Interesting platy behavior, thoughts??

[theplatylover]

Hey guys,

I wanted to come on here and ask some questions about my platy fish. I've been keeping platies for about a year and a half. I have a total of 8 platies, one male and seven females, with a bunch of babies in a heavily planted 20g tall.

One of my female platies, Ava, was part of group of the first fish I introduced to the aquarium. She has grown to be the dominant female of the tank, chasing my male away whenever he attempts to breed. I have some questions about her behavior.

Ava has claimed this bottom area of the tank as her territory. She will swim around patrolling the area, and any fish that swims down in her territory, she will chase away. I've noticed a couple of interesting things about this, though

For starters, it seems like Ava likes to pick favorites. For example, if one of my other females Pearl or Daisy swim in her territory, she allows them to stay and won't chase them off. However, for example, if Kennedy, Sonic, (two females), or Gus, my male, swim in her territory, she will chase them off. I haven't observed her nip fins when she chases, more so ramming her head into their body to chase them off. None of the fish in the tank have nipped fins.

I know Ava isn't inherently an aggressive fish, because if she was she would nip any fish coming into her territory no matter what. Also, when she ventures off into other parts of the tank, she isn't aggressive, and actually gets along with all of the other fish. During feeding she isn't aggressive, and if any food drops towards the bottom of the tank, she won't chase away any fish that try to get in a few bites.

Is there a reason why Ava will pick on certain fish but not others? Most of these fish have known each other for a very long time, and they have all learned (for the most part) to stay out of Ava's space whenever she's down there. Other than Kennedy, my newest addition who will hopefully learn soon enough to mind her own business!

Thank you all for your advice!

 

[GaryE]

They have the ability to recognize other individuals, and they remember who plays by the rules, and who doesn't. What their rules are can be a mystery to humans, but they seem to exist. I'd take a guess and say the ones she accepts accept her as an alpha, and the others challenge her status.

 

[Colin_T]

In the wild, most female common livebearers (mollies, swords, platies, guppies) hang out in large groups consisting of between 20 & 50 (but sometimes up to 100 or more) females. These groups have a pecking order with the biggest most dominant female ruling the group and she has a group of girlfriends who back her up. All the other females live in the group but are lower down the pecking order.

The groups of females move around rivers and waterways looking for food and places to hang out. As the groups move around a few males follow the group and try to breed with any females. The groups of males have a pecking order too and the biggest male will bully his smaller mates.

In the confines of an aquarium, the males will constantly harass the females and try to breed with them. This puts undue stress on the females and if there are too many males constantly pestering the females, the females can get sick and die prematurely.

It is preferable to keep common livebearers in single sex tanks (either male or female but not both sexes together). If you want a group of males and females then have 1 male and at least 6 females (preferably 10 or more females per male) so the harassment is spread out over more females.

Female livebearers can carry up to 6 sperm packets (sometimes more) from breeding with males and they use 1 sperm packet to fertilise each batch of eggs. The gestation period (from the time she fertilises the eggs to when she gives birth to free swimming babies) is about 1 month. After which she will fertilise another batch of eggs using another sperm packet. This allows female livebearers to produce young about once a month for up to 6 months without any males being present.

If you want to breed livebearers for specific colours, then have a tank with females and let them give birth and use up all the sperm packets they are carrying in their body. Give them a few months without being pregnant and then add a male to the tank for a week before moving him out, or move the female/s into a tank with a male for a week and let them breed. Then move the females back into their own tank.

 

[emeraldking]

It's a hierarchy that's going on. A pecking order. The dominant one decides which ones she allowes to come near.

 

[theplatylover]

In the wild, most female common livebearers (mollies, swords, platies, guppies) hang out in large groups consisting of between 20 & 50 (but sometimes up to 100 or more) females. These groups have a pecking order with the biggest most dominant female ruling the group and she has a group of girlfriends who back her up. All the other females live in the group but are lower down the pecking order.

The groups of females move around rivers and waterways looking for food and places to hang out. As the groups move around a few males follow the group and try to breed with any females. The groups of males have a pecking order too and the biggest male will bully his smaller mates.

In the confines of an aquarium, the males will constantly harass the females and try to breed with them. This puts undue stress on the females and if there are too many males constantly pestering the females, the females can get sick and die prematurely.

It is preferable to keep common livebearers in single sex tanks (either male or female but not both sexes together). If you want a group of males and females then have 1 male and at least 6 females (preferably 10 or more females per male) so the harassment is spread out over more females.

Female livebearers can carry up to 6 sperm packets (sometimes more) from breeding with males and they use 1 sperm packet to fertilise each batch of eggs. The gestation period (from the time she fertilises the eggs to when she gives birth to free swimming babies) is about 1 month. After which she will fertilise another batch of eggs using another sperm packet. This allows female livebearers to produce young about once a month for up to 6 months without any males being present.

If you want to breed livebearers for specific colours, then have a tank with females and let them give birth and use up all the sperm packets they are carrying in their body. Give them a few months without being pregnant and then add a male to the tank for a week before moving him out, or move the female/s into a tank with a male for a week and let them breed. Then move the females back into their own tank.

I had no idea platies in the wild lived in such large groups, that's insane how they interact with each other with so many fish.

I guess it adds up though, Ava is definitely the largest platy in the aquarium so it makes sense why she is so bossy. My male doesn't even attempt to breed with her cause he knows she'll chase him away

I'm glad I have a proper M to F ratio, all over the internet i see information about how platies should be kept in a 1M 2F ratio, and I always questioned this as previously when I would have two males in my tank, they would fight till they killed each other and I would have to rehome the weaker one.

Like I said before I have 1M and 7F. Would it be appropriate to add more females to the tank, or am I good with what I have right now? My girls don't seem stressed out at all, however.

 

[theplatylover]

It's a hierarchy that's going on. A pecking order. The dominant one decides which ones she allowes to come near.

Thanks for your reply! It's so interesting seeing how these fish sort out their colony, comparing them from the first day I introduced them into the aquarium till now, their behavior and attitudes towards one another is so much different.

Do you think the hierarchy will change overtime theoretically if any fish are not added or removed?

 

[theplatylover]

They have the ability to recognize other individuals, and they remember who plays by the rules, and who doesn't. What their rules are can be a mystery to humans, but they seem to exist. I'd take a guess and say the ones she accepts accept her as an alpha, and the others challenge her status.

I've noticed that the fish that she's been living with her whole life in the tank, she doesn't really chase off when they swim in her territory, it's the more recent additions that were introduced after she was that don't get the memo and get chased off

I've also noticed that she'll chase away fish that are smaller than her, but the fishes that are much smaller than her she won't even bother. Is this because she doesn't see them as a threat?

 

[Colin_T]

Like I said before I have 1M and 7F. Would it be appropriate to add more females to the tank, or am I good with what I have right now? My girls don't seem stressed out at all, however.

I would leave it as is unless you want to add a new male and see if the dominant female will accept him as a breeding partner. But if you do add a new male, I would remove the old male while the new one is breeding with the females, and then move him out and put the original male back in (if you want him in there).

The big female doesn't care about the smaller females that have been in the tank for a while because they know their place and she doesn't have to remind them that they are lower down the pecking order.

The pecking order should not change over time if no new fish are added or removed. However, when the top female gets old, she may be overthrown by the next dominant female.

 

[emeraldking]

Thanks for your reply! It's so interesting seeing how these fish sort out their colony, comparing them from the first day I introduced them into the aquarium till now, their behavior and attitudes towards one another is so much different.

Do you think the hierarchy will change overtime theoretically if any fish are not added or removed?

When a pecking order starts to occur, it's mostly a temporary thing when everyone knows their place in the tank. But it differs per situation how long this will take.

 

[Back in the fold]

These groups have a pecking order with the biggest most dominant female ruling the group and she has a group of girlfriends who back her up.

Sounds like a prison movie .

 

[Colin_T]

Sounds like a prison movie .

also high school cheerleaders