Hi New To Fish Keeping Could Use Some Help.

[dalios]

Hi
 
I am a new fish keeper and could do with some help. I have a 180litre juwel tank with the built in juwel filter 3.0 bioflow and also running a external filter my temp is at 26/78 i cleaned all gravel in the tank etc filled with water, conditioned the water with tetra aquasafe left for 24hours then added tetra safestart and added 4 fish as stated (4 mollies for now) the next day my water went quite cloudy i did read that this is normal due to a few things hoping in the next day or so this will clear up, my fish all seem active and fine, using my api liquid test kit ammonia is reading 0.25ppm nitrite 0ppm nitrate 0ppm just over 24hours after adding the fish. I have read a lot into fish keeping and there are many different things said just need some advice what to do next when to do first partial water change, when to add more fish how often to feed etc, i did read to do a water change 7-14days later if ammonia stays down then add more tetra safestart. Any help will be very grateful. Thanks

 

[Gruntle]

Since you're now in a fish-in cycle, you need to keep a close eye on your ammonia and nitrite. I'd recommend testing at least twice a day. Once they get above zero (as you have now) you need to do massive water changes (at least 75%). Test the water before adding it to the tank.
 
Adding plants will help a bit, but you really need to keep an eye on it. You can also add some salt to the water (can't remember off the top of my head how much) as soon as you see nitrites, which will help the fish avoid nitrite poisoning. Nitrite is far more dangerous for fish than ammonia, but you essentially have no bacteria (unless you got lucky with your Safestart, most people would agree it's probably not going to work) to convert the ammonia to nitrite and then nitrate.
 
Cloudy water is normal, it sorts itself out eventually (my experience is usually within a week), you don't need to add any clarifiers to the water.
 
Best of luck, keep us posted. Your fish will (probably not) thank you, but they will be healthier.

Oh, and I wouldn't add any more fish until you are certain that you're getting 0/0 on ammonia and nitrite readings for at least a week. This could be several weeks away. The best news is you've got a decent sized tank so there's plenty of water to dilute the ammonia and nitrite (but keep checking and doing water changes).
 
Feed them once a day (and many people skip a day a week) with just enough food to be consumed in a couple of minutes, as a rough guide a fish stomach is about the same size as it's eye, so 4x the size of a molly's eye is enough.

 

[dalios]

Thanks for the quick reply on this, as i said i am new to this and read a lot about it all, many rated the safestart and on the bottle it said to add fish straight after i add the safestart, wish i registered on here before hand. Its hard when you dont know too much about it as many people say different things, i read a post on here when using safestart dont change the water for 7-14 days unless you see ammonia reach toxic levels and my local fish store said feed twice a week for the first 2 weeks! But i also see a lot being said that most lfs dont really know what there talking about.
 
I will as you say keep doing regular tests but really i haft to do 75% water changes? i also read that never to do over a 50% water change? so many different ways that people say so i never really know what to go by.
 
I still have about half a bottle of safestart at any point should i add more to the tank?
 
Also glad to know the water will clear as it is really cloudy.
 
Another quick question i got an external filter with the uv bulb, are these anygood?
 
Thanks

 

[attibones]

Anyway you can return the fish? A cycle is easiest to do with no fish. It's faster and more humane and you never have to worry about daily 75% or more water changes.
 
Every time you get an ammonia reading, you must (unless you want to risk your fish dying of ammonia/nitrite poisoning) change the water. The bigger the water change, the better because you'll be getting the ammonia closer to zero. If you can return the fish, you'll be able to add ammonia up to about 3-4ppm and wait until the bacteria grow and transform that ammonia to nitrite and then that nitrite to nitrate. The process usually takes four to six weeks without fish. 

 

[Gruntle]

Don't panic, many of us followed the advice given when we purchased our tanks, thinking those who sell fish have the welfare of said fish in mind. I lost nearly a dozen fish in my first year before my tank settled properly.

It would be best if you could return your fish, but I've had zero luck getting a LFS to take something back once they've got their hands on my money. The next best option is to closely monitor your water conditions and do all you can to make sure your fish don't suffer.

If you can get your hands on some Dr Tim's One and Only, you may be able to get some good bacteria into your setup, it's about the only reliably useful product to speed up your cycle. The other option, if you have friends who keep fish, is to swap some of your filter media (sponges, bio-balls, ceramic tubes) for about 1/4 (no more than 1/3 though) of what's in their established tank. Your fish store may also sell or give away media from their tanks, this may give you a kick-start on cycling.

 

[dalios]

Very true you would think a fish store would know what they are talking about as they have tons of set ups, i dont think returning fish will be an option as you can tell it is just one of them shops, no i dont have anyone with a tank set up which is a pain.
 
Its crazy all the stuff you need to know when i was quite young i had a tropical tank i new nothing about the hobbie and i used to do 100% water changes when the water got dirty cleaned the filters etc then put the fish back in when the water warmed up, think i lost about 2 fish out of 20 over 6months of doing this, but this time i wanted to do everything properly.
 
Thanks for all the advice i will keep doing water tests and changes and hope i come out lucky and get through the cycle without loosing my fish.
 
Should i use more of the safestart at any point? It may give it a little boost i guess and also i will look for some of that dr tims stuff.
 
thanks

 

[dalios]

Also someone posted this to this forum that i read, let me know what you think?
 
 
Hi there,

Wow, lots of questions! All are pretty simple, and we get them a lot too. I'll suggest marketing address them on our website, next time they update it. Out of curiosity, what forum is it?

So...where to begin? First, ideally you should set up the tank, and let it run at least 24 hours, then, shortly before you head off to the store for your first fish, add TSS to the tank. Within two hours, you should
add the fish. Our normal recommendation is to add one small fish per ten gallons of water. However, you CAN fully stock the tank, you just need to keep a close eye on it, and be sure to not complicate  matters by overfeeding as well. We recommend this method for African cichlid tanks since it is best to fully stock such a tank from the beginning due to territorial issues. For a novice fish-keeper, we'd recommend the one small fish per ten gallons rule for the first two weeks. Within two weeks, TSS should have fully cycled the tank and they can start slowly adding more fish, one at a time.

In regards to ammonia products, yes, they kill TSS. Any type, whether a chloramines remover or detoxifier, etc, anything that says it locks up ammonia or removes ammonia. Do not add TSS for 24 hours after using such a product, and do not add such a product for at least 7 days after using TSS. The bacteria is housed in a special stabilized solution of ammonia, so if you remove/lock up the ammonia, you remove all of the food the bacteria require to live.
 
If you already have fish, and are having an ammonia issue, it is best to get the ammonia levels down to below 4.0. 4.0 and higher is just as toxic to TSS as it is to fish. While 2.0 -3.5 PPM ammonia may harm some of the TSS bacteria, it should still have some effect. You may want to do a second dose several days after adding the first one, if you are not seeing the results you want. Keep in mind, these are bacteria, not a chemical, so results are slow to see. Give the product at least 5-7 days.

Best temperature for TSS is between 40 and 80 degrees. Freezing and extreme heat will destroy it. Refrigeration is okay, but not necessary. You can test the water any time, but really, you should probably wait at least 48 hours. We expect TSS to start slowly seeding the tank, and making a difference in about that time. You have to have some ammonia occur in the tank to provide the cycle needed, so it will usually create levels or reduce levels to around 1.0-1.5 ppm, and they should stay there for a week to 14 days, and then come down. Sorry, these levels would be for both ammonia and nitrite. These are considered stress, but not toxic, levels, and should not cause any long term damage to the fish.

We recommend waiting two weeks before a water change. Of course, if for some reason, the levels go up to a high level again, we would recommend a change at that point, and another dose. Usually, the hobbyist has done something wrong the first time, in such cases.
 
Nope, bacteria should not affect the pH.

Hmmm....be sure the levels are not already toxic, shake the container thoroughly, be sure to add the right dosage, do not use an ammonia detoxifying product, and be patient. It won't give you zero readings in an hour, like some folks think. By the way, carbon does not affect it but uv lights do...we get those questions too. And just an interesting point...the large aquariums, such as the Georgia Aquarium, and the Shedd Aquarium, as well as huge research labs in this country and other countries, also use TSS as well as the saltwater version Bio Spira.

If I have not addressed all of your questions, please let me know.

Regards,

Tetra Care

 

[majerah1]

Welcome! 
 
Wow, I really wish more pet stores would give better advice. Main thing to do is to watch your levels as everyone has already said. As for the safe start stuff, it is argued as to if it actually does anything or not. For what its worth, you could have gotten the bacteria cloud and .25 on the ammonia with just the fish content added, depending on if they were well fed before purchase and they deficated in the water column. I personally would not use it but I guess it could be left to choice.

 

[dalios]

I know majerah pet stores seem to know nothing which is madness really, and hard for myself when i am new to this and not knowing what i am really doing. I am just going to keep a close eye on it keep doing water tests and hope it all goes well, i did another test today ammonia was still at 0.25 nitrite 0 nitrate 0 if it gets up i will do a water change and go from there. I have seen a few on here say they highly rate the safestart to cycle a tank and would recommend this so i am hoping it works and i keep my fish alive and healthy. Will keep posted on how i do over time

 

[fishman2014]

welcome to the forum