Help Reading This Ph And Loss Of Fish After Water Changes

[thrujenseyes]

Thanks!

I'm going to keep my eye out for those plants.

I got the low front plant at petsmart ...it was one of those prepackaged snail and pest free ones. I know it had the word cardinal in it.

I'm fairly sure the other one is also from there and was same packaging

 

[Mark Z.]

Gotcha!

 

[thrujenseyes]

All has been well for quite a while (knock wood). Fish seem happy and healthy as do the shrimp and my nerite even came out of a two month hiding and is all over the tank nomming away.

I tested the water this am (5 days since water change...been doing 50% every 7 days with 50 untreated tap and 50 ro).

All same except for gh which seems to have really jumped up from a solid 75 to almost exact color of the 300 mark!?

Ph: 6.8-7.2
Kh: 40-80
Chlorine: 0
Gh: up to 300
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 0
Also checked ammonia: 0

I did add some (not even the dose for 6 gallons, a little more than half) of flourish comprehensive after water change because plants looked a little sad.

Also last night I had to shove some plants back into substrate stirring up the icky bottom.

Could either of those be the cause?! I will do a water change when I get home from work but I'm baffled...

Any ideas?

 

[StevenF]

I did add some (not even the dose for 6 gallons, a little more than half) of flourish comprehensive after water change because plants looked a little sad.

Good choice with adding the flourish. The big problem with RO water is that is has no nutrient in it. So if you use 100% RO you need to fertilizer. However in this case you are just using enough of it to soften your water to maintain a stable GH. I had thought that 50% was not enough to cause a nutrient deficiency. But apparently It was.

So if you continue to use RO you will need to add flourish. However in your case you do have an alternative. You can bypass your well blue bullet water conditioner and and use well water directly. If I recall it is rather soft water and not nearly as hard as your tap water.As long as you give it enough time to outgas it is safe to add to your aquarium. And that should have higher amounts of nutrients in it than they 50% RO mix you are currently using.

Just be sure to always outgas your water before use to stabilize its PH and try and keep your GH stable by mixing in your very hard tap water or or RO water with flourish. The flourish should only be needed with the RO water.

 

[thrujenseyes]

Good choice with adding the flourish. The big problem with RO water is that is has no nutrient in it. So if you use 100% RO you need to fertilizer. However in this case you are just using enough of it to soften your water to maintain a stable GH. I had thought that 50% was not enough to cause a nutrient deficiency. But apparently It was.

Yes, I guess not. My plants are definitely suffering. The little ground cover plants are not bright green anymore and just look lifeless.
My anubias and amazon sword are still doing well and seem unbothered.
But my tall feathery plant (can't remember the name) is getting beat up pretty bad. Almost melting. The leaves are getting see thru and shedding and creating quite a mess.
This is the plant that always grew like mad that I had to prune every week and a half.

So if you continue to use RO you will need to add flourish.

How much and how often should I dose? Just the amount of water I'm adding? And should I dose at water change time? I no longer use prime.

You can bypass your well blue bullet water conditioner and and use well water directly. If I recall it is rather soft water and not nearly as hard as your tap water.As long as you give it enough time to outgas it is safe to add to your aquarium. And that should have higher amounts of nutrients in it than they 50% RO mix you are currently using.

I really like this idea very much but we were a little concerned as we weren't quite sure what the exact ph of the direct well water is as it registers the lowest number. But I suppose I could just keep adding filtered tap to bring it up?! Correct? And would I have to add prime back in if I were to do this?
I think I will do some testing of that in the week to come.

Just be sure to always outgas your water before use to stabilize its PH

I have been mixing what I need in a bucket and keeping it overnight in the powder room to outgas. I've had to put it in the tub lately and let hot water surround to bring up the temp. the last few weeks and it works great.

Thanks for showing up and offering more help. Seems I always need it

 

[StevenF]

I really like this idea very much but we were a little concerned as we weren't quite sure what the exact ph of the direct well water is as it registers the lowest number. But I suppose I could just keep adding filtered tap to bring it up?! Correct?

No! Don't ever add your tap or well water directly to the tank. Always let it outgas first. We know there is a gas in the water and we know it makes your water acidic. We also know that this acidic water was killing your fish. You always need to let it outgas.

 

[thrujenseyes]

No! Don't ever add your tap or well water directly to the tank. Always let it outgas first. We know there is a gas in the water and we know it makes your water acidic. We also know that this acidic water was killing your fish. You always need to let it outgas.

I understood what you meant and the importance of outgassing.

My question was that since we don't know the exact ph of the straight well water since it registers at 6 ...I can just keep adding the filtered tap to bring it up...
correct?
**outgassing two buckets, one of direct well. One of filtered tap. After 24 hours test the direct well and add filtered tap until it's close to tank**

Adding the mixture to the tank once it reaches close to what's already in the tank.

 

[StevenF]

My question was that since we don't know the exact ph of the straight well water since it registers at 6 ...I can just keep adding the filtered tap to bring it up...
correct?

No. If you do that and get the ph where you want it and then wait for it to outgas what will the PH be? It will change how much we don't know. At the same time the PH in the aquarium has changed because plants have absorbed nutrients in the water.

If you try to match PH you will never get it exactly right. If you look at all my comments in the past I never advised you to adjust PH to match the aquarium. As long as the PH of the aquarium and the water added is within 1 of each other you are not going to have any problem. At that point the most important water parameter to match is GH. Which is why I always said to maintain a stable GH. Not PH.

As long as you let the water outgas it should be safely above 6. Just monitor the PH and verify it doesn't change radically. Don't fixate on PH because you still need to watch GH, KH, and nitrogen levels.

 

[thrujenseyes]

No. If you do that and get the ph where you want it and then wait for it to outgas what will the PH be? It will change how much we don't know. At the same time the PH in the aquarium has changed because plants have absorbed nutrients in the water.

If you try to match PH you will never get it exactly right. If you look at all my comments in the past I never advised you to adjust PH to match the aquarium. As long as the PH of the aquarium and the water added is within 1 of each other you are not going to have any problem. At that point the most important water parameter to match is GH. Which is why I always said to maintain a stable GH. Not PH.

As long as you let the water outgas it should be safely above 6. Just monitor the PH and verify it doesn't change radically. Don't fixate on PH because you still need to watch GH, KH, and nitrogen levels.

I'm just going to keep going on this path with half RO and half Tap as it's been working very well (knock wood).

Haven't lost a single fish and everyone is super happy...
well, except my plants.

I'm about to do some research on low tech plants as maybe I can swap out the ones that aren't doing so hot with some new ones.

My question to you is how much and often should I be dosing Comprehensive?
Since I'm really only treating half the water in my tank (which is RO)....correct?

I've only shot about .2ml in there maybe 4 times in the past few months because I'm so scared after my excel nightmare.

Thanks again

 

[StevenF]

Flourish comprehensive is not higher corrosive like flourish Excel is. I have experimented with higher than recommended dosages and seen no adverse effects.

 

[thrujenseyes]

Flourish comprehensive is not higher corrosive like flourish Excel is. I have experimented with higher than recommended dosages and seen no adverse effects.

ok great! I will follow directions on dosing half of my tank (since half is RO).
Thank you!

 

[thrujenseyes]

Hi Guys! I sure hope this will show in your alerts so I can get some great opinions like I did the first go around.

It's been about 6 months since I tested all of the water in my house.
Direct from well.
Tap that's run thru softner
and the tank.

I figured the tap has probably changed a little since it's been a few months and the crushed coral that was added is probably less potent.

The numbers have changed a bit and I wanted to make sure I'm still doing right by my inhabitants (which remain the same. 4 Endlers, 2 Otos, 1 Amano shrimp, 1 Sunkist Shrimp and 1 Nerite Snail.

My old readings from 09/16:

Tap sitting out 4 days (run thru the bullet): Fresh Well water (shut valves to bullet)

PH = 7.5 PH = 6.2
KH = 80 KH = 0
chlorine = 0 chlorine = 0
GH = 200 GH = between 25-75 (50)
Nitrite = 0 Nitrite = 0
Nitrate = 10 Nitrate = 10

Ok, now yesterday I tested Outgassed Tap, Outgassed Well and My Tank water at 7 days (day of water change but prior to):

OGTap: Tetra Test Kit
PH= 6.2-7.8
KH= 40
chl= 0
GH= 75
Nitrite= 0
Nitrate= maybe 10 hard to tell

OG Tap: API Test Kit:
PH=6.4
nitrite= 0
nitrate=0
ammonia=0

OG Well: Tetra Test Kit
PH=6.2
KH=0
chlo=0
GH=25
nitrite=0
nitrate=maybe 10 hard to tell

OGWell: API Test Kit
PH=6.0 (could be much lower?!)
nitrite= 0
nitrate= 0
ammonia=0

Tank Water right before weekly 50% water change (worst it gets):Tetra Test Kit
PH=6.8-7.2
KH=80
chlo=0
GH150
nitrite=0
nitrate=0

same but API Test Kit:
PH=7.6
High Range PH=same 7.6
nitrite=0
nitrate=0
ammonia=0

I know that's a lot of information but It's very precise as I want to know exactly what's going on and what I should be doing to keep things on an even keel.

I w/c 50% weekly on Mondays with 50%RO or Distilled and 50% outgassed Tap (which is apparently changing a bit). My PH, KH and GH seem to rise when in tank but my other levels (dangerous) remain 0...which is I believe what we wanted with the inhabitants I have. I do have a tiny bit of crushed coral (aragonite (sp?!) in the filter that I put there in September and a little shell.

Am I still ok with my weekly water change the way it is?

 

[StevenF]

I don't see anything to worry about in your latest test numbers.

I figured the tap has probably changed a little since it's been a few months and the crushed coral that was added is probably less potent.

It doesn't loose potency. However there is probably less in your water system. It slowly dissolves over time. Everything right now appears stable for you.

At the time you first posted i was just adding Flourish comprehensive to my RO water. Now I add sulfur to my aquarium. My plant growth at the time we first started talking I was not that great. I later figured out that i was low on sulfur and started adding a little bit of GH booster (similar Sachem equilibrium). This increased my calcium and sulfate levels and that has helped my Anacharis . My other plants are still struggling a little bit. I think if I remove my anacharis (a fast grower and just stock slow growing plants I might get more consistent growth. But I haven't tried that yet.

You might want to consider trying a sulfate GH booster.

 

[thrujenseyes]

I don't see anything to worry about in your latest test numbers.



It doesn't loose potency. However there is probably less in your water system. It slowly dissolves over time. Everything right now appears stable for you.

At the time you first posted i was just adding Flourish comprehensive to my RO water. Now I add sulfur to my aquarium. My plant growth at the time we first started talking I was not that great. I later figured out that i was low on sulfur and started adding a little bit of GH booster (similar Sachem equilibrium). This increased my calcium and sulfate levels and that has helped my Anacharis . My other plants are still struggling a little bit. I think if I remove my anacharis (a fast grower and just stock slow growing plants I might get more consistent growth. But I haven't tried that yet.

You might want to consider trying a sulfate GH booster.

Oh ok, great tip! Thank you!

Oddly after all of that I came home to a dead endler yesterday?!
I hadn't lost a fish since back in September before I figured all of this out.

All the levels were just what was stated. I'd warmed the water (by putting the bucket into the bathtub surrounded by hot water) like I always do.

Everyone seemed fine, even the next morning but when I got home from work I'd noticed him dead.

 

[StevenF]

Oddly after all of that I came home to a dead endler yesterday?!

Hopefully that was just death due to old age.