Fishless Cycle

[nem2k2]

Hi,

I bought a 90L tank last weekend as an upgrade from my 40L so my fish will be more comfortable and not as cramped. I read a lot about fishless cycling, as when I bought my original tank I had a lot of fish die because I did not know anything about cycling, which I would like to prevent from happening this time around

I tried to find some non-soapy ammonia at the local hardware/supermarket but they do not have any, the closest I found was one called Caskade Cloudy Ammonia which looked promising, but after buying it I looked up its fact sheet on the 'net and it contains 1% soap So I figured I would have to go with a method of fishless cycling I read about where you basically just feed the tank fish food as if there were fish in there, and the decomposing food produces ammonia and starts the cycle.

So last weekend (~8 days ago) I cleaned the gravel, put the gravel in, filled the tank, and turned the filter/thermometer (28deg C) on. I left it for about a day (the water was very cloudy, but it went away), then swapped a couple of handfuls of the filter noodles from my established tank into the new one, added some water from the established tank to the new tank's filter, and started 'feeding the tank' every night. I also grabbed some fish poop from my established tank (my pleco loves pooping in a pipe! there was a lot in there) in case that helps too.

Two days ago I went to the LFS and bought a bunch of plants and a big piece of driftwood for the new tank. I also got the water tested at the LFS (the testing kits are expensive, I only have a pH one at them moment, and the LFS said they would test for me for free), and the ammonia/nitrate levels were virtually at zero. I didn't see the nitrate ppm but they said it was at an acceptable level. They advised me to wait another week, and then I could start thinking about putting fish in.

So does this sound reasonable for a fishless cycle? I guess I'm a little concerned that perhaps the fish waste/food I added to the tank were not enough to cycle the tank.

Also, I read that it is best to transfer fish over to the new tank over a period of 1-2 weeks; which fish should I start with? I have 2 x dwarf gouramis, 6 x neon tetras, 2 x clown loaches, 1 x pleco. Would the pleco/loaches be best so they start producing waste to sustain help sustain the bacteria in the filter?

Sorry for my ramble, any advice would be appreciated

 

[chrisnewmanuk]

I tried to find some non-soapy ammonia at the local hardware/supermarket but they do not have any, the closest I found was one called Caskade Cloudy Ammonia which looked promising, but after buying it I looked up its fact sheet on the 'net and it contains 1% soap So I figured I would have to go with a method of fishless cycling I read about where you basically just feed the tank fish food as if there were fish in there, and the decomposing food produces ammonia and starts the cycle.

If you are in the UK, Homebase do "Household Ammonia" - should be with all the mops etc! This is 9.5% Ammonia solution.

 

[dwarfgourami]

When you do a fishless cycle the best way is to have your own test kit so you can test every day; unless you've seen the ammonia and nitrites spike and disappear it is hard to know where you are in the cycle.

 

[nem2k2]

@Chris: I am in New Zealand

@dwarfgourami: yeah I figured that might be the case.. I'm going to try and get some secondhand testing kits, they're usually a lot cheaper than the prices the LFS's charge here

 

[GeeFish]

Don't quote me on this but I'm sure I've read that Neon Tetra's are a very hardy species, and a lot of people use them as there first fish in a new tank. Probably best to start with introducing them first!

I think the Clown Loach and Plec will make too much mess to soon for the tank (if that makes any sense!)

Regards

Gee

 

[rdd1952]

Don't quote me on this but I'm sure I've read that Neon Tetra's are a very hardy species, and a lot of people use them as there first fish in a new tank.

Actually neons are probably the worst fish to cycle with. They are very delicate and need near perfect water. Danios are good for cycling with fish but I would definitely recommend the fishless method.

As for the test kits, I'm not sure about pricing in New Zealand but here in the states a master kit only runs about $25 and that will last you for at least 6 months, especially with only one tank to test. The fish flakes will work but it's harder to calculate how much to add to get to 4 to 6 ppm of ammonia.

 

[GeeFish]

Don't quote me on this but I'm sure I've read that Neon Tetra's are a very hardy species, and a lot of people use them as there first fish in a new tank.

Actually neons are probably the worst fish to cycle with. They are very delicate and need near perfect water. Danios are good for cycling with fish but I would definitely recommend the fishless method.

As for the test kits, I'm not sure about pricing in New Zealand but here in the states a master kit only runs about $25 and that will last you for at least 6 months, especially with only one tank to test. The fish flakes will work but it's harder to calculate how much to add to get to 4 to 6 ppm of ammonia.

I agree with the fishless cycle, always a must as far as I'm concerned.

But just got my fish books out and read:

Neon Tetra: "A hardy fish, it occupies the middle and lower levels and can easily be acclimatized to many types of water"

Another book says: "While the Neon is reported to be highly adaptable, both in terms of pH and hardness, the Cardinal is generally reported to be less so.

and my third book (I never just read one!) says: "The Neon Tetra is hardy and peaceful but diffcult to breed".

You may be right, as I don't keep them, but just knew I read it somewhere!

Regards

Gee

 

[rdd1952]

I don't have any neons either although I think they are beautiful fish. I would love to have a big school in my 75 gallon but with 4 angels also in there, they would turn into expensive feeders. Anyway, I am going by what I have read on here. From some of the fish books I have read, I have become skeptical of what I read in these books by so called experts. It's amazing what kind of advice is in some books but a lot of those were written before anyone had ever heard of fishless cycling and things were a lot different. I have about sworn off books and use this forum as my just about my only info source.

 

[GeeFish]

Thats a good idea, and I believe your right, which is why I read about 3 different books before I do/buy anything. Plants included!

Shame really cos most of the books/magazines say ask your LFS staff for advice...now I take there information with a pinch of salt sometimes aswell. Too biased for a sale in my opinion.

Anyway back on topic, I've always thought that Neons or Cardinals look great with a black background, especially if there is a big shoal of them!

Gee

 

[trace1]

Hi,

I bought a 90L tank last weekend as an upgrade from my 40L so my fish will be more comfortable and not as cramped. I read a lot about fishless cycling, as when I bought my original tank I had a lot of fish die because I did not know anything about cycling, which I would like to prevent from happening this time around


So does this sound reasonable for a fishless cycle? I guess I'm a little concerned that perhaps the fish waste/food I added to the tank were not enough to cycle the tank.

Also, I read that it is best to transfer fish over to the new tank over a period of 1-2 weeks; which fish should I start with? I have 2 x dwarf gouramis, 6 x neon tetras, 2 x clown loaches, 1 x pleco. Would the pleco/loaches be best so they start producing waste to sustain help sustain the bacteria in the filter?

Sorry for my ramble, any advice would be appreciated

Hi,

I bought a 90L tank last weekend as an upgrade from my 40L so my fish will be more comfortable and not as cramped. I read a lot about fishless cycling, as when I bought my original tank I had a lot of fish die because I did not know anything about cycling, which I would like to prevent from happening this time around


So does this sound reasonable for a fishless cycle? I guess I'm a little concerned that perhaps the fish waste/food I added to the tank were not enough to cycle the tank.

Also, I read that it is best to transfer fish over to the new tank over a period of 1-2 weeks; which fish should I start with? I have 2 x dwarf gouramis, 6 x neon tetras, 2 x clown loaches, 1 x pleco. Would the pleco/loaches be best so they start producing waste to sustain help sustain the bacteria in the filter?

Sorry for my ramble, any advice would be appreciated

hi
would it not be easier just to transfer your established filter over to your new tank & then run it along side your new filter that way you are cloning the tank & will be able to add your fish right away. if i'm wrong some 1 please say, but i have done this with my corner tank & everything was ok
trace

 

[rdd1952]

hi
would it not be easier just to transfer your established filter over to your new tank & then run it along side your new filter that way you are cloning the tank & will be able to add your fish right away. if i'm wrong some 1 please say, but i have done this with my corner tank & everything was ok
trace

Actually, moving the filter from the established tank over to the new one would leave it to go through a mini cycle. The best option is to move part of the media from the established one to the new one or to run the filter for the new tank in the established tank for a week or 2 to get some bacteria established on it and then move it to the new tank.

On the other hand, if the new tank is a total upgrade, meaning the old tank will no longer house fish and they will all be moved to the new tank, then by all means, moving the established filter is the way to go. You could run them both the old and new filters together for 2 or 3 weeks and then remove the old, smaller filter or simply leave them both in. It never hurts to be over filtered. One thing to keep in mind though is that the filter would only have enough bacteria to handle the fish that are currently in the old tank. Moving it to the new tank and adding more fish (besides just the ones moved over) would result in a mini cycle until the bacteria catch back up.

 

[nem2k2]

Thank you all for the replies!

Re. using neon tetras to cycle - my LFS said they are "hardy" and would be fine starter fish when I got my original fish tank.. the original 7 I got all died, and the next repalcement 7 I got only 2 of them survived. So I'm not keen on putting them in first!

I would move the filter over, but both tanks are the type of tank where the filter is built into the tank hood, and the tanks are very different in size, so I don't think this is feasible.

I do plan on keeping the original tank, for quarantine or breeding purposes