onebto
Fish Herder
lol 
Does Nobody Read The Pinned Articles Anymore
- Thread starter SuperColey1
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xxBarneyxx
Fish Aficionado
this one is easy to answerPlanted tanks are a very time consuming hobby whether they have livestock or not.
AC
So totally true, the whole hobby is like this and people should take more time to learn about any animals they are keeping.
OP
OP
SuperColey1
Planted Section
Some people just aren't google savvy - refining your search to get some worthwhile answers can take a bit of practise and some never get the knack (although once you have it you kinda forget what it was like to not have it), on another hand sometimes google is what led the person here - google led me here
I think Dave was using google as an example of how easy it is to try and get information we need before asking i.e. searching.
Within this forum there isn't much need to use google. There will be virtually no questions that haven't been asked before and whilst I don't expect people to trawl through the next 10 pages of threads looking for an identical question to their own they could at least look at the pins and the first page before starting a thread which looks like one 4 below it and when opened is the identical same question just for a different person!!!
AC
JustKia
Fish Herder
I don't disagree - as a moderator for a good many years on a different forum I have been the one pointing people to stickies and search buttons, merging posts that are nigh on identical and such like. I have no doubt I have been and will be again at some point guilty of posting in excitement/panic/daze without reading stickies
, but then some people are also just blind to them even if you outlined them in bright flashing neon 
So, with search not working and having landed here from google their first instinct is to post first read later, because they "need" an answer now and "haven't got time" to read all the ready prepared info
OP
OP
SuperColey1
Planted Section
This is half the problem. These people will never make it with a planted tank because they are lazy and impatient!!!
In planted what could people possibly 'need to know now'? I can understand someone banging straight into Tropical Fish Emergencies with a fish problem because that might be urgent but with the planted hobby do they really think they are going to be able to go out tomorrow, buy all the gear, set it up and have everything sorted within a week?
I would say I could go out buy everything needed and get it running, scaped, planted and stocked within the same day but then thats because I have the knowledge. When I started and I didn't have the knowledge it took me a long time of sifting information. sifting the good from the downright incorrect, copying, experimenting, learning etc before I got to where I am now.
I must admit I don't have much time for the lazy and impatient. I have lots of time to help those who want to learn and therefore I help them fill in the gaps and try to clarify some confusing points within methodolgy etc. Some people just don't understand how complex the planted tank is!!!! nor do they understand that a fully planted tank will on average cost 10x that of a basic fish tank with plastic decorations!!!! There are exceptions like Non CO2 methods etc but they are even harder to achieve and take even more experience!
AC
xxBarneyxx
Fish Aficionado
lol funny you should say that. My planted tank was almost as expensive as a reef setup (except for the livestock costs). I actually find my reef tank a lot less hassle to maintain as well (having to prune back plants everyday and dose ferts gets real boring after 8 or 9 months of it ).
).
"Haven't got the time" doesn't mean lazy necessarily. so be careful with the word use. A person could have work, school, family life, illness, other activities, etc. You see a pretty tank with plants and want to have one of your own. One more thing to add to the list of things you already have on your plate. Planted tanks, like any aquarium really, need their maintenance. I know that when I'm busy, the tanks suffer. Thank goodness, they are stable systems whose age allows me to be more lax. Those results took patience. I still had to downgrade and refine how I approach the hobby to accomodate my work, and I know something about the hobby!
That being said, if you can't devote the time to do at least the minimal research, study, and maintenance, I honestly do not recommend planted tanks to such individuals. I'm not being mean. It's not that they are lazy, but planted tanks, in my opinion, require some more thought and upkeep in the beginning and then the patience to follow through with maintenance. I liken it to marine setups with liverock, inverts, fish, and corals. You wouldn't just fill up a tank, add a little salt, throw in a coral and pray, would you?! Likewise, you can't just throw in plants. It is a waste of money, and ultimately, a waste of life.
I like the idea of a "Planted tanks for Dummies" pin, but I will have to merge some of the older pins, or we'll get too pin heavy. Already, I have to scroll quite a bit before I get to the actual threads for this section.
I've got lots of work to do and I greatly appreciate our members here who have been answering posts. I'm not as active a poster as I used to be, the board has been dealing with some issues as of late with Spammers and I have been involved with that and I have a lot of work. I do read the posts, however, and for the most part, barring a slight penchant for investing in gadgets and gizmos, the advice has been great. We've got a great group here and I enjoy moderating for you.
llj
Some people just aren't google savvy - refining your search to get some worthwhile answers can take a bit of practise and some never get the knack (although once you have it you kinda forget what it was like to not have it), on another hand sometimes google is what led the person here - google led me here
yep Goggle searching is an art, many do not master.
on topic. it not half the fun of the forum scenario, the asking and posting of questions? yeh, sure, you often see the same questions over again. but as you spend time on the forum, the more experienced start leaving the answers to these questions, to others who have answered them less. this also brings new people into the mix, avoiding the older members getting jaded.
sadly it seems a sign of the times we live in. if someone does not like things, instead of getting on with it, they plan ways to force people not to do it. Personally, i get a kick from answering a question, asked a 1000 times before, and seeing the recipient take the advice and pass it on.
andywg
Bored into leaving
I am not common in this area of the forum, but I feel your pain Andy.
The same often happens in the SW section. Now most of the members reply with something along the lines of "read the pins and then come back with any questions you still have (which you almost certainly will)" and leave them to go and search for info. In the circumstances I think that strikes a nice balance; it reminds people to do a bit for themselves and is not too condescending or trolling the n00bs.
The simple fact is that most people do not read pins (and many are not aware of their existence). If they did the forum would have far less traffic but retain far more of the more experienced members who wander off. I have often pointed out that if everyone read all the pins we could close the newbies and emergencies subfora to new topics as it has all been covered before.
So, reply with a single sentence post and it will soon catch on.
The same often happens in the SW section. Now most of the members reply with something along the lines of "read the pins and then come back with any questions you still have (which you almost certainly will)" and leave them to go and search for info. In the circumstances I think that strikes a nice balance; it reminds people to do a bit for themselves and is not too condescending or trolling the n00bs.
The simple fact is that most people do not read pins (and many are not aware of their existence). If they did the forum would have far less traffic but retain far more of the more experienced members who wander off. I have often pointed out that if everyone read all the pins we could close the newbies and emergencies subfora to new topics as it has all been covered before.
So, reply with a single sentence post and it will soon catch on.
aaronnorth
www.ukaps.org
Not many do though with planted tanks, there are so many variables and some dont bother to share their experiences, there must only be about 5 regular posters on this section who care to give their time up, Questions in this forum sometimes require quite complex answers and not many people can be bothered to write that much,
Out of the hundreds of members that we help, we hardly see anyone return to this section, which is a shame really.
kcharley
Fish Fanatic
Hi Aaron, AC and all,
First thank you for the advice you have given me. (I am still gathering parts for my CO2 system but the regulator is here and the reactor, tank and timers are on the way.)
As LLJ said, many people get busy with other parts of their lives. This happens to me too with wife, kids, job and finances. I also don't have the gift to write quickly. I labor through my posts thinking things out. As I become more knowledgeable hopefully I will get quicker and feel more equipped to answer someone else's questions.
I tried to do this in the newbie forum and my answer was overwhelming. I've learned from that and will keep the answer shorter next time. But I think I did help the guy as it looked like he was going to overlight the tank without a CO2 system in place.
As a noob, I wouldn't be offended at all if someone said that the answer is in x pinned topic. While I have read most of them, planted tanks are complex and it is easy to forget or not even realize that I have read the answer to my question.
I'm also not offended if my question is answered at all. That tells me that I am either asking a stupid question or the answer is so simply found that I just need to look a little harder for it myself.
I'm starting to ramble so I will shut up after again saying thank you to all of you, especially Aaron and AC. I really do appreciate your help.
Greg
FlaNoob
New Member
Heck i'm just glad my post was way way lower down the page ..... of course it could have been the one that got AC close to going off, he did seem a little short. BUT i did like the car analagy... it works. LOL dont take it so hard Andy. Your hard work shows in the 'Scapes' you have put together.
Also remember not everyone learns the same way, There are basicly 4 differant types/ways humans learn
1. the readers: You will seldom if ever hear from them, They will read the Pinned Info, read the threads, research it to death, then carfully plot out a plan or execution, Then methodicaly and almost mechanicaly execute the plan they put together from the information. When they hit on something they like be it results or the like, they will stick with it and change only if forced to.
2. Just do it types: Will read the information, with out completly buying into it, These types will form there own processes, and jump right into the task and try and make it work useing there own methods, kind of like Trial and error. We are talking way off the charts here, these types seem to have the weird abailaty to completly skip a step or process, and still make it work. Not right, and not wrong, Just differant
3. Tell me then show me: These types like to ask the questions, get a process clear in their head, Then watch the process as it was described, then do it themselves. These types tend to make those intuitive "Jumps" just because it makes sense to them. Generally very fast learners.
4. Show Me: These are the "Tell Me How To Do It Step By Step" people, They learn strictly by example. walk them the entire process step by step, and they have got it. their down side: Seldom if ever make that "jump" outside the box. It is one way and only one way only for these folks. and often they will become extremely adept at what ever task or process they have been showen.
ok getting off my little soap box now..... Cheers Y'all
Also remember not everyone learns the same way, There are basicly 4 differant types/ways humans learn
1. the readers: You will seldom if ever hear from them, They will read the Pinned Info, read the threads, research it to death, then carfully plot out a plan or execution, Then methodicaly and almost mechanicaly execute the plan they put together from the information. When they hit on something they like be it results or the like, they will stick with it and change only if forced to.
2. Just do it types: Will read the information, with out completly buying into it, These types will form there own processes, and jump right into the task and try and make it work useing there own methods, kind of like Trial and error. We are talking way off the charts here, these types seem to have the weird abailaty to completly skip a step or process, and still make it work. Not right, and not wrong, Just differant
3. Tell me then show me: These types like to ask the questions, get a process clear in their head, Then watch the process as it was described, then do it themselves. These types tend to make those intuitive "Jumps" just because it makes sense to them. Generally very fast learners.
4. Show Me: These are the "Tell Me How To Do It Step By Step" people, They learn strictly by example. walk them the entire process step by step, and they have got it. their down side: Seldom if ever make that "jump" outside the box. It is one way and only one way only for these folks. and often they will become extremely adept at what ever task or process they have been showen.
ok getting off my little soap box now..... Cheers Y'all
juanveldez
helping big fish eat little fish everyday
As Andywg said really there is no point in getting upset over this. just point em in the right direction by either providing a link for them or telling em the general direction to look and go about your business.
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