Discus

[Cheese Specialist]

Well,

As some of you may know, I got 4 2" discus last week to go in my 225l cube tank. I was planning on having them with my 2 young koi angels and perhaps some tetra. Well, the day after putting the discus in, I noticed the angels were being narky and didn't understand it (they are usually really nice). I then noticed they had laid eggs. So, I took out the discus and put them in a 40l tank for now.

Now then, I never expected the eggs to still be there and the angels to do so well from what I had read about frist spawnings. It's now been about a week and they have been werigglers for a couple of days and they have been moved by the parents, it's increasingly looking like I will have angel fry.

I want to move the discus out of the 40l because although they are small, I don't like them being stuck in there. Now, my options are limited because of other fish I have (like tiger barbs in the 160). Could they go in this tank...

Size: 320l - 60" x 18" x 18"
Filtration: 2 x Eheim Ecco 2233
Decor: Sand, wood, plants

Fish:

2 x chromidotilapia finleyi cichlids (I am not sure about them being ok with those)
3 x penguin tetra
4 x clown loaches
5 x Siamese Flying Fox
2 x Adult Angels
1 x boesmani rainbow (I know there should be more, but they died )
1 x golden gourami
1 x farlowella/stick catfish
4 x kuhli loaches
2 x mollies
2 x albino kribs
1 x silver hatchet (I know there should be more of these also but the LFS ones are always sick)
2 x plec - LO52 and L134

Levels:

Amonia: 0
NitrIte: 0
NitrAte: 5
Ph: 7.3

It's possible that they could go back in the cube once the angels are done because I can't really have fry all the time. Some fish can be rearranged maybe with my other tank, maybe but it is pretty stocked.

I need to get them out of the tank they are in now, but my plans all went out of the window with the angels breeding.

What are your thoughts? Thanks for any help.

 

[CFC]

Not a chance!!!!

Sorry to be blunt but there is no way you could keep discus in that tank with those fish. As im sure you know discus do not like active fast moving tankmates so the SAE's and rainbow alone make the tank impractical, then take the frenyi and kribs into account on behalf of their semi aggressive behaviour and youve got the discus tank of doom.
Also in 9 out of 10 cases discus and angelfish do not make a good mix, angels are far to bolshy and aggressive for the timid peaceful discus, really they should only be kept with a few small heat tolerant tetras like rummynoses or cardinals and a few corydoras and L# plecs. Really you need to make the choice of discus or angels in the cube tank as now your angels have spawned once they will do it every 2 to 3 months from now on.

 

[Cheese Specialist]

Hmmm

Not sure what to do in that case. The angels are not staying in the cube permanantly. Just until I feel I can move the fry to the 78l tank to be with the krib fry. I do not want the angels breeding, I will be putting them back in the 320l, where they never bred before so hpefully won't this time.

I am not sure what to do. I have wrigglers in the cube with the 2 angels. But I can't really do anything until I can move them, but I don't know when that will be. The discus are now in a 40l tank and I want to move them into the cube ASAP but can't because of the fry. Eventually, I want the discus in the cube and the angel fry in the 78l and the parents (not breeding!) in the 320l.

I just don't know what to do for the best.

Oh, and don't be sorry for being blunt. It's the best way.

 

[CFC]

What are the eggs laid on? If the spawning substrate is removable then you can transfer it to the 40L to use as a hatchery and raising tank, put the parents wherever you want to and then give the discus back their tank.

 

[Cheese Specialist]

What are the eggs laid on? If the spawning substrate is removable then you can transfer it to the 40L to use as a hatchery and raising tank, put the parents wherever you want to and then give the discus back their tank.

Hmmm, I thought about that but I am worried about the effect on the angel parents. Will they be affected by having what they were looking after so well taken away? I would have done it before now but I was worried about that and would have liked to let the angels do it as they have done so well up until now.

I don't think I haveanywahere to do it to but if the wrigglers and the parents were moved, would the parents still look after them?

The wrigglers are on a plants so they could be moved. Would it be best to take the angels out first?

I am way out of my depth here, I never expected all these fry. I've never even had livebearer fry!!

 

[CFC]

Remove the eggs first using a submerged container which the whole spawning site can fit into, the eggs must not come into contact with air, then remove the parent angels to wherever they are going to be housed, the 40L will be too small for a pair so they cannot go with the eggs (but you already knew that). The loss of the eggs may cause a little distress at first but they will soon get over it and try again, there is the small chance that the pair bond could break but since you dont really want a spawning pair of angels at the moment this wouldnt be such a bad thing.
The eggs in the 40L will need to be aerated so you should position a airstone beneath the plant insuring that the stream of bubbles runs over the eggs.

 

[Cheese Specialist]

My boyfriend think you are trying to play it down. Sorry, just need to show that it's not like I don't believe you! Could the angels go in the 40l for about a week or so until the fry are free swimming or would they eat the wrigglers? The angels are still small, about 2" across body size. I have Stu saying the parents will be distraught and it's cruel and me thinking about what's for the best overall.

If I can get my boyfriend to let me move the wrigglers...should I fill the tank with water from the cube? Do I add a little water to whatever they are in like you would a fish? Should I leave the filter in? Someone said they would get sucked up the filter because they are weak (it's a fluval 1). I have an airstone and a small pump so that should be fine.

Sorry for all the questions, thanks for your help.

 

[Crookster]

I have also heard not to mix discus and angels, but not due to temperement but because they can pass on parasites. I find that my Discus will stick up for themselves and aren't actually that timid. I would advise against puting fast moving fish with them though. I made that mistake with 2 silver dollars and am having to get a larger tank to re-home them now.

Anyway the reason for the post is was wondering if you had any pics of your chromidotilapia finleyi cichlids or do you know the common name for them?

Oh, and sorry again about the other day

 

[Cheese Specialist]

Oh, and sorry again about the other day

No problem, gald we agree on the Ferguson/Man U thing! lol

Like many cichlid I don't think there is a common name for the finleyis,. However, they were renamed recetly to Benitochromis nigrodorsalis. *just having a look for a pic*...

I can't get into photobucket, but here's one form a website:

Mine are a lot more colourful than that one,I got them by accident in a Trimar Order but they are utterly gorgeous and I love them! Oh, here's a better pic...

I know about the parasite thing, they will not be in with angels anymore. Need to try and stop my angels breeding. I am going to have them in the cube with some tetra and perhaps an L183.

 

[CFC]

I have had angelfish spawn in community tank where the eggs have been eaten by another fish after a few days and although the parents generally look a little unhappy at first they quickly return to normal and begin preparing for the next attempt, i have had a single pair spawn 3 times in a month before!
A internal power filter is too strong for fry, to prevent them being sucked into the filter you can place the whole filter into the foot of a old clean pair of tights/stocking but changing it to a small air powered sponge filter would be best as the fry will feed on micro organisms that live on the sponge. If you move the angels in with the eggs there is a good chance they will eat them, often if cichlids become stressed they will eat the clutch/brood to regain the nutrients they have lost during spawning, much in the same way as cats and dog will eat kittens and puppies sometimes, also in the confines of such a small tank i would expect there to be aggression between the stressed fish.

The choice is yours but i would advise getting the discus into the bigger tank ASAP, they are expensive and delicate fish and if they become sick from stress or poor water quality from being in a small tank they may not respond to treatment.

 

[Crookster]

They're beautiful!

They look a bit like Rams but different colour. How big do they get and are they nasty little things?

Sorry to hi-jack your question btw.

 

[Cheese Specialist]

I cannot get another filter, I will do the tights idea I think. I looked around my LFS yesterday and they had nothing of use as I had it in mind.

I feel like I am stuck in the middle. The discus seem quite content in the small tank at the moment and they are tiny (incidently, they weren't expensive at all. Must be lucky!). My boyfriend keeps saying it's cruel and the angels' fry are the most impartant concern at the moment.

But, I am going to move them, I can't see any other way round it. I will move the angels into the big tank and the discus into the cube.

What about aclimatising the wrigglers and what water to use? Does that matter?

I feel stressed.

 

[Cheese Specialist]

They're beautiful!

They look a bit like Rams but different colour. How big do they get and are they nasty little things?

Sorry to hi-jack your question btw.

I think they get around the 6" mark. They are gorgeous! I lvoe their big eyes, I am told the have very interesting breeding behaviour too. I think mine are getting jiggy, or fancy it. NO MORE BREEDING! lol

When I got them, I had to do a fair bit of frantic internet research and read they were semi-aggressive and could be very aggressive with each other. Mine are grweat, they chase fish away from their spot but nothing more and are happy for my plec and kuhlis to be in there spot strangely. They are often aggressive to each other but nothing major, a few damaged fins but that's all fine now. In fact, they are being suspiciously harmonious at the moment!!

 

[CFC]

I cannot get another filter, I will do the tights idea I think. I looked around my LFS yesterday and they had nothing of use as I had it in mind.

I feel like I am stuck in the middle. The discus seem quite content in the small tank at the moment and they are tiny (incidently, they weren't expensive at all. Must be lucky!). My boyfriend keeps saying it's cruel and the angels' fry are the most impartant concern at the moment.

But, I am going to move them, I can't see any other way round it. I will move the angels into the big tank and the discus into the cube.

What about aclimatising the wrigglers and what water to use? Does that matter?

I feel stressed.

It would be best to use water from the cube to fill the 40L tank to avoid any shock.

How small are your discus? No self respecting dealer will let go of discus less than 3" in diameter due to the high mortality rates in young discus, if yours are smaller than this it would explain why they were a little cheaper, also without wishing to cause you anymore stress i would advise you dont become too attached to them until they reach at least 3-3 1/2" in diameter as many small discus fall to the dreaded discus plague in the early stages of life. My advise would be to get them into the bigger tank and start feeding them 3 times a day minimum with as much of a varied diet as you can.

 

[Cheese Specialist]

OK, I have moved the angel fry into the 40l and the discus into the cube.

I am not sure if the fry are ok. They are still wriggling but not swimming about as many were doing in the cube, but lying on the bottom wriggling. They are all in little clumps but seem happy enough. I put tights over the filter which was grand, there are only 2 small vents anyway.

I have sorted the discus out now and they seem happy enough but are sulking a bit.

I took the parents out before catching the fry and they seem ok, I'll feed them some worm tomorrow and hopefully they should be ok soon. They don't seem to be blaming one another for the sudden change and are sticking together.

I'll put pics of the fry tank in the photo forum.

Thanks for all your help.

Oh, CFC... The discus are around 2" across, one is a little bigger. The breeder I got them off really seemed to know what he was doing and they are very healthy, if a little stressed.