Help Please... Algaegeddon !

[Rooster]

Hi,
Very close to slitting my wrists here...
 
In the 40 odd years of wet hands, Ive never experienced this soul destroying situation before...  My tank seems to be haunted by algae !
 
Been trying for a few months to tackle it myself, but nothing seems to work, and im at my wits end.
 
 
The tank in question has been running just fine for 10 years or so - I was sending out excess plants on the forum !
 
She USED to look like this :

 
 
Now shes a sorry sight....

 
 
Originally it was lit by two tubes and fed liquid ferts with gas co2...   then I decided to experiment with LED lighting, which was fine until the LEDs started to fail, and plant growth fell away...together with the algal bloom, this was coating all plant leaves and fittings.
Three months or so ago, I reinstated the florescent tubes, which only made matters worse... so the spending started.
 
Replaced the tubes and ballast
Ceased ferts and co2
Replaced the filter media (NO not all at once !)
Deep cleaned the entire tank and plants... well the ones still alive !!
Did massive water changes
Did no water changes
Tried an algaecide - which killed most of the fish, but not the algae !
Added a phosphate remover to the filter
Added charcoal to the filter
Reduced photoperiod from 10 hours to 7, then 6 hours
Tried treating with Hydrogen peroxide
 
NONE of these steps made a jot of difference... the thing was blanketed again within a week.
 
Two weeks ago, I did a 5 day total blackout, which cleared the tank.... scrubbed the wood and fittings, did a 50% water change and removed what plants were alive to my shrimp tanks - where the plants picked up !!!!   This tank is lit with the same tubes as my problem one.
 
After the 5 days, I did another clean and water change, and put some plants back.
 
And here we are....  
 
PLEASE can you help, before the bloody thing ends up down the garden ?

 

[Akasha72]

well for one ... killing yourself isn't the answer!!! 
 
What about stripping everything out, cleaning the glass well with some kind of sterilizer (bicarb seems the kindest) and then starting fresh with new substrate, plants, decor etc. If it's been running for 10 years maybe that's what it needs?
 
Obviously some kind of imbalance is going on and you've clearly fallen out of love with it because of the problems and I know how you feel. My tank was blighted with BBA - it covered everything and I was close to packing up fish keeping because of it. It took a while to find out that I've got high levels of Phosphate in my tap water. I now have 3 SAE's which eat the BBA and I run a phosphate remover constantly too. I still get a bit but in general my tank looks much better now and I've fallen back in love with it.
 
See what others think about the imbalance - it's obvious there is one somewhere but also some algae's ommit spores and by cleaning everything I'm wondering if you can kill the algae spores and get back on track.
 
But please ... put that knife back in the drawer x

 

[Ch4rlie]

Ah, that is a real shame. Sorry this is happening
 
From the pictures of the substrate it does look like cyanbacteria otherwise known as Blue Green Algae - BGA.
 
Here is a link that may help give you some information on this, just scroll down to BGA
 
Blue Green Algae
 
Other than that, not sure what happened to cause such a change in your tank. The LED was just the begining.
Wonder if you made any other changes at the same time when you added the LEDs?
Like changing the filter or filter flow, or new substrate, that sort of thing.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Looks like your major 'algae' issue is cyanobacteria. This generally is caused by low nitrates, low flow and excess light.

I had a bit of trouble with it, but sucking it out manually, followed by hydrogen peroxiding the tank, followed by a dose of potassium nitrate did the trick. Not a trace remains.
I now give a small dose of potassium nitrate each water change.

 

[DrRob]

Yup, that's cyanobacter all right. My best guess is that you did such a good job of growing plants that you depleted the macronutrients, and enough mulm built up amongst the growth and roots to get the organics up to a high enough level to get it going. Once it's going it's a nightmare to get rid of, regular manual cleaning is a start, but as you'll see you're likely to need blackouts and a work up on what the cause has been. Last time I had it, it was a good vac out of the mulm in the substrate, less lights and more ferts that solved it.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Yeah, my instance was a very young tank, not enough time to build up mulm of any significance.

 

[Byron]

Cyanobacteria is a bacteria, not an algae, and it is caused by organics in the presence of light.  While it is true that low nitrates, low flow, high light can be present, they of themselves will not cause cyanobacteria.  Only high organics with light can cause cyano.
 
I have battled this three times, only in one tank (of seven).  Since nitrate is at zero or close, and flow is low (sponge filters in the smaller tanks), if these actually caused it I would have it everywhere.  Reducing organics did the trick all three times.  I also reduced the light period as this was clearly providing more light than what the plants could use in balance, so the organics being present it fed cyano.  My cyano was in the 70g which is the shallowest of my three dual-tube tanks, hence the light was more of a factor.  "Organics" for me has included a dirty filter, dirty substrate, and overdosing plant ferts with higher light (CO2 was obviously the limiting factor in this instance).
 
The beginning of your problem here was as someone said the change in lighting.  This off-set the existing balance between light intensity and nutrient availability, and I have known algae to suddenly increase from too much light and too little (failing fluorescent tubes can often cause algae as they weaken below what the plants require), and over fertilizing as well as under.  From the photos alone I can see that the original lighting was a good spectrum for the plants, while the present is not.  You might want to deal with the lighting; it is high in the blue and lacking red.
 
I will only deal with cyano by cleaning up the organics (the source), though reducing light duration has helped.  Blackouts may get rid of it in a few days, but if the source is not also dealt with it will only be back.  Antibiotics are unsafe for fish and other bacteria.  Work consistently at removing as much detritus from the substrate as you can, do not over-fertilize or over-feed the fish (the fish load obviously is part of this), and reduce light duration (as you've done).
 
Hope this helps.
 
Byron.

 

[Rooster]

Thanks for the ID guys... vac'd it out best I could, did a 50% water change, and bagged it until Sunday. 
 
Ordered some KNo3 - so fingers crossed AGAIN !!!!!   
Wish I had swallowed my pride, and asked months ago before I rampaged down the "algae" line of attack   : - (  
Seems Ive wasted some money, but hey ho - thats hobbies for you.

 

[Rooster]

Here we are a month later, and we are slowly winning !     A second blackout was needed and the KNO3 arrived, so am dosing weekly to 15 ppm and removing any patches that appear.
Also adding some liquid fertiliser.
 
Only issue is that the plants refuse to grow   I assume there's a CO2 deficiency... I shall reinstate it over the weekend.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Congrats on the current progress.  I hope the CO2 helps.

 

[Akasha72]

glad your winning
 
Co2 will help the plants aswell as a good fert. Keep at it, you'll get there

 

[Rooster]

Well, the CO2 has perked up the plants... added a few more fish and so far its manageable.
 
Seeing the odd patch on the sand, but a blast with the hydrogen peroxide sees it off within hours, so I presume its deep seated within the sand, might stir that up and see what happens - but dont want to disturb the "eco-complete" !
 
I'm now thinking that the LACK of fish upset the nitrates ...  so fingers crossed its now on the mend - at least the razor blade is back in the razor ! ;-)

 

[Ch4rlie]

I'm now thinking that the LACK of fish upset the nitrates ... 

 
Not so sure what you mean by this?
 
But good to see youre now starting to get everything undercontrol, thats a big step imho.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

 

I'm now thinking that the LACK of fish upset the nitrates ... 

 
Not so sure what you mean by this?

 
But good to see youre now starting to get everything undercontrol, thats a big step imho.
 

 
I believe he means a lack of nitrogen available due to the lack of fish waste.

 

[Rooster]