Guppy Disease...wont go away!

[Maverick]

Okay, I have a 20gal thats been setup for 6weeks now. I started and cycled it by jamming it with plants. I've got a aquaclear mini on it (which I'm starting to believe is too small). I also do 30% water changes twice weekly.

Now I started with 2 guppys, an oto and siamese algae eater after week 2. Then at week 3.5 I got another 10 guppies and 18 really tiny neons. Anyway, after the addition of more fish, my neon population started to decrease everyday. I also got the occasional unexplaned guppy death. I did notice that the fish were all scratching on leaves, so I thought it was possibly gill flukes. I took my water to LFS, and it tested fine except high ph 7.6-7. (I have heard that fish can scratch due to nitrites). So I bought some PARA-CIDE and ph Down. I did water change and dosed PARA-CIDE and slowly lowered ph to approx 7.2. The neon population has now been stable since, hopefully due to lower ph. Fish seem to have stopped scratching too.

Anyway, my guppies kept playing up!
Most seem to develop pale/white patch on their heads, rest alot then die. So then I bought some FUNGUS-ADE. This didn't seem to do didly squat, and out of the few fish that i have left, some have half white, and disintergrating fins, and sometimes sores at the base. They rest alot, breath fast, and have poor appetite. So I have currently doesed the tank with TRIPLE SULPHA, and it hasn't helped either. Amazingly, a few of the fish seem to be extremely healthy and unphased by all of this??

Where to next?.. PROTOZIN?? Ive already spend $$$ on medications.

Thanks

 

[semper fi]

are the white patches like white flecks or a dusting of white on the fish? if so, could be ich or is it a white cottony growth like a cotton ball? ich is a parasite that when it finds a host the fish shows the symptons. the white cottony growth is a fungus. the fish are breathing rapidly or heavily cause their gills are not functioning properly. a common sympton during illness. to help them with this you could add some salt to the tank. salt will also help to rid the tank of ich. dissolve one heaping tablespoon in tank water per every five gallons of tank water. do daily water changes of ten percent and add enough salt to only the amount of water that you remove. fish use their gills like we use our lungs. during illness the gill function is handicapped and the fish cannot expel properly the toxins in their bodies.

you should not use plants to cycle your tank. plants should be added after the tank is cycled. the cycling process is the creation of ammonia in the tank which starts the biological filter. ammonia is then broken down to nitrites and then to nitrates. plants help to remove the nitrates in the water. so if you add the plants the bioological filter is slowed down. you want to create the bacteria in the tank that will help to rid of nitrites. water changes keep the toxin levels down also. nothing like a good water change. you want to peak the ammonia and let it come down,increasing the nitrites in the tank and then peak the nitrates. then you can add plants to bring down the nitrates. plants feed on the plants much like house plants turn carbon dioxide into oxygen.

hth

maggie

 

[Maverick]

its more like fungus. Definately not ICH. But none of my medications have worked. I have tried salt earlier at 1tsp per 10L. I guess that's not strong enough though. So before I add 1tblspn / gal, will it affect my plants or other fish? Will it be okay to do while I have medications in the water?

Thanks

 

[Amadaca]

The Neons will not tolerate salt. They must be removed if you are going to experiment with it.

 

[semper fi]

salt cannot be used with the scaleless fish. amadaca says that the neons will not also tolerate the salt either. salt will burn the scaleless fish. read in one article on salt a few years ago that it is assumed that the parasite cannot burrow through the skin of fish but can get under the scale almost lifting it to penetrate into the fish. scaleless fish seem to be almost immune to ich. plants will not be affected by the salt. i have used salt in planted tanks before and it seems to leave them unharmed. but then again i keep cichlids and plants are like a saladbar to them. so they do not last long enough to stay in the tank for a long period of time

hth

maggie

 

[Amadaca]

Definitely, some plants will suffer if salt is added.

 

[Maverick]

Ok, just to update everyone... I didn't add salt.

My plants are going well, my algae eaters are happy, and my neons population is happy and stable, but I still have guppy dramas.

Anyway, my pH is roughly 7.2. I originally had 8 males and 8 female guppies. I now have 3 males and 2 females left. Yesterday I culled a female suffering severe dropsy, that originally had fin-rot that I managed to control. This morning i found a female dead that was perfect yesterday! Also, at lunch today i found a male (that was fine this morning) in bad state, yet he had no visible symptoms, so I culled him too! And Now I have notice a female with one popeye.

So I have 3 perfect males, 1 perfect (yet sexually harassed ) female, and another female with one popeye who is looking sick.

What the hell does this all mean? Does my guppy poulation have a bacterial infection? Why are my neons and other fish unaffected? I would have thought neons were more sensitive than guppies. Could it be pH related??

Should I purchase an antibiotic ie. tetracycline?

I'm quickly losing patience

Thanks for your help & time.

-Jarrad

 

[Kirstie]

Just out of curiosity, how do you kill your fish? Because one of mine is really suffering and I want to put him out of his misery badly. Please don't tell me you cut off it's head. Though that is the kindest way, it's kind of gross.

 

[Amadaca]

Neither cruel nor messy, placing the fish in a cup of aquarium water & then placing it in the fridge is a common practice in euthanasia.

 

[Maverick]

Ok, the female with popeye was dead this morning. And one of the males is showing slight signs of distress (i think)....please give me some suggestions?!

My tap water here is reasonably hard and alkaline (ph 7.7). I use Ph down to lower it to around 7.2. Could this be a cause of problems?...because I'm assuming the water is still hardish, but with a lower ph. Would peat be better?

As for culling them...off with their heads. When they're really crook, cutting their head off is kindest thing to do.

 

[Maverick]

Oh yeah, i use about 1/3 tsp of ph down per gal. This seems like a lot too me.

 

[Amadaca]

Maverick, Guppies never like their water soft & acidic. You shouldn't keep them in water with a lower pH level than 7.0, ideally the water should be on the harder side, so I doubt this could be the problem. How gradually did you lower the pH level though? Perhaps too fast?

 

[Maverick]

My pH has been at 7.2 since about a week after adding fish, because my neons kept dying. So it has been maintained at 7.2 for quite a while now. I have heard of guppies being happy in water as low as 6.9 before. I'm just thinking if i add ph down to hard-alkaline tap water, then i end up with hard, yet more acidic water which is contradictory.... Would that throw chemistry off? Does that even make sense?

Should i let the ph drift up a bit more when i do my next water change? Will the plants and neons have dramas with this?

What about medications? Is protozin the bomb?? It is also expensive! I'm just sick of waking up to find yet another dead fish! It's like a guppy plague!

 

[jane]

to the one about killing fish use vodka neat fish straight in