Huge Cats

[andywg]

Hmm, after seeing a RTC x TSN hybrid my love and interest for these fine huge specimins has been rekindled.

I've always promised myself I'd keep at least an RTC once I had the room to build a tank/pond big enough to house one. Ideally though I'd like to keep more than a single fish in a tank.

So, my main point is, does anyone know the size I'd need to house say 3 or 4 fish of these size?

I know the recommended minimum for one is 12 x 4 x 4 (feet) - roughly 1,200 gallons and I understand I'd be looking at around a quarter of the final tank size as a filter.

Would 3,000 gallons be ok? (12 x 7 x 6 feet).

 

[Paul_MTS]

I reakon that would be fine for a few seeing as in a pond you would have quite a few big koi in there and a few sturgeon which get to about 3ft.

I don't think RTC can be kept togther, although ste2k keeps a couple of TSN's together, not sure how the hybrids would work together!!

 

[andywg]

Hmm, you may be right about the RTCs, I've never seen two together...Though they aren't exactly common...

I'm not sure if the comparison between Sturgeon and Koi size and Tropicals is too good since coldwater holds more oxygen than tropical, I still don't know (and it is not well documented) whether the huge tank size is purely for swimming room or if it has to do with the oxygen requirements of larger fish (hence why you have to be careful with the 1inch of fish per 10 square inches rule with large fish such as the silver shark).

But then, at 3,000 gallons it would be a huge pond (the fiance's dad has one that's 12 x 6 x 5 deep and that is a fair old size) and an even more impressive tank (though I dread the thickness of glass for a 6 foot deep tank).

This is the main problem I have with researching these fish, a lot of the information is quite sketchy at best. Most of the people I have found on the web who have built huge tanks have used them for SW and reefs. Still, I won't be moving for a while so plenty of time to research (and dream )

 

[CFC]

The reason RTC arent seen together is because no one can house a tank large enough for one let alone two or more, if you are keeping multiples then you need atleast 1200g per fish and this would be pushing it for space, 3000g for the first and then another 1500g per extra RTC would be a better volume.

 

[andywg]

Hmm, this project is getting bigger. Still, if I go the pond route it should be do-able. (though it would be around 13.5 x 8 x 6 feet. B) Large but not too bad, just need a way to effectively combat evaporation)

hmm, 4,500 gallon tank

 

[Paul_MTS]

whats the rule for tank size for TSN's?

thats another thing....can you keep tsn and rtc together?

That would be 1 awesome project, you could charge friends to come round and see it


Would be 1 huge filter on it, although would a big nexus with a answer fitted be efective for tropicals as there meant to be able to hangle quite a few kg's of food a day.

You could combat condensation by placing corigated polycarbonate on top....the stuff used for conservatory roofs.

 

[CFC]

The rule for keeping the big cats doesnt so much go on volume but on the footprint the tank provides, a full grown TSN at 40 inches requires nothing less than a 160x60x40" tank (roughly 13.5 feet long by 5 feet wide and nearly 3.5 feet tall), volume comes into the equasion when you want to add multiples of large fish because of the waste issue.

 

[Clare]

We have a Red Tail and hybrid species too, often labelled as a Yellow Tail or a Marbled Tail. We are growing them on at the moment in a tank 9 x 3 x 2, we have now got the fish room built and are looking towards getting the tank in the next year. We have also looked at the big Nexus filters and got a lot of advice from various people telling us they would be great for a project of this kind.

We have 2 Pseudodoras, or recently changed to Oxydoras Niger cats which are very peaceful fish and live mainly on the bottom of the tank, they sift sand to find food with their downturned mouthes. These might be worth researching as tankmates as we have known them live with Red Tail at Wharf Aquatics in Pinxton Nottingham (see their web page and look on virtual visit of the tropical fish house).

We also have a couple of Giraffe Cats and Granulosis Cats which make great tank mates, although I have heard that some Giraffe Cats can be a bit more of a problem.

Let us know what you think of the Nexus filters and any ideas of how you will do your big tank. There is a place advertised in PFK, called BOSS, Build On Site Specialists which offer really good prices and come to your house to build the tank as you want it. Maybe you would rather have a pond but we like the idea of side viewing the fish.

There are sites we have seen on the web whilst researching (when doing a search hundreds of sites come up), we have seen Red Tails and Tigers kept together in public aquaria ( more than one Red Tail with Shovel Nose), and they have been okay. Although you can get the rogue fish which turns out to not take any tankmates. It`s all down to having enough territory.

 

[andywg]

Hmm, I would love a tank, but it would cost too much for one large enough for me. I dread to think the cost of a 5-6 thousand gallon tank I will basically create a swimming pool (I think my last calculation was aroun 17 feet by 12 feet by around 7 deep) using breeze blocks and bricks (depends on structural strength required) and if possible cavity wall insulation to save on heating costs.

I will still get side viewing though, I essentially plant to have the pond 3 feet sunk into the ground and 4 feet above the ground allowing me to place a large acrylic viewing window (or possibly two smaller ones) on the side, somewhat similar to a number of zoo aquatic enclosures (think penguins )

As for filter, I plan on doing a large (I have been recommeneded at least 500 gallon, I was thinking 1,000 gallon) sump filter stuffed with something like alfagrog. My experience so far with sumps has been that once done properly they are a fantastic way to filter

But thanks all for your help so far!

Now, if anyone has any plans on heating the thing....?

I was considering a cheep Central Heating boiler and using underfloor heating pipes around the submerged part of the tank, could this work?

Or should I excavate a fire pit and get friendly with a coal miner?

 

[CFC]

For heating simply heat the entire room that the pond is in to a constant 30c or if this isnt possible try looking at swimming pool heaters.

 

[andywg]

Swimming pool heater!

So obvious yet so invisible to my clouded mind. B)

I like that idea a lot (especially since I may be able to utilise a trickle heater in the summer to assist with the heating through natural sunlight).

That's why I like you guys, curbs my stupidity

 

[andyj]

In the summer just pump the water through a couple of 'km' of black plastic piping covered in black plastic sheeting !!!

That's how a neighbour heats his pool during the summer, you'd be surprised how hot the water can get !!!

 

[andywg]

That's almost what I was thinking Andyj.

My uncle has a pool and since he retired he now sits on the East Midland REnewable enrgy board and he was trialling what was basically a black plastic radiator (about 3 foot by 2 foot) and even with the Midlands sun he was getting bath temparature water. Ideally, if I could rig a load onto the roof like and just pump it through it'd be cool. (and green B) saving the planet and all that )

I'd still need something for winter though. Not really enough sun in Southend to heat a 6,000 gallon pond. Nor a 6 pint pond come to that

Hmm, now all I have to do is work out the strengths I shall need for the construction needs. Google, here I come!

Andy

 

[bunjiweb]

Have you thought of having a covered garden tank? A simple tank, could be constructed from metal sheeting, glass, fibreglass mould?!.. Over this you simply have a marque with some hanging lights in for best viewing. With something like this you could still decor the tank, cover it from the worst of natures elements, and keep it warm much easier. Also it is a lot more convenient for viewing your fine specimens.

Just my 2p

Ben

 

[ecto1]

What you could do is dig a large pool, and then just put windows all round the sides. It's hard to describe, but some places like SeaWorld (in the US) and different aquariums have huge concrete pools, and you can go down to a lower level, and look at the fish through portholes. Some dolphin and manatee tanks at zoos also have those.

Or, if you've got a few million to spare - build an underwater world! At the Mall Of America in Bloomington, Minnesota, there's a HUGE aquarium, and you can walk through a big tunnel underneath the aquarium. It's simply amazing. Even if you can never build something like it, or even visit it, you should Google for some pictures - it's AMAZING. Of course, it's all saltwater - but it's neat to see sharks swim right above your head!