Hi Y'all

[The_Bullard]

Hey, been stalking the forums for a week or two and thought I would introduce myself. Though I'm not sure how much i'll actually be posting since I don't actually own any fish at the mo.

I do want to say though, that this place is awesome. I've basically had all of October to waste so thought I'd spend some of my spare time researching a hobby I've had an interest in for a while. Read a few books, but they must be out of date or pretty vague as I've learnt much more from this forum. The beginner resource centre you have and all the indexes, on top of the journals, countless problems solved and links to other resource sites. You don't tend to get this much information and a friendly community to go with it.

Anywho, as fitting with nOOb etiquette, I do have a few questions. I'm looking to set up a community tank (as large as i can afford), but it won't be for a few months, need to save up my pennies and such. So I have plenty of time to individually research the fish I want and their requirements. I have an idea of what I want in terms of species and numbers, but I'm still a little unsure of what size tank I would need (Litres, US Gallons, Inches, Feet... too many #41#### measurements!).

I'd like to go biotope specific, maybe some leaway on the actualy countires they originate from and such. Anyway what I was thinking as a stock list:

2x Schooling Species - Would want them to contrast, so I was initially thinking of 10 x Cardinals & 10 x Black Widow Tetras.
1x Bottom Dwelling Species - Was thinking a school of Corydoras; Pandas, Peppered or Bronze. 6 or more of these.
2x Trio of Dwarf Cichlids - I was thinking a trio of cave brooders, Apistogramma's. And a trio of open brooders, Rams, Dicrossus or Cleithracara. I've only done some broad research into the Cichlids so not entirely on which fish I should go for, I do like the look of Checkerboard Cichlid though.

I would be interested in adding some invertebrates in as well, some shrimp maybe? (I know this goes against the South American theme...). I've a LFS that has Swan Mussels for sale, would anyone recommend these? Apaprently they aid in keeping the water clean.

So could anyone give me an approximate tank size needed to keep the suggested listing?

And would it be more cost effective to purchase a new tank with equipment or do it seperatly? I see a lot of tanks coming up in classifieds which or obviously much cheaper than buying brand new. The only advantage i see to buying the packages (if it's not cheaper) is that you can start up cycling basically straight away.

Sorry for all the questions, and rambling. Any help would be appreciated though, cheers! Gav.

 

[colleen0309]

Good morning and welcome to the forum! I don't know much about the dwarf cichlids so I really can't tell you what size tank they would require. Without doing any research on them ,I'd say a 55 gallon would be great for that mix, atleast to start. Don't take my word for it. Do a little research and see what they require. I do know if you are going to get corys, you will want a sandy substrate. I'd be alittle hesitant on addind the swan mussell. Do they dig into the substrate to live? If they do, be careful. If it dies and you can't find it, it will cause an ammonia bomb in your tank.
As for getting a new aquarium or a used one, I just bought a 75 gallon w/hood and light off of Craigs List for $60. I shop ebay for filters and heaters. If you buy used, either have the person you are buying it from fill it to make sure it doesn't leak, or be ready to fill it slowly yourself and reseal it if you need to. Resealing an aquarium can be alittle intimidating, but it's actually pretty easy. Getting all of the old sealant off is the hardest part.
Whatever you decide to do, take your time. While you save your money do lots of research. Get the size tank you will need, the right filter you will need for that size tank, cycle your filter and research your fish. Good luck on your new hobby!!

 

[The_Bullard]

Hey

Thanks for the response. Yeah I was planning on a sand substrate in a planted tank and a few caves/hiding spots. I'm not sure how well Cory's mix with cave brooders, I've read that they are quite inquisitive and with the Cichlids territorial aggression I'm not sure what effect it could have on them.

Again not sure about the Mussells, not found a whole lot of information on them, but I don't think they ccompletely submerse themselves in the sand. Probably wrong though, heh.

Would the 55 Gallon be better long and short for this stocking?

I might look into the classifieds and ebay a bit more, see what kind of deals are out there.

Cheers!

 

[fluttermoth]

I'd say a four foot/55g tank is a great size to start with; most of the standard tropical fish will go in a tank of that size.

Don't get swan mussels; they'll only die; there's just not enough current or food for them to survive in aquariums.

 

[Dieses Madchen]

Definitely shop craigslist or ebay for a tank. I have gotten all of my tanks second hand (40g, 55g, 65g, and 75g) and paid under 300 buck total for all 4. You may need to shop around for good filters and such, and I don't recommend buying the kits as most the time the filters are not the best, in my experience that is. The good thing is, because you know its going to be a few months before you can do anything, make a list of what you need, and piece it together....a few things here and there. That is what I have been doing with my newest aquarium setup. Good luck and welcome!

 

[colleen0309]

I did a little research for you. From what I could find, a 45 gallon, or a 40 gallon breeder would be good for the stocking you are planning. The apistos and rams can be kept together along with the other fish you want. Basically, it depends on the specific species you want to keep. Some have different temperature requirements. Cories can be kept with both as long as you can match up the temperature requirements. Same goes for the the tetras. For example, German Blue Rams like very warm water (84-88F). If you want German Blue Rams, you would need to pick other species that likes warmer water. It just takes a little planning.
The swan mussells should not be kept in an aquarium. They are very hard to feed properly. They should only be kept in ponds or by an experienced aquarist. They can and will die unexpectantly and pollute your tank. If you decide to keep these, please do lots of research on how to care for them. I had asian pond clams in all of my tanks at one time. They didn't do well at all. I removed them and put them back in the ponds and they seem to be doing great.They are filter feeders and should be fed a liquid food for filter feeders.
A 40 breeder or 45 would work but a 55 would be best

 

[The_Bullard]

Just had a gander on Craigslist, I don't think it's used as much over in the UK (except in London by the looks of things).

Had a look through the caresheets on here and various other sites, just to compare temperatures and pH levels to ensure they would be comfortable together. Stocking I'd like after this would be:

10 x Black Widow Tetras
10 x Cardinals
6 x Bronze Cory's
3 x Checkerboard Cichlid
3 x Umbrella Cichlid

Temperatures level around 25C and pH around 6. Obviously going to look it them more, this was just browsing. I've seen online that a general rule of thumb to prevent overcrowding is 1 inch of fish per litre? Or is it gallon?... Anyway, in one of the books I bought (bit out dated me thinks) states that it's more of 1 inch of fish per 12 sq inch of tank surface area. Quick google and found a 55 Gallon tank at dimensions of 48x13x20, which gives a surface area sq inch of 624, divide that by 12 and... 52 inch of fish. And a quick calculation of maximum size proposed stocking is... 76 inch of fish. So going off of this method the tank would be overstocked, and if it's fish to gallon ratio it would be too.

Am I over analyzing this though?

 

[DrRob]

Apistos and Corys often don't get on so well. They're both bottom dwelling fish and territories tend to cross.

 

[The_Bullard]

Would having numerous caves/hiding spots and having the tank well planted reduce the negative interactions between the two? Given room would the Cory's respect the territories of the Apistos?

 

[colleen0309]

From what I read yesterday, remember, I don't have apistos, so I can not speak from experience, certian species of apistos and cories will get along, others will not. So I guess research is the best way to go. Even then, you may have problems with certian fish. Fish are like people, not all of one species will get along.