How Do I Lower Ph?

[thelaw]

i just setup my 75 gallon tank and the ph is to high its at 8.2!!! there is no fish in it yet and i need to get it down to about 7.0 pleas help!!!

 

[Dominus_XVIII]

There are a numerous ways to lower your PH, but does your water come out of the tap that high?
Usually when you setup a new tank, it's expected that the parameters willing be fluctuating. How long has your tank been running and what type of substrate/decor do you currently have in your tank?
You can lower your PH by running peat moss in your filter or adding driftwood or plants in the tank.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Lowering one's pH in a stable fashion, especially by the amount you indicate, is nowhere near as simple or easy as Don has indicated.
 
You need to alter more than the pH to change the pH and that means you are altering several parameters. Not only must you do this but in order to prevent water changes from changing those parameters, one usually need to pre-treat the changing water as well. You can get a good idea of what is involved by reading here http/fins.actwin.com/mirror/begin-chem.html
 
I have one tank I maintain at pH 6.0, I use ro/di water, and muriatic acid to do this since my tap is 7.1. I use digital meters for this.

 

[NeonTetraFish64500]

Put driftwood in the tank and that lowers the ph slowly and it's good decor. The are lots of other ways to do it though.

 

[thelaw]

There are a numerous ways to lower your PH, but does your water come out of the tap that high?
Usually when you setup a new tank, it's expected that the parameters willing be fluctuating. How long has your tank been running and what type of substrate/decor do you currently have in your tank?
You can lower your PH by running peat moss in your filter or adding driftwood or plants in the tank.

i am using gravel there are no decor in it and i cant do plants i am puting my big jaguar cichlid in it

 

[DrRob]

The question on tap water pH is important. What you're starting with makes a big difference. Then you can look at what's changing it. Substrate can be an issue occasionally if it's heavily limestone based, as the surface area is huge, which is why it's used to buffer tanks to get the pH up in Malawi tanks and reef systems.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Please explain to us all how one piece of driftwood lowers pH and holds it there in a stable fashion over time. Do you weigh the wood to determine its effect? Does it matter what kind of wood? Did you even read the link I offered. In ow many tanks are you doing controlled parameter changes?
 
If one does not understand the advice they are giving. It may be best not to offer it?
thelaw, please read the link I offered and then come back with your questions. At least that way you will have abasis for understanding what is involved. just a quick preview:
 

 
One can raise or lower pH by adding chemicals. Because of buffering, however, the process is difficult to get right. Increasing or decreasing the pH (in a stable way) actually involves changing the KH. The most common approach is to add a buffer (in the previous section) whose equilibrium holds the pH at the desired value......
 
Muriatic (hydrochloric) acid can be used to reduce pH. Note that the exact quantity needed depends on the water's buffering capacity. In effect, you add enough acid to use up all the buffering capacity. Once this has been done, decreasing the pH is easy. However, it should be noted that the resultant lower-pH water has much less KH buffering than it did before, making it more susceptible to pH swings when (for instance) nitrate levels rise. Warning: It goes without saying that acids are VERY dangerous! Do not use this approach unless you know what you are doing, and you should treat the water BEFORE adding it to the aquarium.
 
Products such as ``pH-Down'' are often based on a phosphoric acid buffer. Phosphoric acid tends to keep the pH at roughly 6.5, depending on how much you use. Unfortunately, use of phosphoric acid has the BIG side effect of raising the phosphate level in your tank, stimulating algae growth. It is difficult to control algae growth in a tank with elevated phosphate levels. The only advantage over hydrochloric acid is that pH will be somewhat better buffered at its lower value.
Peat moss softens water and reduces its hardness (GH). The most effective way to soften water via peat is to aerate water for 1-2 weeks in a bucket containing peat moss. For example, get a (plastic) bucket of the appropriate size. Then, get a large quantity of peat (a gallon or more), boil it (so that it sinks), stuff it in a pillow case, and place it in the water bucket. Use an air pump to aerate it. In 1-2 weeks, the water will be softer and more acidic. Use this aged water when making partial water changes on your tank.

 

[DrRob]

Now then, lets stay on topic and not dissolve down into a debate about the scientific merit of bits of advice. There's the scientific section for things like that. I see nothing wrong with passing on collected wisdom, nor with challenging collected wisdom, but play nice.
 
We need to hear from the OP again as to what tap water we're dealing with and a few other bits and pieces to take this topic on.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Dr Rob- there is absolutely no way lower pH in a controlled stable fashion using drift wood or peat in a filter. This is not opinion, it is fact. So telling folks to do this will not solve their problems and it may actually create problems. If anything to do with science is removed from the rest of the forum and consigned to the scientific section then there is almost nor information left folks really need.
 
Things we should not continue to discus in the forums except in the scientific section:
 
Anything to do with water parameter such as pH, GH, KH, salinity, etc. This includes changing them.
Anything to do with cycling.
Anything to do with testing.
Anything to do with fish diseases or the meds used to treat them.
Scientific names for anything in a tank.
Anything to do with plants, ferts, lighting and co2 levels in terms of the plants.
 
I can keep listing but there is no need.
 
Take the science out of this hobby and you are left with very little real knowledge. Imo, this is one of the few shortcomings of this site, too little science and too much urban aquarium myth. If nobody ever challenges the myths with science, they will persist. Were it not for science readers on this site would still be cycling using 5 ppm of ammonia. I gave the OP a great link where he could learn about what he asked. But, I will bow to administrative pressure and from here on in will refrain from posting anything to do with science on this forum except for in the scientific section. Anybody who may want my input on such issues can either send me a PM or catch me in chat. Problem solved.

 

[DrRob]

I worded that badly, not on full form today. It should have read something more along the lines of there being nothing wrong with passing on collected wisdom, so long as you're open to being challenged by new ideas, but try to keep those discussions in the scientific section as it clogs up advice topics and makes them hard for the OP to get answers on.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Appreciate that Dr R- but when one is discussing altering water params and holds them there is a stable fashion, it is basically all science. That was the point I was trying to make. I lower pH and TDS in a couple of tanks and have for about the past 18 months. I was in this hobby for 10+ years before I would even consider trying this. And I am still learning.

 

[AeonMapa]

Hi, I just want to say that many fish are quite adaptable, and its possible your jaguar cichlid will get used to your tap PH. If not would you consider other fish? Adjusting ph is tricky and takes a lot of time and precision and if not done properly will stress a fish out more than a less than ideal ph would in the first place

 

[thelaw]

Hi, I just want to say that many fish are quite adaptable, and its possible your jaguar cichlid will get used to your tap PH. If not would you consider other fish? Adjusting ph is tricky and takes a lot of time and precision and if not done properly will stress a fish out more than a less than ideal ph would in the first place

moi will not consider I different fish I allrdy have this fish and I paid $90 for him but thanks for the help I will take all the help I can

 

[AeonMapa]

well like I said, the jag will probably get used to the high ph, its safer than messing with it and forcing him to constantly adapt. You can try adding peat moss to your filter, adding driftwood and almond leaves to your tank, these are good buffers and will help keep the PH lower

 

[TwoTankAmin]

They will only keep the pH lower until any one of a number of things happens.
 
1. You change the water.
2. You forget to renew them when the time comes.
3. You have nothing else in the tank working against you such as the wrong rocks, substrate or a number of possible additives.
 
 
But the real issue isn't simply the pH, its all the other parameters. Plus, lower pH fish tend to live in softer water, so you may need to deal with that as much as or mare than the pH.
 
Changing parameters in a controlled fashion and then keeping them stable is not as simple as adding wood or peat etc.