Fertilizer with shrimp

[Bicyclemaster]

3 days ago I added about 20 RCS to my 10g tank and I was wondering of it's alright to continue adding liquid fertilizer to the tank. I was thinking that about 1/3 of the recommended amount ones every other day should be fine. I have some epiphytes and they need some ferts.

It's my first time keeping shrimp and from what I've seen about half of them have moulted.

There is a lot of hardscape so idk if there are any deaths. I haven't seen any dead in the visible areas.

Btw, the sponge is there because I initially had a sponge filter in, but I switched to a HOB and since the bacteria is mostly on the sponge, I'll keep it in for some time.

 

[Essjay]

I use fertiliser in both my tanks, one has red cherry shrimps, the other has amano shrimps. But because I have slow growing plants I use less than half the recommended dose and the shrimps (and nerite snails) have been fine with that.

 

[BrianK]

I fertilize my shrimp tank with no problem too. You will need a pre-filter sponge on the HOB if you don't have one already.

 

[Bicyclemaster]

I fertilize my shrimp tank with no problem too. You will need a pre-filter sponge on the HOB if you don't have one already.

I already have one, thanks for the tip.

 

[Byron]

Any reliable liquid plant fertilizer will be balanced. This means there will not be sufficient of any nutrient (like copper for example) to cause problems for invertebrates or fish, provided the fertilizer is not overdosed. "Reliable" liquid fertilizer means one that is comprehensive-- complete with all nutrients needed and in balance with each other. These products are "supplements." Dosing mega fertilizer in a high-tech planted tank is obviously a very different thing.

 

[Bicyclemaster]

I use fertiliser in both my tanks, one has red cherry shrimps, the other has amano shrimps. But because I have slow growing plants I use less than half the recommended dose and the shrimps (and nerite snails) have been fine with that.

Thank you for the info! Would DIY co2 be bad for them? I'm already using it in the tank, but I would love someones opinion. I know that they don't exactly like ph fluctuations and DIY co2 fluctuates sometimes.

Gh 8
Kh 12
Ph 7.5-8

 

[TwoTankAmin]

I have never been a fan of DIY CO@ for a number of reasons. At the higest count I had 13 planted tanks and only one was a high tech tank where I used pressurized CO2. I had planned to start with DIY to make sure I would benefit before I spent for the pressurized, Back in 2002 before most social media we did things on sites like this one and chat rooms connected to them.

One of the best pieces of advice I got back then was from a few of the plant experts in the chat. Iwas told, if I could addord it, to start with pressured and not "waste my time" with DIY. My high tech planted tank was a 50 gal. I ran it for 9 years before it cam down and I solf off the CO2 system. That tank took too much time to maintain. The plants grew very rapidly and major pruning which for stems meant, uproot. cut in half and replant the top. For the baby tears about avery 6 or 7 weeks I had to remove a huge mat that was lifiting off of the substrate and replant from scratch (i.e. I threw out over 95% of the plants and replant the rest).

On the other hand I have used Flourish Excel in all my other planted tanks. I add it only once a week and only at the recommended dosage. Some folks will never use this product as they believe it is not safe for the fish. I have used it for a very long time and have never seen any evidence of this. My fish are not deformed, they reproduce and also seem to live longer than average. I do know Excel is not CO@ and can not provide the benefits need where the CO@ in aquarium water can be used faster than it can be replaced by just roiling the surface of the water in the tank.

So I do not agree with the view that one should not use these products, but I respect those who prefer not to use them. I understand the thinking, but I cannot prove they are correct in this. Nor can I find scientific evidence that supports using Excel as being harmful for use in a tank. I do check the literature now and then just to see if somebody finally did some lab grade research RE Excel or and similar product.
However, I did find a paper on DIY CO2. It is not the typical research paper and I did not read it, but it looked interesting.

LeVasseur, J., A Treatise on DIY CO2 Systems for Freshwater-Planted Aquaria.

This article will attempt to cover all aspects of DIY CO2 systems used on freshwater-planted aquaria. Insights into the needs of aquatic plants in relation to CO2, and how this relates to CO2 injection methods, will be described. It will examine mechanical designs, and the biology of yeast relating to its ability and conditions by which it produces carbon dioxide. Formulas for yeast mixtures and some details on construction projects will also be provided.
http://www.diendancacanh.com/book/Plant/DIY_CO2_System_John_LeVasseur.pdf

 

[sharkweek178]

I fertilize my shrimp tank with no problem too. You will need a pre-filter sponge on the HOB if you don't have one already.

I have one anyways without shrimp. It's adding another surface area for beneficial bacteria to grow. And it prevents a lot of junk from getting into the filter where you can deal with it by giving the sponge a good rinse every water change.

 

[Bicyclemaster]

I have never been a fan of DIY CO@ for a number of reasons. At the higest count I had 13 planted tanks and only one was a high tech tank where I used pressurized CO2. I had planned to start with DIY to make sure I would benefit before I spent for the pressurized, Back in 2002 before most social media we did things on sites like this one and chat rooms connected to them.

One of the best pieces of advice I got back then was from a few of the plant experts in the chat. Iwas told, if I could addord it, to start with pressured and not "waste my time" with DIY. My high tech planted tank was a 50 gal. I ran it for 9 years before it cam down and I solf off the CO2 system. That tank took too much time to maintain. The plants grew very rapidly and major pruning which for stems meant, uproot. cut in half and replant the top. For the baby tears about avery 6 or 7 weeks I had to remove a huge mat that was lifiting off of the substrate and replant from scratch (i.e. I threw out over 95% of the plants and replant the rest).

On the other hand I have used Flourish Excel in all my other planted tanks. I add it only once a week and only at the recommended dosage. Some folks will never use this product as they believe it is not safe for the fish. I have used it for a very long time and have never seen any evidence of this. My fish are not deformed, they reproduce and also seem to live longer than average. I do know Excel is not CO@ and can not provide the benefits need where the CO@ in aquarium water can be used faster than it can be replaced by just roiling the surface of the water in the tank.

So I do not agree with the view that one should not use these products, but I respect those who prefer not to use them. I understand the thinking, but I cannot prove they are correct in this. Nor can I find scientific evidence that supports using Excel as being harmful for use in a tank. I do check the literature now and then just to see if somebody finally did some lab grade research RE Excel or and similar product.
However, I did find a paper on DIY CO2. It is not the typical research paper and I did not read it, but it looked interesting.

LeVasseur, J., A Treatise on DIY CO2 Systems for Freshwater-Planted Aquaria.

This article will attempt to cover all aspects of DIY CO2 systems used on freshwater-planted aquaria. Insights into the needs of aquatic plants in relation to CO2, and how this relates to CO2 injection methods, will be described. It will examine mechanical designs, and the biology of yeast relating to its ability and conditions by which it produces carbon dioxide. Formulas for yeast mixtures and some details on construction projects will also be provided.
http://www.diendancacanh.com/book/Plant/DIY_CO2_System_John_LeVasseur.pdf

Thank you for all of the insight! I know how challenging it's to maintain a co2 injected tank. I have another one that also has diy co2 and I have to trim it every week or else it get out of control.

I have a few reasons as to why I want to add co2.
Firstly, I got the plants from someone that was injecting co2, so if I don't also add some, the plants will stunt or even die. Some of them are melting quite a bit and co2 deficiency is most likely the cause.
Secondly, I want the plants to grow as much as possible, I love it! I don't mind trimming it, it's my favourite hobby. Also, the tank is small, it doesn't take that long to trim it.

I'll look into the article you sent, it got me intrigued, I hope I learn something interesting from it.

Btw, I have liquid carbon, I use it every few days as an algicide. From what I know, glutaraldehyde only acts as an algicide and it doesn't really help plant growth. Although I can always be wrong.

 

[StevenF]

I have a few reasons as to why I want to add co2.
Firstly, I got the plants from someone that was injecting co2, so if I don't also add some, the plants will stunt or even die. Some of them are melting quite a bit and co2 deficiency is most likely the cause.

IN my experience CO2 is the least likely cause of plant growth problem. The most common cause of plant growth problem is not enough nutrients such as nitrogen, potassium, calcium, magnesium, phosphate, sulfur, chlorine, Iron, Manganese, boron, zinc, copper, molybdenum, and nickel. Floating plants like balvinia get all the GO2 they need from the air and have first access to light. But many people have problems growing floating plants. Mainly because on or more of the nutrients I listed above is missing. So flo
ating plants are a very good indicator of any nutrient issues.

Also many people assume that just buying a fertilizer will resolve any nutrient issues. But most fertilizers don't have all the nutrients plants need because they assume your tap water has those nutrients. But unfortunately not everyone has the same water. In my case for good reasons I decided to use RO water in my tank. i took me years to figure how to get plants to grow well. I ended up making my own fertilizer

If you still want to use CO2 I suggest you try a passive CO2 system. With a traditional CO2 diffuser you have frequently check your CO2 flow rate. If the flow get to high you could kill your fish from too much CO2. Passive CO2 is inherently safer because if you put too much in the CO2 be large bubbles of CO2 from the belll with go to the surface and harmlessly dissipate. Also passive CO2 is fare more efficient at getting CO2 to dissolve in the water. Also Passive CO2 puts the CO2 level at 10mg/liter which is equivalent to 400ppm in the air. The drop checker used in with diffusers will not detect CO2 is the concentration is less than 30mg/L in the water. 3 times higher than the atmospheric concentration. For Passive CO2 system you don't use a drop checker to monitor CO2 IN fact most people using passive CO2 use drop checkers since they don't work at 10mg/L.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Actually, learn about the tripod and plants. A trupod has three legs. if they are not all the same length, the stool wobbles. If the difference in keg lengths, the stool become usable as firewood.

That said the three legs for keeping aquatic plants in out tanks thriving are light, nutrients and CO2. There things must be in proper balance for the specific types and mass of plants in any tank. The most common result of not having them in balance is algae. And the more demanding the plants, the easier it is to have an imbalance that makes one earn the fish MBA (Mastered By Algae).

I am a planted tank enthuisest, but I keep plants because they keep the water clean and they benefit the fish. I also breed plecos and none of those tanks has plants and the lights on them are only turned on when I work in a tank.

At my peak I has 13 planted tanks. They ranged from easy low light through more demanding medium light and finally I kept one tank with pressurized CO2 for just under 10 years. I finally got rid of it because I had 20 tanks running and this planted tank required more work related to the plants than my three biggest tanks which were not hi light. I am a fish keeper not an aquatic gardener.

I do not use a drop checker, I did not use a fancy diffuser. I am space constrained and I do display type tanks to there is as little equipment in the tank visible as possible. I ran my pressurized co2 barebones. Bottle-->regulator-->clippard needle valve-->viaCO2 resistent tubing-->bubble counter-->into the intake of the Eheim canister on the tank. The water from the canister cam out of a spray bar that was placed veritcally in the back right corner of the tank behind plants and it was almost invisble, The intake with aprefilter was at the opposite and of the tank and completely hidden by plants and wood.

This was one of the healthiest tanks I have run. I do not recall every having to medicate for anything in the almost 10 years I had it running. .I also do not recall having to remove a dead fish either. I did rotate what fish I kept over time but that was more out of interest in having different fish than anything. Nor di I ever geta plant which failed to thrive in that tank which was one reason it needed so much work.

I am not a fan of Amano tanks. I respect the art involved by I do not consider them to resemble natural aquatic environment at all. Plants can help make a tank look nicer just like wood and rocks can. But plants have other benefits that, for me, are the real reason I keep them in community tanks.

I am not into paying lots of money for fancy plant supplies. I have done it without needing or using them. My substrate is not specifically for plants. I do fine with mulm, Jobes Spikes and Tropica liquid Fertilizers. The former are dirt cheap and the latter are not. t averages out. I also use Excel in all my planted tanks except in the CO2 injected one when I had it. The one thing I do not consider Excel to be is an algacide. It will hlep with algae because the algae cannot use it as a carbon substitute and then because thriving plants (who use it) do not leave much, if anything, for the algae to use.

And this is why it is important to have those three legs of the tripod in proper balance with each other and at the proper levels for the specific plants in any tank. When the stool wobbles so do the plants and that will let the algae thrive.

I only have shrimp in planted tanks and I fertilize all those tanks and the shrimp thrive. I have a 5.5 gal. with a thriving red cheryy shrimp colony that went into the tank about 12-15 years ago. Amanos live a very long time iin my tanks. They do not seem to mind the ferts or the Excel.