Is My Cycle In Fast Forward Mode?

[ADW1988]

So day 10 o f my cycle and I'm getting v low ammonia readings and rocket high Nitrite, 36 hours ago i did the "full amount" for second time (extract is below [orange font]) and this morning I have less than 0.25ppm Ammonia and 5ppm Nitrite.
 
I'm a bit confused as it says snack should be given at days 21-27 (green font) but i seem to already have 0 readings for ammonia! I used the calculator and have twice used the full dose of ammonia (red font).. I have previously had a reading between 3-4ppm of ammonia so I know enough is going in.
 
Or am I just waiting for Nitrite to drop now? Then add the snack? I added a small amount of ammonia this morning (snack amount) as I didnt want the bacterisa to die off
Or am I in fast forward mode!!!
 
Sorry hope this makes sense
 
"If at any time you test and ammonia is under .75 ppm and nitrite is clearly over 2 ppm, it is time to add more ammonia. Add the same full amount as you did the first time. Now, begin to test the ammonia and nitrite levels every other day. (You should be seeing nitrate soon if you have the kit.)
 
After the second ammonia addition, while waiting for nitrite to rise, peak and drop, the bacteria will need a maintenance feeding. When you get two consecutive ammonia readings of 0 ppm, give the bacteria a “snack” by adding 1/3 of the full amount. This “snack” should be needed somewhere between days 21 and 27 of the cycle.
 
 

 

[fm1978]

It may be progressing a little quicker than the norm and it's certainly doing what it should be doing. 
 
Clearly the bacteria that breaks down ammonia has begun to grow and do it's job. Now all you need to wait for is the bacteria to build up that takes care of the nitrites. Then, obviously, you'll see the nitrites going down and nitrates being produced. It might be handy to know what your 'control' nitrate value is, i.e. the value straight from the tap in order to get a feel for the nitrates being produced in the filter. It's probably not essential to know that just right now, though.
 
Looking forward a little bit; having some live plants will help to naturally reduce nitrates as well as water changes (if you're tap nitrates are less than current in tank readings).
 
Good luck with your cycling! Hopefully the next stage goes as quickly as the first.

 

[ADW1988]

I believe out of the tap the nitrates a relatively low but will be testing again. I'm going to go for some live plants but havent put them in or bought them yet. Was going to wait till the end of the cycle as I've raised the temp.
 
Is it a good idea then to keep "snacking" the bacteria with ammonia at this point till the nitrites drop? Or leave it for now?
 
And thanks for the advice... I hope the second stage does too

 

[fm1978]

I'm no expert in fish-less cycling...I did it the WRONG way, but, I'd think keep snacking on the ammonia (not you personally, hehe) to keep the production of nitrite bubbling along nicely in order to seed that particular type of bacteria.

 

[ADW1988]

Ok brill.. Thanks very much..
I must say the smell of the ammonia is tempting!! haha!
 
Thanks v much

 

[daizeUK]

It's not a good idea to add snack ammonia too often, once every 4-5 days is fine.  The bacteria will easily survive that long without ammonia.
 
The problem is, the more ammonia you keep adding the higher your nitrite gets and the longer it takes to come down.

 

[ADW1988]

Ahh i see so maybe leave it 4-5 days now and hopefully see the Nitrites coming down,... Knew I shouldnt have put that "snack" in this morn.. oh well.. Seems I'm slightly ahead of schedule..

 

[TwoTankAmin]

The thing about cycling a tank is there is theory and there is practice. Every tank is different so moving from the theory to the practice varies in every tank. Some cycle exactly like it is laid out in the article, others seem to have their own way. This means some go faster and some go slower. Your's is going great.
 
The thing to remember in all of this is that it goes in stages. You add ammonia and there are not enough bacteria to process it all. So the bacteria start to reproduce. They convert more and more ammonia to nitrite and as this happens ammonia drops and nitrite rises. But the nitrite bacteria do not reproduce as rapidly as the ammonia ones. So long before you have sufficient bacteria to process all the nitrite, you have enough to handle all the ammonia and fast.
 
The problem that causes most cycles to stall or to crash is too much ammonia. Either one adds to much in terms or quantity and or frequency. You can know when you have too much ammonia on an API test because it would be 6.4 ppm. However, that ammonia gets converted to nitrite and that too if allowed to get too high can stall a cycle of even kill bacteria. The problem is the level at which this happens is about 16.4 ppm on the API kit. And now you are going to protest that the API kit only goes up to 5.0 ppm.
 
So what I did was to design a simple fishless cycling method which, if followed according to the directions with no embellishments, makes it impossible for one to ever have too much ammonia or nitrite. It is a variation on the one suggested by Dr, Timothy Hovanec who discovered the actual bacteria at work in tanks. This is the part of his method that resulted in the variation I devised:

Nitrite does not spike until somewhere between days 14 and 20. You want to be careful adding more ammonia because you do not want the nitrite-nitrogen over 5 mg/L as this will start to poison the nitrite-oxidizing bacteria. Add a little ammonia every few days (1/4 dose), making sure the nitrite does not go above 5 mg/L.

from http/www.drtimsaquatics.com/resources/how-to-start
 
That statement in red is measuring Nitrite-Nitrogen. The typical hobby test kit (like the API is one) measures in total ions. The two different scales are both accurate but not equal. It is similar to measuring temperature in C or F. The result is that 5 ppm of Nitrite-Nitrogen is equivalent to 16.4 ppm using the total ion scale typical of hobby test kits. The only way to use such a kit to read above its 5 ppm limit is to learn the proper way to perform accurate diluted tests.
 
So I had two options when I designed the method in the Cycling link/article on this site. I either had to teach folks how to perform accurate testing which would require additional equipment and a new way to do testing, something they are just learning to do normally, or I had to devise a method which eliminated the possibility of allowing too much nitrite to accumulate. I chose the latter.
 
Hopefully, this explains why it is fairly important that folks follow the directions. I will confess, I did build a bit of wiggle room into the process. It is possible to add a bit too much ammonia and still not kill or stall the cycle. This allowed for a bit of bad measuring by new fishkeepers.
 
My goal in all this was simple, make it easy to do, make it hard to mess up and make it work well most of the time. Because the components of everyone's tank water can be a bit different, cycling time will vary, but they should all basically follow the same pattern. Your temp may be 80 and another persons will bey at 76 and a third at 84. One persons KH is 3 and another's is 7, this can matter. And then there is pH, this too affects the speed of a cycle.
 
The thing to realize is that cycling is not a race. There is no prize for getting it done in 30 rather than 35 days nor any penalty for it taking 40 days instead of fewer. The goal is to make a tank safe for fish, and nothing more. Oh yes, it is also nice to minimize the stress level of the first time cycler because things go out of control

 

[ADW1988]

Wow thanks Twotank Amin, thats a lot of help and the article to begin with honestly is flawless, easy to understand and brilliant. You reached your goal with perfection. I just wanted a touch of further clarification with what to do now.  
 
I think I understand what you are saying.
 
In laymans terms should I now wait 4/5 days befor adding anymore ammonia? Or wait to see an obvious drop in Nitrite.. I'm not too concerned how long it takes tbh just want it right. 
 
Thanks for the reply

 

[TwoTankAmin]

If you have done the second full addition, then you will do the 1/3 snack dose after you get 2 readings for ammonia at 0. This is when you are testing every other day, So it takes at least 4 days after adding that 2nd full dose to get 2 zero readings. Full dose, wait 2 days to test, then test again in 2 days, so at least 4 days pass. The snack keeps the ammonia bacs happy and wont spike the nitrite enough to be a problem.
 
The ammonia bacteria might slow down a bit waiting for nitrite to drop, but it will not die off. When you get to the next full addition of ammonia, any drop off is quickly fixed by that feeding. The choice is between a small easily corrected drop off by the ammonia bacs which is perfectly fine or a spike in nitrite which might harm the cycle and is not fine. Don't forget, bottled bacteria remains viable for normal cycling for 6-12 months. Even then it isn't dead or useless, it will just help a lot less quickly. So if we don't feed the established ammonia bacs for a bit during the fishless cycle, it really won't be an issue.

 

[ADW1988]

Brilliant. Ironed out everything I need. Thanks for explaining. I can imagine you're thinking the 'Fishless cycling for dummies' book (if it existed) would be too advanced for me! Ha only kidding - I hope/think
 
Thanks again

 

[ADW1988]

Back to normal speeds now on my new tank..
 
Getting there..
 
Week 3
Ammonia: 0ppm (continuously)
Nitrites: +5ppm
Nitrates: 30ppm
 
Been adding the ammonia source every 4 days (1/3 measure).. n hoping to see the drop in nitrItes soon!! NitrAtes were at approx 10ppm last time i tested.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Stop adding the ammonia. One snack should be fine. By continually adding ammonia beyond what is suggested you run the risk of overwhelming the nitrite bacs. Remember they are on a lag but the ammonia ones are at full strength, they push any additional ammonia into nitrite very fast. And this is what can cause nitrite to rise to rapidly and too high.
 
If you are doing the diluted tests properly, do not let nitrite rise above 15 ppm (a bit of wiggle room left here) or you may start to harm the bacteria- both the ammonia and nitrite ones. One reason the method was designed as it is was it removed the need to do diluted testing but insuring nitrite could not get too high. What you are doing removes that safety net and makes it essential to do diluted testing right to make sure one doesn't stall the cycle or turn it backwards. My assumption was requiring diluted tested of new fish keepers was one more thing that could go wrong for which there really was no need. Many new folks have enough trouble doing the normal test properly let alone having to become a mini-lab and having to do diluted ones.

 

[ADW1988]

Ahh ok thanks Two tank... Will do..

 

[ADW1988]

Come on you Nitrites - agonisingly close to being fully cycled..
 
3ppm Ammonia processed to 0ppm well within 24hr
 
Nitrites taking 36+ hours (down from 48hrs)
 
Come on you little Bacteria.. Saturday coming will be 5 weeks