andywg
Bored into leaving
Some people get all the luck
I must admit, I love how the betta people jump and get so angry when they feel their clique might be threatened in any way.
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- Thread starter afishdude
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Some people get all the luck
I must admit, I love how the betta people jump and get so angry when they feel their clique might be threatened in any way.
andywg
Bored into leaving
Excellent point. I too would like this thread to slip quietly into the night, and shall express this opinions by bumping the thread back up the board.ok people.........
let this die!
Danno
Fish Herder
both quotes
Some people get all the luck
I must admit, I love how the betta people jump and get so angry when they feel their clique might be threatened in any way.
I know this is topic is well, off topic, but allow me to continue:
pica_nuttalli, saying that you are unwelcome in the Betta section was actually pretty correct after the last rude post you made. Topic Link You rarely if ever post in that forum and then criticize everyone who, basically, made a post in that forum. Posts like 'I recieved a new Betta today' or 'This is my upcoming beeding pair' actually benefit the forum and also helps newer people reconize quality bettas from chain-store bettas. It is all a learning experiance. Now if you came in there and said 'What would help this forum out?', or 'This is my brainstormed betta setup, any issues?' would be much more...appropriate.
andywg, people don't jump at other people in the Betta section, but the Betta section does opperate slightly different though. People like to show off there new variation of Betta or breeding pair. But if you go in there and say that the Betta forum is a clique that only allows certain people in, I would have to disagree. I have been criticized in that forum before for thinking that Bettas would be just fine in a one gallon tank, or for thinking that Betta cups are just fine the way they are. Peoples opinions are always different but if you go into a place that you have never posted in and to say that they are all wrong wouldn't be the best way to approching the situation. I will admit that Betta owners are more apt to take the taboo way out instead of the scientific way to aproach an issue, but that doesn't mean that everyone is a failure to do so. But I have gotten of the beaten path, but one way or another, the betta section does opperate differently.
But by no mean does that mean that I have not made irresponsible posts myself.
As for the main subject I think that the Member Aquarium section would be, and is, the best way of doing this.
pica_nuttalli
don't be a twit
My point is that the way I have been responded to and hounded in two threads is ridiculous, especially considering that the reason I'm under attack is that I sounded bossy.
What has happened here is the stupidest form of hypocrisy, where I was subjected to repeated, deliberate personal attacks on the basis of a single post because I used the wrong tone. Never mind the fact that I was pointing out in general terms the obvious fashion in which the forum is organized, a form of organization that all the other discussion forums recognize and respect. No, because I used the wrong tone of voice in a single post directed at no one person, that made it OK for everyone who disagreed with me to directly insult me and to explicitly command me without any basis in the forum rules/organization. These attacks continued for 20 hours without any response from me and intensified during that period. In short, I got frenzied.
People are rude and insulting in Bettas on a daily basis. They have been for years; there will be no changing that. I fully believe that it goes along with owning such pugnacious fish; cichlid keepers are just as bad. But the only reason that I'm "not welcome in Bettas" is that there is a clique of loud voices who can't be bothered with anything outside of Bettas and I don't belong to that clique. The simple fact that I can't point out obvious details about forum organization without risking attack "because I rarely post in that particular forum" demonstrates that there is a clique of people who do frequent that forum highly and reject outsiders. For whatever reason, this type of attitude has always existed in that forum even as the precise members involved have fluctuated. I'm not saying that anything can or should be done about this, but you have to recognize it. I mention all this to make it more clear that I got frenzied because the clique said that I didn't belong.
Bettas has some of the highest page turn-over on the forum, mostly due to the proliferation of minor topics such as picture topics that really don't belong in that forum. I like bettas and I used to follow the big breeders like Synirr pretty closely. But I don't frequent the Betta forum anymore because it's too much of a time sink to find interesting topics. So I actually do have a vested interest in this discussion, even if 25% of my posts over the last three years have been in Chit Chat. (Can you tell that particular snide comment really burnt me up?) Just because you guys can see where some of my posts are doesn't mean that you can see all the things that I'm reading.
I like to think that if I hadn't posted that in the middle of the night (much like tonight
), then I probably would have realized in advance all the reasons Wuv gave for not enforcing the forum organization when it comes to Bettas. I wouldn't have forgotten that the Betta forum is just different. I was honest-to-goodness trying to be neutral and helpful. I provided two separate links to the appropriate forum. I offered pertinent examples; I even used the tried and true technique of using a smiley to show that I wanted to be friendly.So where did I go wrong? I disturbed the status quo and told people that what they were doing is technically wrong. Oh, and I didn't kowtow while I was at it. And you know what? I'm going to admit that those were mistakes because pulling a stunt like that always makes people mad. Plus, I forgot that an organization like this simply *is* the status quo and isn't 100% run by written rules. That was a mistake too. If I had been given the opportunity, then I would have apologized for the whole mess. But I wasn't given that chance and instead, I got frenzied. So now I don't feel so generally apologetic for accidentally insulting folks.
It is way too late at this point and I'm sick of re-reading this to see what could be said more clearly. All I have left is to reiterate how I feel about this week's internet drama.
I recognize and agree with the Official Position, thus I apologize to the mod team for not waiting to hear it. I appreciate those members who took my statements in good faith; I thank them for responding in friendly tone even though they disagreed with my opinion.
But as for those who attacked me and chased me: you are flamers and hypocrites. Those supporting and defending these attacks: practice your critical reading skills. And none of you should ever dare post a thread about how unfriendly this forum is. I'm not a very nice person, but I am at least honest about who and what I am.
afishdude, if you want this thread to die, then you should request a mod to close it.
--EDIT--
I'm sick of defending myself in public like this. Any future discussions of how I fail as a forum member should be conducted via PM, because this just exceeded it's rational limit as a "case study" in how people completely overreact to text communication.
andywg
Bored into leaving
No, but it does contain many people who self profess to never visit the rest of the forum and do not want anything else to do with it. Should any of the "others" point errors or problems in betta posts, they get very upset. I seem to recall a bad situation a year or so ago and they got most upset that CFC sorted it out because he doesn't keep bettas. That is not conducive to the forum as a whole.
I also recall a post on salt use where they got very upset that outsiders came in using science to point out how salt is effectively a snake oil.
@Pica:
Don't sweat it. Consider the flip side, people tell you to get over the pics being in the wrong place, just think how pathetic the others are that have to PM you saying you are not welcome in an open part of the internet they have no control at all over just because you criticised their actions.
Why don't you blow out the overblown fin bags called bettas and come over to the salty side and keep real bettas (Calloplesiops altivelis)?
Danno
Fish Herder
pica, this will be short but to the point. You wouldn't have to keep defending yourself over and over if you didn't antagonize it via this post.
andywg, the Betta section does run on taboo as already said. I will say that. As for the fin bags, they do sometimes get bread to big, but then again that is someone's preference. I am on the salty side already but I don't have a tank large enough for a salty Betta. I will someday.
andywg, the Betta section does run on taboo as already said. I will say that. As for the fin bags, they do sometimes get bread to big, but then again that is someone's preference. I am on the salty side already but I don't have a tank large enough for a salty Betta. I will someday.
Why don't you blow out the overblown fin bags called bettas and come over to the salty side and keep real bettas (Calloplesiops altivelis)?
ROFL. Anyway...
Why don't you betta people have a pinned topic in the betta section to show off betta pics? Like how the cichlid section has a pinned topic for photos of specific cichlids.
madgap
Fishaholic
People are proud of their fish. They want to show them off. Whats the problem with that?
Edit...
This is becoming a bit like a mini-war. War of the pictures. Come on guy's. Is it really worth the hastle?
I'd suggest, if you don't want to look at pictures then don't.
Man, it's so simple
Edit...
This is becoming a bit like a mini-war. War of the pictures. Come on guy's. Is it really worth the hastle?
I'd suggest, if you don't want to look at pictures then don't.
Man, it's so simple
Danno
Fish Herder
poopsydrew
"CodeMonkey"
"I'm not a very nice person, but I am at least honest about who and what I am."
I think the above gives you all the explanation you need as to why you are being talked to and treated the way you are.
Drew
I think the above gives you all the explanation you need as to why you are being talked to and treated the way you are.
Drew
pica_nuttalli
don't be a twit
Explanations are not justifications. This sort of behavior is unjustifiable and has never happened to me before, not even when I have intentionally been unpleasant. It is not because of what I did but because of where I generally post. That is ridiculous.
Getting frenzied by the Betta forum is a chronic problem. It happens all the time to other people for similarly specious reasons, if in a less hypocritical fashion. It's starting to show up in Chit Chat too, with people hounding particular individuals across topics and forums in a deliberate attempt to drive them out of TFF. Why? Because these individuals aren't immediately internalizing the advice given and respond to insults with insults.
There is a difference between not putting a candy coating over everything and going around trying to drive folks out of the forums. Trust me, there are plenty of people that I think are stupid twits (NONE OF THESE ARE INVOLVED IN THIS DISCUSSION) that I'd give $20 to never hear from again. But I don't chase them all over the forum trying to make them leave. And I think that the same goes for the rest of us old-timers who are constantly accused of "unfriendliness".
Again, danno and poopsy, if you would like to continue debating the existence of the Betta clique, whether or not it's ok to run around attacking people you disagree with, and just how much of this I brought upon myself, then I invite you to do so via PM.
--EDIT--
And Andy, you can forget about salt-water bettas; I want your raspberry-custard frogfish!
It'll go nicely next to my candy-cane cichlid tank.
fry_lover
Fred and the Fredettes
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