Driftwood not sinking

[cowgirluntamed]

So....got the rocks tested....now I have a question. I did not rinse them off first so I think I got some reaction to the dust that was on them. Subsequent testing yielded they were safe. SOME of the rocks seemed to react more. But, when I kept adding acid (used a syringe) it almost looked like it was eating scale off of the outside of the rocks. I finally got to the point of no reactions.

So, can rocks get scale that the acid will just clean off? I do have them sitting in a bucket of water and I will be testing it in the next couple of days.

I normally put new driftwood in a plastic tub filled with water, sometimes with a powerhead simply to keep water flowing around (whether that actually helps or not but I do that anyway as there is a little logic to it somehow, lol).

Then a couple of small 500ml bottles filled with sand and place these bottles strategically placed on top of driftwood in a bid to keep the driftwood submerged and in a couple of weeks time the driftwood usually are waterlogged and will stay down with no or minimal effort then I transfer them to my main tank.

I do this for a couple of reasons, one, depending on my planned tank set up, to help keep tannins and little bits of debris from the wood itself out of the main tank, tannins do no harm to livestock at all btw, in fact can be benificial to certain livestock as is a natural antitoxidant.

Second, this helps me to ensure there are no nasties on the wood itself, I have gone through having damselfies eggs on wood and thus developed into nymph lavaes which predated on my fish and shrimps in main tank so this is my main fear, any critters invading my tank is a no no imho.

Third, to help get rid of any possible toxins in the wood itself, unlikely to be any toxins in the wood as long as you know wood is safe to use and bought from a reliable source but this helps to give me peace of mind that the wood has been in water for at least a week or two to help get rid of any leeched toxins in a water conatiner rather than endagering any of my livestock in main tanks.

Perhaps a little OTT for most folks, but this is just me being me, lol.

This actually makes sense, I just didn't think about soaking it at all.....I think mostly I was going to use just mopani and then I was like...hey, I have this other wood! I'll use that too! so....yeah...now here I am with non sinking driftwood! Lol.

 

[Colin_T]

Rocks can have layers of dirt, algae, lichens or biofilm on the outside and that can lift off. Some rocks have layers but they are usually a few mm thick and some rocks also get sealant on them to make them shiny and that can come off too.

 

[cowgirluntamed]

Rocks can have layers of dirt, algae, lichens or biofilm on the outside and that can lift off. Some rocks have layers but they are usually a few mm thick and some rocks also get sealant on them to make them shiny and that can come off too.

Thanks! Hopefully these will be ok then. Most of them are a reddish beige color and a couple are darker grey/black. None are white though they were all dusty. I didn't notice white stuff on them until I put acid on them but it did come off. Thanks for the help!

 

[cowgirluntamed]

@Colin_T so.....yesterday I put all the rocks in the same bucket. Filled it with water....now, it hasn't been quite 24 hours yet, but I did a liquid api ph test anyway. My NORMAL tank ph (and other tap water tests I have done) has always read 8.2. Right now? 6.6-7! What's up with that? Did I maybe not get the acid all off of them or something? I've never had ph that low EVER!

Here is a couple of other tests, one from my 20 gallon- 8 to 8.2 (hard to say). I did a water change on it yesterday.

Water sitting in 55 with no movement (soaking the driftwood) is at 7.6......

Ok, I'm at a major loss.....

Double checked with some tetra test strips. A tote of water I did yesterday was right around 8. 20 gallon is 8-8.2. 55 water is 7.8 and the bucket full of rocks is 7.....

The date on the pH bottles is 12/2018. I would say may be bad but would the strips be off that much too?

 

[Colin_T]

The driftwood is probably dropping the pH in the 55g tank.

Unless you soaked all the rocks in acid they shouldn't be dropping the pH that much, especially if you washed them off with water after using the acid. However, it could be acid residue from the rocks if they are in a small volume of water. Try tipping the water out, rinse the rocks again and refill their bucket. Check the pH straight after filling it and again tomorrow.

If the pH is low tomorrow then put each rock in its own bucket of water and check the pH 24 hours later. It might only be 1 or 2 rocks dropping the pH and the others are fine.

If it is 1 or 2 rocks then add a couple of heaped tablespoons of Sodium Bicarbonate (Baking soda) into each bucket of water, stir and leave for 24 hours. The bicarb will neutralise any remaining acid.

 

[seangee]

How much acid did you put on them

 

[cowgirluntamed]

How much acid did you put on them

Not much at all. I used a syringe to squirt it on them so yeah.....

The driftwood is probably dropping the pH in the 55g tank.

Unless you soaked all the rocks in acid they shouldn't be dropping the pH that much, especially if you washed them off with water after using the acid. However, it could be acid residue from the rocks if they are in a small volume of water. Try tipping the water out, rinse the rocks again and refill their bucket. Check the pH straight after filling it and again tomorrow.

If the pH is low tomorrow then put each rock in its own bucket of water and check the pH 24 hours later. It might only be 1 or 2 rocks dropping the pH and the others are fine.

If it is 1 or 2 rocks then add a couple of heaped tablespoons of Sodium Bicarbonate (Baking soda) into each bucket of water, stir and leave for 24 hours. The bicarb will neutralise any remaining acid.

Thanks! I think I will get something bigger than a bucket this time too...or maybe split them into two or more containers with water after rinsing. Maybe that will help narrow things down as well. Thanks a bunch for the help!

As for the 55, I agree, even though tannins haven't seemed to do much in my tanks before. But this is quite a bit of wood (including large pieces of mopani) and the tank is only filled a third of the way.

 

[cowgirluntamed]

Ph straight out of the tap is 7.5. This is without letting it sit out of course. I have 4 small totes that I divided the rocks in to so let's hope I see better results tomorrow!

 

[cowgirluntamed]

@Colin_T just tested all the totes. They were all 7.6. (I did a couple of high ph tests and they didn't quite match 7.4).

I mean...I'm not upset that it's 7.6....but why would it be different than my normal 8.2? I am on well water as well. It hasn't rained lately either so it shouldn't be diluted if that can even happen....

Big question, is it safe to go ahead and use them in the tank, though it may just be temporarily anyway.

 

[cowgirluntamed]

Well, I wanted to do my hardscape....and I used 2 of the rocks. But that's it so far! Lol. How's it look? I'm gonna go order my plants!

 

[Colin_T]

So your well water normally has a pH of 8.2, but your tap water is now 7.5 and the buckets went to 7.6?

Can you test the well water from the well, or is it like a bore where you draw up the ground water and it gets pumped into the water pipes in the house?

Ground water/ well water is normally pretty stabile due to the rock and soil the water has to drain through before it reaches the water table. It also takes quite a long time for the water to drain through the soil and rocks so even if it rains today, the rain probably won't get into the ground water for many years.

Are you using a liquid pH test kit or the paper strip tests?
The paper ones are not as accurate as the liquid but should be out that much unless it was a bad batch.

Perhaps you could take a sample of water to a petshop and get them to check the pH. Take your test kit and check the pH at the same time. Then if there is a major difference, one of the test kits needs replacing

 

[cowgirluntamed]

So your well water normally has a pH of 8.2, but your tap water is now 7.5 and the buckets went to 7.6?

Can you test the well water from the well, or is it like a bore where you draw up the ground water and it gets pumped into the water pipes in the house?

Ground water/ well water is normally pretty stabile due to the rock and soil the water has to drain through before it reaches the water table. It also takes quite a long time for the water to drain through the soil and rocks so even if it rains today, the rain probably won't get into the ground water for many years.

Are you using a liquid pH test kit or the paper strip tests?
The paper ones are not as accurate as the liquid but should be out that much unless it was a bad batch.

Perhaps you could take a sample of water to a petshop and get them to check the pH. Take your test kit and check the pH at the same time. Then if there is a major difference, one of the test kits needs replacing

Yeah...well water is normally 8.2...I don't think I can get a sample straight from the well but there is a faucet outside the well house, would that work? I can also test from my mom and dad's house too, same well, just to see.

How long do I need to agitate the water before testing? I know I can let it sit out for 24 hours to gas off (which I didn't do when I tested it earlier).

I will probably be testing a lot of stuff...lol. just refilled that 55 all the way, I have a small tote that I put my bristlenose in briefly to deep clean the tank he was in(parasites that won't go away). I haven't dumped the water out of the totes the rocks are in yet either.

I'm using a liquid test kit mostly. It expires at the end of the year I believe....I may go ahead and replace that, it's not like they are expensive...lol. but the strips were showing around the same....so I dunno...

 

[Colin_T]

if the liquid and paper test kits are showing similar results then they are probably fine.
Keep medications & test kits cool and dry to prolong their life. I keep mine in a plastic container with lid, in the bottom of the fridge.
*NB* Make sure children and animals can't get the test kits because they usually have pretty toxic chemicals in them.

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If you have a tap outside the well house then use that, and if you can check the water at your parents place that would help too because it will help too by giving you another reference point for the water.

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You can take a sample of water and test it straight away. Write the results down, then test it 12 & 24 hours later. You could have several containers of the same water and aerate 1 container but leave the other container of water stationary. Then check them both. That will tell you if aeration is affecting the pH.

And if you want to be really nerdy about it, you could test each sample every hour for a 24 hour period, and photograph the test results each time. Then put the pictures on your pc and look at them in a side by side comparison to see if they all look the same or if there is any change. But that's probably overkill and more for weirdos like me

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You can leave fish in a tank to do a big water change. Just drain the water level down so the fish have enough room to swim and aren't resting on the substrate and then fill the tank back up.

You mention the bristlenose has parasites. Can you elaborate on that, symptoms, picture, etc?

 

[cowgirluntamed]

if the liquid and paper test kits are showing similar results then they are probably fine.
Keep medications & test kits cool and dry to prolong their life. I keep mine in a plastic container with lid, in the bottom of the fridge.
*NB* Make sure children and animals can't get the test kits because they usually have pretty toxic chemicals in them.

I've never thought of putting them in the fridge...that's a good idea...lol. I always keep them away from the pets for sure! No kids to worry about here. Lol.

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If you have a tap outside the well house then use that, and if you can check the water at your parents place that would help too because it will help too by giving you another reference point for the water.

Will do! I just have to remember all of this! Lol.

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You can take a sample of water and test it straight away. Write the results down, then test it 12 & 24 hours later. You could have several containers of the same water and aerate 1 container but leave the other container of water stationary. Then check them both. That will tell you if aeration is affecting the pH.

And if you want to be really nerdy about it, you could test each sample every hour for a 24 hour period, and photograph the test results each time. Then put the pictures on your pc and look at them in a side by side comparison to see if they all look the same or if there is any change. But that's probably overkill and more for weirdos like me

I don't think I want to be THAT nerdy about it...but I will definitely try to test at least 12-24 hours.

Oh, the tub that I put the bristlenose in, I tested with strips today, and it is 8.2 ph! Normal. I will test the 55 and the tubs of rocks with the liquid kit soon.

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You can leave fish in a tank to do a big water change. Just drain the water level down so the fish have enough room to swim and aren't resting on the substrate and then fill the tank back up.

You mention the bristlenose has parasites. Can you elaborate on that, symptoms, picture, etc?

I know I can leave them for just a water change. But these things won't go away. I don't know if they are affecting him physically....but from what happened a while ago is why I'm worried about these things.

So, I bought some plants off of ebay and didn't treat or quarantine (water lettuce). I had a 5.5 gallon betta tank and ended up with a hydra outbreak. So, took the betta out and put him in the quarantine tank that I was getting up and ready to receive 2 baby bristlenose. At this point, the betta had been getting cyst-like things around his face (not ick) that would fall off. Not exactly sure what it was. Anyway....he did that in the quarantine tank. I also had 3 nerite snails as well.

Used hydrogen peroxide to treat for the hydra. It worked. Finally got betta and snails back in. I had a mini canister filter on this thing and one day, ALL of the snails were above the spray bar (I had the water flow pointing a bit up and towards the back of the tank). They NEVER did this before.....so I started looking and all this things were crawling around on the glass everywhere.....

Anyway.....I treated with panacur dog dewormer and it didn't work. My betta got dropsy and died. The snails I took and put in a tote...and these things transfered and multiplied rapidly! They attacked the snails....so I ended up with two totes...and a small clean bowl of water..and once a day I would dip the snails in this clean water and switch to the other tote, and go dump and bleach the precious tote and fill with fresh water. One snail didn't make it....

Now, to the 20 gallon...they were in there too. I tried general cure, no planaria (twice) and maybe something else but I can't remember. I was having some physical issues at the time and my fish in that tank started to die....

Now, back to this 10 gallon....I got the betta out before I got Butch and his sibling in and put them in there. Well, one day one of them stopped moving....it died...and I noticed absolutely tons of these things in it...still have tried tons of stuff to no avail, so I wanted to bleach what I could and hope I didn't transfer any to this tote. He is supposed to go in my new 55 and I don't want to spread these things anymore....

And as for the 20....I ended up putting those fish down...I couldn't stand watching them die one by one and physically I couldn't take care of it at that point. It sat there with barely any water in it (a couple inches over the substrate) for a good year and I did nothing to it....and those things were still there. I bleached it before I set it up again.

So, sorry for the long story, but here is a picture. I believe them to be some type of planaria that at the very least, kills snails...which I want in my tanks. At the most it also eventually killed fish but I'm wondering if there was a parasite I couldnt see that really did them in, which sounds more likely as Butch is still alive and well even though he was living with them. (Oh, and a note...this tank wasn't taken care of well due to the risk of these spreading. So lots of pleco poo in there...way too much...I'm not proud of it at all. *sigh*)

 

[cowgirluntamed]

Water in totes with rocks is 7.6. The 55 gallon is a bit lower (7.3 or 7.2). I'm gonna check the gh and kh on the 55 and see what that says... kh on the 55 was 13. Gh was 15 (highest I've ever gotten!). Those are the number of drops. I don't remember how to get the ppm numbers.