Fish Identification

[newbie_zak]

ok so some of you have read my new tank help thread and know that I have been battling disease in my tank (which I think is cured THANKS) but I have one last issue. I believe the fish I am talking about is a dalmation molly. It's mostly black and has white spots/patches on it. Recently when I changed the water it was flashing against the filter motor. It doesn't seem to touch anything else and it didn't do it a lot but a few times. I've never seen it rub against anything else and it stopped doing it a while after the water change. A few people and the LFS girl (who I really don't like) said it sounds like ick. This fish does have a few shiny spots on it. It that normal for a dalmation molly? You can only see them when the light hits them the right way and I only see them on it's body, there are none on the fins. and actually it seems to have two yellowish little spots as well. I thought these were ick spots but now I'm not sure. I'm sorry but I can't get any pics, the spots are iridescent and small, and spread out. It seems to eat fine and none of the other fish have any white spots. I think it does weird things (like swim up and down with it's face almost touching, or actually touching the glass) but the orange platy does this too. I did turn up the tank temp and I added a bit of salt (a little over 2 teapoons for a 10 gal tank) but I don't want to continue this if there is no ick.

So, do dalmation mollies have little white iridescent spots?

Also, how long should it take before I start getting nitrites? My tank is about a 8 or 9 days old...the ammonia fluctuates between 0 and .5 depending on how recent my water changes are to testing...I'm doing the dreaded fish-in cycle (please don't berate me for it...it's too late now) but I haven't had any nitrites come up yet. When should I expect them? Also my PH comes out of the tap pretty high...like around mid-high sevens: 7.6 or 7.8 so the tank water has pretty high PH...Is that ok? I've heard fish can tolerate a wide range of PH's. I haven't bothered to test for nitrates because my tank is so young.

 

[Reret]

I hade the same thing probably ich but are the fins frayed? This is sometimes a symptom of fin rot. bTW I spent over 50£ on anabiotics But in the end they all died So

Treat ich and good luck

 

[Mikaila31]

I would wait ATM. Flicking during a WC isn't something to get too concerned about. If the fish keeps flicking though I would treat for parasites using a copper med like coppersafe or aquarisol. Ich is a common disease and can do a lot of damage if you let it get out of control. The good news though is that it is pretty easy to catch it early on. One important thing when treating for ich though is to treat for 2 WEEKS MINIMUM, regardless of what the medication bottle says. I usually treat a 3rd week at half the recommend dose. Ich has a fairly long life cycle and is only visible to the eye during a brief part of it. Its very common for people to treat until the signs go away then they stop only to find they have ich again a week or two later.

 

[the_lock_man]

Definitely don't treat for anything without being certain what it is.

Whitespot (ich) looks like little grains of salt or sugar on the fish. If your fish doesn't have that, then it may well not be whitespot. The colouration you have described certainly sounds like a dalmation molly, when I had one, she had a few little yellow bits as well.

It doesn't sound to me like you have a problem.

 

[newbie_zak]

thanks y'all...I don't notice any fin fraying and I haven't seen him do any flashing lately. That is in the last day or so...It was just that one day. Also, people keep referring to the spots as salt or sugar grains and that sounds about the right size but they are sparkly, iridescent spots and from what I read about ick they would not be on it for a week and they spots have been there since I got him. I turned the temp back down to 80-ish this moring after doing a water change and I think I'll stop with the salt...I only did it for 2 days and I did not put a lot in because I wasn't sure of the issue and everything I read said to work them up to an ick killing dose anyway. Hopefully everyone in my tank is finally healthy.


I am impatiently waiting to start getting nitrites though...I know I need ammonia in the tank to get them but I try to keep it low so my fish aren't so stressed/poisoned by it...anything .5 or over (I haven't had it over since day 2 before I got the H2O test kit) I change the water but if it is only .25 I usually let it go another 12 hours or so before doing a water change. Does it take around two weeks to start getting nitrites?

 

[Aqua Tom]

A photo of the said fishy would be a great help.

Tom

 

[the_lock_man]

I am impatiently waiting to start getting nitrites though...I know I need ammonia in the tank to get them but I try to keep it low so my fish aren't so stressed/poisoned by it...anything .5 or over (I haven't had it over since day 2 before I got the H2O test kit) I change the water but if it is only .25 I usually let it go another 12 hours or so before doing a water change. Does it take around two weeks to start getting nitrites?

You're on the right track there, but the so-called "Safe" target is 0.25ppm. Any ammonia will be damaging the fish, but 0.25ppm is considered the upper acceptable level for your situation.

 

[ZoddyZod]

if you are seeing a reading of 0.25 you should be performing water changes, not waiting 12hrs. ANY level of ammonia above 0 is potentially harazdous to the fish.

 

[newbie_zak]

I do wish that my test kit was more sensitive because it goes from 0 to .25 to .5 (and up). Since that one time (before I got a test kit) my ammonia has never been over .5 and When I test it it is usually at .25 (and sometimes 0). One or two times it has been as high as .5 and I've changed the water right away. I know ammonia is harmful to fish but I need it to cycle my tank so I am trying to keep it present but low. I have become attached to my fish and I do monitor them as well for any signs of ammonia stress. I usually feed them in the morning and come home for lunch and do test and I usually end up doing a gravel vac - water change then and when I get home at night sometimes I test again and it says .25. I think if I change the water again (I do about 15-20%), that is twice a day, I'll keep the ammonia so low (or nonexistent) that my tank will never cycle.

Please don't misunderstand: I love my fishies... I don't want to hurt them and I do realize that the fish-in cycle will be hard on them. But I need to cycle my tank so I need at least a little ammonia in there. I'm trying to find an acceptable compromise that will allow my fish to live and my tank to cycle. Telling me to keep my ammonia at O isn't really helping that. However I will say to all those people that if I ever get another tank or (goddess forbid, my fish all die and I start over) I think I'll try the fishless cycle that I learned about through this forum.

To get a heads-up on things: Assuming I get nitrites at some point in the (hopefully near) future, How low do I try to keep them. I've heard nitrite is even more toxic than ammonia and I think my tester jumps from ) to .5...I have the API liquid drop kit folks have recommended I buy. I also need nitrites to develop nitrates correct?

 

[the_lock_man]

I do wish that my test kit was more sensitive because it goes from 0 to .25 to .5 (and up). Since that one time (before I got a test kit) my ammonia has never been over .5 and When I test it it is usually at .25 (and sometimes 0). One or two times it has been as high as .5 and I've changed the water right away. I know ammonia is harmful to fish but I need it to cycle my tank so I am trying to keep it present but low. I have become attached to my fish and I do monitor them as well for any signs of ammonia stress. I usually feed them in the morning and come home for lunch and do test and I usually end up doing a gravel vac - water change then and when I get home at night sometimes I test again and it says .25. I think if I change the water again (I do about 15-20%), that is twice a day, I'll keep the ammonia so low (or nonexistent) that my tank will never cycle.

Please don't misunderstand: I love my fishies... I don't want to hurt them and I do realize that the fish-in cycle will be hard on them. But I need to cycle my tank so I need at least a little ammonia in there. I'm trying to find an acceptable compromise that will allow my fish to live and my tank to cycle. Telling me to keep my ammonia at O isn't really helping that. However I will say to all those people that if I ever get another tank or (goddess forbid, my fish all die and I start over) I think I'll try the fishless cycle that I learned about through this forum.

To get a heads-up on things: Assuming I get nitrites at some point in the (hopefully near) future, How low do I try to keep them. I've heard nitrite is even more toxic than ammonia and I think my tester jumps from ) to .5...I have the API liquid drop kit folks have recommended I buy. I also need nitrites to develop nitrates correct?

The filter will cycle just with ammonia concentrations that are too low for our tests to register, yes it's a long process, and hard work, as you're now finding out, but it will get there - you don't need to maintain a certain level of ammonia.

You need to treat nitrite exactly the same as ammonia - keep it as close to 0 as you can. You're right, that nitrite is converted to nitrate, which is the next stage of the nitrogen cycle, and to grow this second species of bacteria in the filter, if anything, takes longer than growing the first lot (sorry!)

And you said that "if you ever get another tank" - another thing the fish shops don't tell you about is MTS. This is Multiple Tank Syndrome, it's a condition which affects all good fishkeepers. It is defined as a compelling, irresistable desire to fill your house with fish tanks. As with all such conditions, it affects different people to different extents. I myself suffer. It only took me 9 months to buy my second tank. And I keep nagging my wife for a third. I fear that just by saying "if I ever get another tank" that you are dooooooomed.

I might start a self-help group for sufferers - AA - Aquarists Anonymous.......

And on a serious note, as and when you do develop MTS, you can take some (max a third) of your mature filter media, and use it in the new filter, to kick start the cycling process. You need to refill the old filter with new media, to allow the bacteria colonies to recover, which they will do in a very short space of time.

Hope this all makes sense.

 

[newbie_zak]

The filter will cycle just with ammonia concentrations that are too low for our tests to register, yes it's a long process, and hard work, as you're now finding out, but it will get there - you don't need to maintain a certain level of ammonia.

You need to treat nitrite exactly the same as ammonia - keep it as close to 0 as you can. You're right, that nitrite is converted to nitrate, which is the next stage of the nitrogen cycle, and to grow this second species of bacteria in the filter, if anything, takes longer than growing the first lot (sorry!)

And you said that "if you ever get another tank" - another thing the fish shops don't tell you about is MTS. This is Multiple Tank Syndrome, it's a condition which affects all good fishkeepers. It is defined as a compelling, irresistable desire to fill your house with fish tanks. As with all such conditions, it affects different people to different extents. I myself suffer. It only took me 9 months to buy my second tank. And I keep nagging my wife for a third. I fear that just by saying "if I ever get another tank" that you are dooooooomed.

I might start a self-help group for sufferers - AA - Aquarists Anonymous.......

And on a serious note, as and when you do develop MTS, you can take some (max a third) of your mature filter media, and use it in the new filter, to kick start the cycling process. You need to refill the old filter with new media, to allow the bacteria colonies to recover, which they will do in a very short space of time.

Hope this all makes sense.

Yes, that does make sense...and thank you for your supportive advice. I am not naturally a patient person and I'm afraid the tank will never start to cycle, I find myself thinking the water conditioner I'm using to get rid of the chlorine is ineffective even though I'm following the directions. I've only had my tank for around 14 or 15 days...Maybe all is normal but geez. And hrmm...you may be on to something with the MTS...If I ever win the lottery I'm so buying a salt water tank...and I like the idea of kickstarting my filter...I need to look into getting someone to send me mature filter media.

 

[the_lock_man]

The filter will cycle just with ammonia concentrations that are too low for our tests to register, yes it's a long process, and hard work, as you're now finding out, but it will get there - you don't need to maintain a certain level of ammonia.

You need to treat nitrite exactly the same as ammonia - keep it as close to 0 as you can. You're right, that nitrite is converted to nitrate, which is the next stage of the nitrogen cycle, and to grow this second species of bacteria in the filter, if anything, takes longer than growing the first lot (sorry!)

And you said that "if you ever get another tank" - another thing the fish shops don't tell you about is MTS. This is Multiple Tank Syndrome, it's a condition which affects all good fishkeepers. It is defined as a compelling, irresistable desire to fill your house with fish tanks. As with all such conditions, it affects different people to different extents. I myself suffer. It only took me 9 months to buy my second tank. And I keep nagging my wife for a third. I fear that just by saying "if I ever get another tank" that you are dooooooomed.

I might start a self-help group for sufferers - AA - Aquarists Anonymous.......

And on a serious note, as and when you do develop MTS, you can take some (max a third) of your mature filter media, and use it in the new filter, to kick start the cycling process. You need to refill the old filter with new media, to allow the bacteria colonies to recover, which they will do in a very short space of time.

Hope this all makes sense.

Yes, that does make sense...and thank you for your supportive advice. I am not naturally a patient person and I'm afraid the tank will never start to cycle, I find myself thinking the water conditioner I'm using to get rid of the chlorine is ineffective even though I'm following the directions. I've only had my tank for around 14 or 15 days...Maybe all is normal but geez. And hrmm...you may be on to something with the MTS...If I ever win the lottery I'm so buying a salt water tank...and I like the idea of kickstarting my filter...I need to look into getting someone to send me mature filter media.

There is a list of forum members willing to donate mature media in the Beginners Resource Centre - maybe have a look there?

I'd be surprised if your dechlor is ineffective, unless it's a seriously cheap brand, or very very old - which one are you using?

 

[newbie_zak]

I'm using the aqueon water conditioner...is says 5 ml does 10 gal. I'm hoping this isn't killing any bacteria that may be trying to grow because I change water about once a day.

I'm also a little concerened about my water temp... my house is about 65 degrees (give or take a few) and I always let the water sit overnight to get up to room temp but even that is a lot off from the 80 ish that I keep the tank at. I think water changes make my tank drop but 5 degrees or so and I'm really not sure how long it takes to get back up to temp but its a little bit (more than a few minutes)

Is this OK? and If not can I use hot water out of the tap to help get it up to temp or what should I do?

 

[the_lock_man]

There shouldn't be a problem with using that conditioner.

I always use hot water from the tap to roughly match the temperature.