Differences between Saprolegnia and Columnaris?

[Kyanite14]

I’ve been doing research on multiple fish diseases for future reference, but these two are confusing to me. I dealt with a columnaris infection once, but not saprolegnia.

What I know so far:

Columnaris is NOT a fungus but bacteria
Saprolegnia is a fungus?
Both are cotton like, but columnaris tends to show up on the mouth or as a discolored patch while saprolegnia is like water mold, super fluffy on the body.
Best treatment for columnaris seemed to be nitrofuranzone and kanamycin
What’s the best treatment for saprolegnia?
What are any other major differences or facts I should know?

 

[TwoTankAmin]

I use Fritz Maracyn Oxy for fungus. https://fritzaquatics.com/products/mardel-maracyn-oxy

In the old days this was called simply Maroxy- then Fritz bought Mardel.

 

[Colin_T]

Saprolegnia is a type of fungus that affects things in the aquarium. It looks like white hairs sticking out of a wound but also grows on uneaten fish food, fish eggs and dead fish or shrimp that have been left in the tank too long after they died. The filaments are about 3-5mm long and resemble white hair sticking up.

Treatment for Saprolegnia fungus is salt (1 heaped tablespoon per 20 litres), or Methylene Blue. Other medications will also treat it but most aren't as safe as salt or Methylene Blue.

Saprolegnia fungus only grows in open wounds or damaged tissue, or on dead things. It's in virtually all aquariums but if the fish are healthy and their tank and filter is cleaned regularly, they won't ever get it.

-------------

Columnaris is a flesh eating bacteria. It normally starts on the mouth and spreads up and over the face and head within 24-48 hours. If left untreated it kills the fish within that time frame.

Columnaris looks like a creamy white film over the mouth and as it spreads over the face, the head and face become covered in the creamy white film. It doesn't stick up at all and is just a layer over the infected area, whereas Saprolegnia sticks up from the body.

Columnaris can also affect the body and is sometimes seen on guppies and neon tetras. The fish develop a creamy white patch normally on the rear half of the body between the dorsal fin and tail. With neon tetras it causes the red and blue lines to fade. The fish die within 24-48 hours of showing this creamy white patch on the body.

Medication needs to be started immediately and you need to use antibiotics. If you can't get antibiotics, separate any infected fish and add salt and a broad spectrum liquid medication to the tank they were in, and the tank they have been moved too. Use 2 heaped tablespoons of salt per 20 litres of water for soft water fishes, and 4 heaped tablespoons of salt per 20 litres of water for common livebearers like guppies. Keep the salt and broad spectrum medication in the tank for at least 2 weeks.

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Fish can also get a fat lip (bruising) that looks like the start of Columnaris. One or both lips will look a little puffy and turn cream/ white. If it doesn't spread over a few days, it is just a fat lip and will clear up on its own over the next few weeks. If it spreads rapidly over the face and head, then it's Columnaris.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

If you want to have tour tank stained blue, use the M. B. If you want to use M. B. for hatching tanks, ay least for corys you need to remove the blue when you see wigglers. A longtime breeder of corys taught me that the M. B. could damage their gills as they are forming.

One thing M. B. can do is to help remove nitrite from fish and help them get the oxygen they need. But M. B. was initially used to stain things on slides.

Methylene blue injection is used to treat a condition called methemoglobinemia. This condition occurs when the blood cannot deliver oxygen where it is needed in the body. This medicine is to be given only by or under the supervision of a doctor.

It works in fish too.

Here is what Fritz (who now makes Maracyn Oxy) says about it;s uses n aquariums:

Methylene Blue effectively prevents and protects against superficial fungal infections of fishes, and also protects newly laid fish eggs from fungal or bacterial infections. As a secondary use, it is also effective against some external protozoans, including Ichthyophthirius (Ich).

I have a small bottle of M.B. I don't often use and a big bottle of Maracyn Oxy which I do use more often.

Finally, because M. B. stains the water, it makes it difficult or impossible to use most of our test kits beause they mostly rely on the color of the tested sample to reveal the results.

Here is a paragraph from a study of columnaris in rainbow trout. I know this is a colder water fish not usually kept in tanks, but the disease affects all kinds of fish from those in arctic waters to those in warm tropical waters.
(bold below added by me)

In order to control and treat columnaris disease, bathing fish with bactericidal compounds have been somewhat effective [3], [22], [23], [24] but these treatments are harmful both to fish and the user, and to the environment. Although F. columnare is sensitive to acidity and increased ion strength of water [17], bathing with low pH or increased salt concentration fails to protect fish from columnaris disease because of the high buffering capacity of fish skin [25]. Despite of negative environmental attributes and the increase in risk of resistant bacteria, antibiotics are used for columnaris disease but the medicine has to be administered several times during the rearing season to control the mortality. Immunization experiments have indicated that fish are able to mount an antibody response to F. columnare bacterium [6], [26], [27]. Recently, a modified live vaccine has been developed against columnaris disease in channel catfish [28], but the vaccine has not been licensed for use in salmonids, and its effectiveness in these species is not known.

from:
Heidi M.T. Kunttu, E.Tellervo Valtonen, Lotta-Riina Suomalainen, Jouni Vielma, Ilmari E. Jokinen,
The efficacy of two immunostimulants against Flavobacterium columnare infection in juvenile rainbow trout (Oncorhynchus mykiss),
Fish & Shellfish Immunology,
Volume 26, Issue 6, 2009, Pages 850-857,
ISSN 1050-4648,

https://doi.org/10.1016/j.fsi.2009.03.013.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1050464809000977

or

Mainous, M.E., Kuhn, D.D. and Smith, S.A., 2012. Efficacy of common aquaculture compounds for disinfection of Flavobacterium columnare and F. psychrophilum. Journal of Applied Aquaculture, 24(3), pp.262-270.

Abstract
Flavobacterium columnare and F. psychrophilum are important pathogens of the aquaculture industry, and thus disinfection of aquaculture systems and equipment is essential for disease control. This study examined commercially available compounds in vitro for their ability to eliminate these two species of Flavobacterium from the water. The compounds evaluated included Clorox, ethanol, Roccal, Lysol, iodine, formalin, Chloramine-T, glutaraldehyde, potassium permanganate, sodium chloride, and Virkon Aquatic. In this study, 70% ethanol, 50% ethanol, Clorox, Roccal, Lysol, iodine, glutaraldehyde, Chloramine-T, and Virkon Aquatic reduced the number of bacteria of both species to zero within one minute of contact time. Formalin and 30% ethanol also killed both species of bacteria, but required a longer contact time. Potassium permanganate killed F. columnare within one minute, but did not reduce the numbers of F. psychrophilum even after one hour of contact time. Sodium chloride was not effective.
(Bold added by me) from https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/10454438.2012.708291

Columnaris ranks very high in the list of diseases found in farmed food or ornamental fish as well as fish kept in home Aquariums. As a result, there is a fair amount of research into this disease and a lot more is known today than even 10 years ago. When I do a Google Scholar search for Flavobacterium Columnare I get back "About 8,840 results (0.10 sec)" if I modify that by adding the word symptoms, treatments, virulence etc. I get even more.

The most common use of aquaculture is food fish for human consumption. This indutry is highly regulated as tio the permittable drugs that can be used. We do not have such limitations in our tanks. So we have an advantage, especially here in the states. We can buy and use a very broad choice of medications which are not available to the food fish farmers.

Columnaris is also the disease/infection I have most had to deal with over the years. I have always treated it with antibiotics and I have a decent cure rate but not a perfect one. I also remember a bunch of years back reading about using Chloramine T. I found this:

Ilhan Altinok,
Toxicity and therapeutic effects of chloramine-T for treating Flavobacterium columnare infection of goldfish,
Aquaculture,
Volume 239, Issues 1–4,
2004,
Pages 47-56,
ISSN 0044-8486,

https://doi.org/10.1016/j.aquaculture.2004.05.035.

(https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0044848604002984)

This was published in 2004 and boy was i surprised to learn a thing most of us work to keep out of tanks was a potential cure for columnaris, or at least a way to kill the "bug."

 

[Kyanite14]

If you want to have tour tank stained blue, use the M. B. If you want to use M. B. for hatching tanks, ay least for corys you need to remove the blue when you see wigglers. A longtime breeder of corys taught me that the M. B. could damage their gills as they are forming.

One thing M. B. can do is to help remove nitrite from fish and help them get the oxygen they need. But M. B. was initially used to stain things on slides.

It works in fish too.

Here is what Fritz (who now makes Maracyn Oxy) says about it;s uses n aquariums:



I have a small bottle of M.B. I don't often use and a big bottle of Maracyn Oxy which I do use more often.

Finally, because M. B. stains the water, it makes it difficult or impossible to use most of our test kits beause they mostly rely on the color of the tested sample to reveal the results.

Here is a paragraph from a study of columnaris in rainbow trout. I know this is a colder water fish not usually kept in tanks, but the disease affects all kinds of fish from those in arctic waters to those in warm tropical waters.
(bold below added by me)

from:
Heidi M.T. Kunttu, E.Tellervo Valtonen, Lotta-Riina Suomalainen, Jouni Vielma, Ilmari E. Jokinen,
The efficacy of two immunostimulants against Flavobacterium columnare infection in juvenile rainbow trout (Oncorhynchus mykiss),
Fish & Shellfish Immunology,
Volume 26, Issue 6, 2009, Pages 850-857,
ISSN 1050-4648,

https://doi.org/10.1016/j.fsi.2009.03.013.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1050464809000977

or

Mainous, M.E., Kuhn, D.D. and Smith, S.A., 2012. Efficacy of common aquaculture compounds for disinfection of Flavobacterium columnare and F. psychrophilum. Journal of Applied Aquaculture, 24(3), pp.262-270.

Abstract
Flavobacterium columnare and F. psychrophilum are important pathogens of the aquaculture industry, and thus disinfection of aquaculture systems and equipment is essential for disease control. This study examined commercially available compounds in vitro for their ability to eliminate these two species of Flavobacterium from the water. The compounds evaluated included Clorox, ethanol, Roccal, Lysol, iodine, formalin, Chloramine-T, glutaraldehyde, potassium permanganate, sodium chloride, and Virkon Aquatic. In this study, 70% ethanol, 50% ethanol, Clorox, Roccal, Lysol, iodine, glutaraldehyde, Chloramine-T, and Virkon Aquatic reduced the number of bacteria of both species to zero within one minute of contact time. Formalin and 30% ethanol also killed both species of bacteria, but required a longer contact time. Potassium permanganate killed F. columnare within one minute, but did not reduce the numbers of F. psychrophilum even after one hour of contact time. Sodium chloride was not effective.
(Bold added by me) from https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/10454438.2012.708291

Columnaris ranks very high in the list of diseases found in farmed food or ornamental fish as well as fish kept in home Aquariums. As a result, there is a fair amount of research into this disease and a lot more is known today than even 10 years ago. When I do a Google Scholar search for Flavobacterium Columnare I get back "About 8,840 results (0.10 sec)" if I modify that by adding the word symptoms, treatments, virulence etc. I get even more.

The most common use of aquaculture is food fish for human consumption. This indutry is highly regulated as tio the permittable drugs that can be used. We do not have such limitations in our tanks. So we have an advantage, especially here in the states. We can buy and use a very broad choice of medications which are not available to the food fish farmers.

Columnaris is also the disease/infection I have most had to deal with over the years. I have always treated it with antibiotics and I have a decent cure rate but not a perfect one. I also remember a bunch of years back reading about using Chloramine T. I found this:

Ilhan Altinok,
Toxicity and therapeutic effects of chloramine-T for treating Flavobacterium columnare infection of goldfish,
Aquaculture,
Volume 239, Issues 1–4,
2004,
Pages 47-56,
ISSN 0044-8486,

https://doi.org/10.1016/j.aquaculture.2004.05.035.

(https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0044848604002984)

This was published in 2004 and boy was i surprised to learn a thing most of us work to keep out of tanks was a potential cure for columnaris, or at least a way to kill the "bug."

Yeah, when my gourami had columnaris I first tried Kanaplex to no avail. I also added salt and lowered the temps, which slowed but didn’t reverse it. It finally went away after I added Jungle fungus cure, which I had to order online because the FDA restricted it for carcinogenic ingredients. Very risky but at least it did its job. I just wished it gave my gourami more than 2 months longer, as he actually died a few days ago from dropsy.

 

[GaryE]

If you see a fungus like Saprolegnia, and it isn't on a newly arrived fish, you are not maintaining your tanks properly. It's a problem best treated through prevention.
For myself as an older aquarist who was around when water changes weren't advised, I had fungus fighting skills. Meds were readily available and effective, just off the shelf remedies. Since I jumped on the water change bandwagon 30 years ago, I have never had to treat fungus, not even once.
The bacteria we call Columnaris? Hopefully, you quarantine and catch them before they spread. I am in a no over the counter antibiotic zone, and frankly, I view Flavibacter as fatal. Fish that arrive infected tend to have flare ups, even if you bring them back to seeming perfect health for a few weeks or months. They can look and act fine, but that white patch is always lurking, waiting to reappear.

You're going about this the right way, @Kyanite14 . Learning to identify diseases and parasites when you go to the store is a lost skill for many aquarists. I used go to a local store in my teens and when the owner received sick fish (which he never sold), he would quiz his younger customers on what was wrong with them. We were very proud of ourselves if we passed the test, and it taught us to examine pet shop fish very carefully before we bought. With online sales, we're at the mercy of some very unprincipled sellers in many cases, and we really have to quarantine and expect to lose fish and money.

Btw, I have often used methelyne blue, and have had no tank staining issues. I don't even see blue on the silicone. But it won't do anything for columnaris. Fungus meds used to be based on acriflavene, a green yellow dye tagged as mildly carcinogenic with prolonged use. Clean water and prevention are better.

 

[Kyanite14]

If you see a fungus like Saprolegnia, and it isn't on a newly arrived fish, you are not maintaining your tanks properly. It's a problem best treated through prevention.
For myself as an older aquarist who was around when water changes weren't advised, I had fungus fighting skills. Meds were readily available and effective, just off the shelf remedies. Since I jumped on the water change bandwagon 30 years ago, I have never had to treat fungus, not even once.
The bacteria we call Columnaris? Hopefully, you quarantine and catch them before they spread. I am in a no over the counter antibiotic zone, and frankly, I view Flavibacter as fatal. Fish that arrive infected tend to have flare ups, even if you bring them back to seeming perfect health for a few weeks or months. They can look and act fine, but that white patch is always lurking, waiting to reappear.

You're going about this the right way, @Kyanite14 . Learning to identify diseases and parasites when you go to the store is a lost skill for many aquarists. I used go to a local store in my teens and when the owner received sick fish (which he never sold), he would quiz his younger customers on what was wrong with them. We were very proud of ourselves if we passed the test, and it taught us to examine pet shop fish very carefully before we bought. With online sales, we're at the mercy of some very unprincipled sellers in many cases, and we really have to quarantine and expect to lose fish and money.

Btw, I have often used methelyne blue, and have had no tank staining issues. I don't even see blue on the silicone. But it won't do anything for columnaris. Fungus meds used to be based on acriflavene, a green yellow dye tagged as mildly carcinogenic with prolonged use. Clean water and prevention are better.

I actually made a post about the gourami in question, he developed it the day after I brought him home. After he died a few days ago from dropsy I decided to start doing more research for diseases, as I actually did notice some off behavior in the days before his death, but didn’t know what to make of it. He definitely was not a healthy fish, and I should’ve suspected that when his tank mates at the store had fin rot, I don’t want to make the same mistake again.