD]

If the fish have whitespot (Ichthyophthirius) then just raise the temperature to 30C (86F) and keep it there for 2 weeks. The parasites will die and you don't have to use medications.

Wipe the inside of the glass down, do a 75-80% water change and complete gravel clean. And clean the filter before starting treatment. The big water change will help reduce the number of parasites in the water and there will be fewer that can affect the fish.

Increase surface turbulence/ aeration when increasing the temperature because warm water holds less dissolved oxygen.

If the temperature is less than 27C, only raise the temperature 2-3 degrees each day until you get to 30C.

There's more information about ich at the following link. The first post on page 1 and second post on page 2 are worth reading.
http://www.fishforums.net/threads/what-is-ich.7092/page-2

I would raise the temperature in the tank but the heater I have in this tank isn't adjustable. In my other 20 gallon there is a adjustable heater but I don't want to swap heaters because I don't know if the one in the tank with Ich has parasite eggs on it. What should I do?

 

[Colin_T]

Either get another heater that is adjustable or get a whitespot medication that is suitable for scaleless fish (catfish, loaches, eels). If you can't find a medication for scaleless fish, then use a normal whitespot medication at half strength.

Any medication with Malachite Green or Copper Sulphate will treat whitespot and other protozoan parasites. If you use Copper sulphate in the tank it will kill snails and shrimp.
*NB* Malachite Green is carcinogenic (causes cancer) so you should wash your hands with warm soapy water after handling this or any fish medication. And keep the medication away from children or animals.

If you get another heater, get one that is slightly over powered for the tank. eg: you tank might have a 100 watt heater so get a 150watt adjustable heater to use. There is not normally much difference in price between the different wattage heaters and a higher wattage heater will rise the temperature easier and you can use that heater on a bigger tank if you ever get another tank in the future. Make sure you have a thermometer in the aquarium and check the temperature on that.

The whitespot parasites can be transferred from tank to tank by contaminated water or objects from an infected tank. So if you have several aquariums, feed and work in the diseased tank last and wash your hands with warm soapy water after working in any tank or handling any medications or testing any water.

-----------------------
If you treat the tank you need to work out how much water is in it before treating. To work out the volume of water in the tank:
measure length x width x height in cm.
divide by 1000.
= volume in litres.

When you measure the height, measure from the top of the substrate to the top of the water level.

There is a calculator/ converter in the "How To Tips" at the top of this page that will let you convert litres to gallons if you need it.

Remove carbon from the filter before treating or it will absorb the medication and stop it working.

Wipe the inside of the glass down, do a 75% water change and complete gravel clean. And clean the filter before treating.

Increase surface turbulence/ aeration when using medications because they reduce the dissolved oxygen in the water.

 

[Moss Ball]

Im new to this but yor first post said your temps are just 76 degrees, its too cold, doesnt it need to be near 80.

26 degrees farenheit is around 80 celcuis, or something like that.

 

[Colin_T]

76F (24C) is fine for most tropical fishes. The water can be anywhere between 64-86F (18-30C) for most tropical fishes but they are close to the extremes for them. 76-79F (24-26C) is optimum for most tropical fish.