Cycling tank (possibly without tests)

[kiko]

I feel like this advice is kinda cruel, just pick up a fish, chuck it in and see if it lives or dies... maybe I'm reading it wrong...

The likelihood of the fish living is quite high.
Specially because he has the old tank and sponge filters etc from the old tank.
While doing this I'm pretty sure you're not going to use expensive fish.
A neon tetra would for sure sure die doing this.
Rasboras are actually pretty hardy fish.
Also the 3 week waiting period increases the chances of cycling by using the old stuff and water which is the gold key here Because it'll just keep things going instead of killing good bacteria with tap and delaying the colonization.
Not everyone has the means or access to kits etc
I sure as a kid didn't but I still kept fish.
For this I suggested rasboras because they will change colour and tell you themselves somethings wrong.
And he's also not stocking the tank just adding 1 to see what the fish tells him.
It's a beautiful thing when the animal can pass his feelings to you in his own ways.
And you act according to what you see.
This is the fish hobby.

 

[Beling]

Before internet, and a magazine, I didn't know about cycling at all. I just had a lot of water for not too many fish, and lots of live plants. Everything was supposed to balance. Our water here (Maui) wasn't chlorinated at the time, and probably not too hygienic, so maybe that was part of the equation, but never had any problem with new fish getting ill.

 

[rebe]

I feel for you, the aquarium hobby can be slow and tricky when working with a small budget. In my opinion, a good test kit like the liquid API is one of the most important pieces of kit to have. In my experience, the test strips are not as reliable or as easy to read. If you can, I really would wait and save up for the liquid API test kit. There's a saying (don't know where it came from originally) that we keep the water, and the water keeps the fish. Being able to know what is going on with the water (like levels of ammonia, nitrite and nitrate) can actually be the difference between a healthy tank and a dead one.
If the master test kit by API is just too expensive, then I would at least get the Ammonia, Nitrite and Nitrate ones.

For PH, GH and KH you could get a water sample tested at a fish shop, there are even places online that you can send water samples to. But when you are cycling a tank or have live fish, being able to quickly test for Ammonia, Nitrite and Nitrates is important, especially since those numbers can change.

If you want to try fishless cycling without plants, then you can make your own Dr.Tims ammonia solution for cheaper than buying it. In Ireland you can't buy that or pure liquid ammonia products anywhere, so I made my own. You might be able to buy pure ammonia intended for household cleaning and such (make sure there are no additives like scents), but if not here is how I made my own ammonia solution.

Pure ammonium bicarbonate (a cooking/ baking product) dissolved and brought to a boil will convert to ammonia, water vapour and small amounts of carbon dioxide. I used 16 grams in 50 mls water. One drop of this solution per two gallons should be roughly 1ppm ammonia. I would add slightly less and then test to make sure you aren't adding too much.

I know you want to keep spending at a minimum, but the expensive master liquid API test kit will last you a very long time and I promise you that it will be worth the spend. Sometimes online pet/aquarium shops can have cheaper prices than amazon. You could also look online for a second hand test kit, someone could be selling theirs. Unfortunately for all of our bank accounts the aquarium hobby is not a cheap one, especially at the start or with new equipment.

I'm sorry to hear that you old tank cracked, and I hope you are able to find the solution you need for an affordable price

 

[PygmyPepperJulli]

Hi everyone, (sorry I was away for a few days),


First…

The substrate and rocks from old tank instantly went in buckets for a few days when the tank recracked to when the new tank arrived. I am not sure if they lost their bb in the time in those buckets (they were relatively wet). The filter was also in a bucket. Both buckets contained some of the tank water. So there is likely some bb in the tank already.

There were lots of different methods proposed in this thread.

I am going to request a API master test kit, or just the ones proposed by 2 tank Amin, for Christmas.

Here is my plan thus far. I believe it will work as a compromise between fish safety and budget, but feel free to argue.

I will in some way add a source of ammonia. At this point O am thinking fish food rather than bottled ammonia. I will also add some Mulm from the pond as suggested by GaryE.
I will wait for probably two weeks, and feed the ‘fish‘ every day. This will give time for the already present bb to further establish from the Mulm and substrate/filter. Water will be changed every week.
Then, I will add a substantial amount of frogbit to absorb some excessive nitrate, do a 75% water change, and add a small number of fish, possibly my neon tetras, which will according to aqadvisor bring me to 25% stocking of my tank (I am unsure around this step). I will closely monitor the fish and do a 50% water change every two days. After around a week after this, I will add my corydoras. Wait a week. After this, I will drop back to 50% every week. I believe by this stage the tank will definitely be cycled and I can add more fish (obviously not all at once).


EDIT- I will only add 6 of my neon tetras (the reason I wanted to add all of them is I know they need to have a school) at first, followed by the other 4. If this is not right, tell me.

 

[kiko]

I don't own a master kit...have a bunch of bottles for this and that given to me by friends that left the hobby which I never even used.
Best purchases you can make in this hobby if you are to spend money on things

#1 - ph/tds controller...by far the best purchase I ever made for this hobby
can be controlled by co2, using lights/air pump for oxygenation...whatever method you want to use to achieve results....

#2 - tools/stuff
- silicone...anything saying poisonous or a deadly skull is great stuff. Aquarium safe silicone? lol? it's silicone!...
- lightweight silicone gun...these things get heavy and hurt your fingers when you're trying to push silicone while angling stuff
- silicone smoother/finishing and nozzle extenders. Finger works but it will never look as good.
- hand scrapper/blade. Glass is expensive and it's lots cheaper to get it for free or very low priced from someone throwing it out and that's how you'll clean the stuff on them.
- Glass cutter anything cheap works (don't buy the solid steel fletcher/richard ones) although they're known for many years...they tend to run
anything with a square angled block and with a tube to put cooking/olive oil to aid in the cut works better.
- Thick ruler...min 1/8 thickness. I have yet to find a non-slippery ruler! I just made my own...rubber/cork doesn't work.
dual-sided adhesive from the dollar store on the bottom on both edges...clean some of the glue with a wet-sponge...it will ALWAYS stick xD
- rotary tool...had a few...never had to change from "dremel" so yeah dremel is expensive but doesn't break the tip or locking mechanism or spin weird.
nothing like finishing or smoothing glass with one...a regular drill won't even compare

#3 - prime...gets the job done.

#4 - usb air-pump / phone charger / dual-sponge pump...great backup for a just in case....you just never know and you get to charge the phone/usb stuff while away xD

#5 - root tabs...work great for plants and no unnecessary ferts being added all the time

#6 - lots and lots of filter floss...best thing for filtration... colour changes to dark brown = change it. Simple and easy

#7 - Nothing beats a sump...no humming from pumps...no dripping..0 noise...if you have a sump and it makes noise you didn't make it right
and if someone says they like the sound of the water gushing and dripping while trying to sleep... give them 20 years, they'll change their mind

#8 - strips...you won't need them but it's nice to have just like the air-pump...a "just in case" type of thing

and the advice I give to people in this hobby is simple...
1. never trust someone that has something to gain from you (shops)
2. do your research, on the internet everyone's a scientist. Read, read and read some more..when the specific subject you're researching has been confirmed by multiple sources.
Now look at pro's and cons of it compared to Way A, way B or way C and make an informed decision of what's best for you and your methods/choices/means.

 

[Lcc86]

Hi everyone, (sorry I was away for a few days),


First…

The substrate and rocks from old tank instantly went in buckets for a few days when the tank recracked to when the new tank arrived. I am not sure if they lost their bb in the time in those buckets (they were relatively wet). The filter was also in a bucket. Both buckets contained some of the tank water. So there is likely some bb in the tank already.

There were lots of different methods proposed in this thread.

I am going to request a API master test kit, or just the ones proposed by 2 tank Amin, for Christmas.

Here is my plan thus far. I believe it will work as a compromise between fish safety and budget, but feel free to argue.

I will in some way add a source of ammonia. At this point O am thinking fish food rather than bottled ammonia. I will also add some Mulm from the pond as suggested by GaryE.
I will wait for probably two weeks, and feed the ‘fish‘ every day. This will give time for the already present bb to further establish from the Mulm and substrate/filter. Water will be changed every week.
Then, I will add a substantial amount of frogbit to absorb some excessive nitrate, do a 75% water change, and add a small number of fish, possibly my neon tetras, which will according to aqadvisor bring me to 25% stocking of my tank (I am unsure around this step). I will closely monitor the fish and do a 50% water change every two days. After around a week after this, I will add my corydoras. Wait a week. After this, I will drop back to 50% every week. I believe by this stage the tank will definitely be cycled and I can add more fish (obviously not all at once).


EDIT- I will only add 6 of my neon tetras (the reason I wanted to add all of them is I know they need to have a school) at first, followed by the other 4. If this is not right, tell me.

@PygmyPepperJulli I'm just going to link my recent thread here as I added fish food to start a cycle and have inadvertently made life harder for myself! https://www.fishforums.net/threads/is-this-normal-when-cycling.490992/page-2#post-4301240

It's not the end of the world but just thought I'd let you know it's a possible outcome. I had to take all my plants out as they were really struggling. I've decided to buy a small bottle of ammonia now so that I have control over how much I'm adding, but appreciate that may not be an option (although the suggestion above on how to make your own is pretty helpful, I had no idea that could be done).

If you do end up with some form of test kit then you should be able to measure exactly when it's safe to start putting fish in.

 

[PygmyPepperJulli]

Just read that thread… helpful!

So I might try using a chunk of fish (which will be easy, wild-caught fish for eating is plentiful in our house…) or shrimp (you Americans, it’s a PRAWN ) instead of the food as recommended in your article, or the recipe for ammonia above… I’ll have a look. Chemistry is definitely not turning out to be my strong suite…

EDIT- is ammonium bicarbonate the same as bicarb Soda?

 

[Lcc86]

Just read that thread… helpful!

So I might try using a chunk of fish (which will be easy, wild-caught fish for eating is plentiful in our house…) or shrimp (you Americans, it’s a PRAWN ) instead of the food as recommended in your article, or the recipe for ammonia above… I’ll have a look. Chemistry is definitely not turning out to be my strong suite…

EDIT- is ammonium bicarbonate the same as bicarb Soda?

I failed chemistry 20 odd years ago and it's now becoming painfully obvious why

I did a quick Google and I don't think ammonium bicarbonate is the same as bicarbonate of soda BUT don't quote me, I got that info from a baking website lol. I'm sure someone here will know.

 

[rebe]

EDIT- is ammonium bicarbonate the same as bicarb Soda?

If you use sodium bicarbonate (is that baking soda?) it will probably raise the pH of your aquarium. When ammonium bicarbonate breaks down with the heat, you are left with a solution of ammonia, water and carbon dioxide. As far as I am aware, the same process will happen with sodium bicarbonate with the addition of a sodium carbonate residue.

Sodium Carbonate (Soda Ash) is used to maintain and raise PH in an aquarium setting

What ingredient is in the bicarbonate you have at home?

 

[Essjay]

EDIT- is ammonium bicarbonate the same as bicarb Soda?

Ammonium bicarbonate is not the same as bicarb soda - that's sodium bicarbonate and doesn't contain any ammonia. The soda part of the name means sodium.