Confused On This Hybrid Info

Tropical Tetra

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I have read some posts on this forum about hybrids and i am still alittle bit confused, first off why wouldn't a guppy and swordtail be able to breed together? i have seen picks of a guppyswordtail and thats proof enough for me but yet i see people arguing saying they can't ? cause they are from two different species or somthing i am confused..i am a little bit slow on picking up info some times i may have to read stuff over and over to understand something i may have missed, but could someone clarify this for me and also just curious i don't want to start any fights or anything but how would somone just interbreeding fish in their own tanks how would that weaken a species of fish? sorry there are some things i don't understand and i am alittle slow on picking up things at times and this would be one of them.
 
It's all to do with genetics.If the genes/chromozones don't fit it won't work...I think thats the just of it :good:
 
Fish, among other animals, have to be in the same Genus to be able to interbreed. For example, the scientific name for the guppy is Poecilia reticulata and the scientific name for the swordtail is Xiphophorus hellerii, making the two too different to interbreed. However, a guppy, Poecilia reticulata , can mate with a molly Poecilia sphenops, because of their similarities. That's the easiest way to figure out what can mate with what, but the underlying fact is that the chemical makeup is what makes everything happen... and I can't explain that. :p
 
It would seem that if cichlids that are not closely related can cross then why not guppies and mollies that are not that distantly related? But the short answer is they just cant.If they could then it would be happening all the time as people frequently keep the 2 species together.The pics you have seen are not of guppy/sword crosses but guppies that have been line bred to have lyre tails, they are still guppies though.
 
Fish, among other animals, have to be in the same Genus to be able to interbreed. For example, the scientific name for the guppy is Poecilia reticulata and the scientific name for the swordtail is Xiphophorus hellerii, making the two too different to interbreed. However, a guppy, Poecilia reticulata , can mate with a molly Poecilia sphenops, because of their similarities. That's the easiest way to figure out what can mate with what, but the underlying fact is that the chemical makeup is what makes everything happen... and I can't explain that. :p

sorta but not quite :p all these labels that we put on species are really just labels--meaning that they don't always describe what we think they do. but the method you just described is a good quick method for predicting the potential of a succesful cross. :good:

As for the genetics issue... Here's an analogy that might (or might not) help make things clearer. :lol: Think about button-front shirts. They don't all have the same number of buttons, right? Now imagine taking all the button fronts out of your closet and trying to button two random shirts together. Some of your shirts would fit together perfectly because they have the same number and spacing of buttons. Some pairs would have extra buttons or holes left empty. And the connection between other shirt pairs would be badly wrinkled because the shirts had different button spacing.

Sexual reproduction kind of works just like the shirt experiment. An egg and a sperm each contribute half of a set of chromosomes from the parent.

* If the egg and the sperm have the same number of chromosomes and the right chemical receptors, then the reproduction is probably going to be sucessful. Two parent organisms that can mate sucessfully and produce a fertile child organism are considered to all be of the same species group. They are considered to be the same species if the parents would not have been physically isolated, geographically or otherwise, from each other. This is why Guppies and Endlers are different species: Endlers are geographically isolated in the wild to a single river. There are also various cichlids that produce successful crosses in a test tube but are almost impossible to hybridize in the aqaurium because they can't agree on a courtship routine or spawning site. Thus, they are considered to be independent species.

(The precise definition of species as it pertains to fish is complicated and depends on who you ask, so for the lay person, its best just to accept the label affixed to each type of fish. There are whole groups of scientists who spend their lives defining and defending the various species; I personally just trust that they know more about it than I do. :p)

* If the egg and the sperms have the same number of chromosomes but don't have the right chemical receptors, then the reproduction is unlikely to succeed. This would be an example of two species that just won't hybridize, not even in a petri dish.

* If they have different numbers of chromosomes but the right chemical receptors, then the reproduction may or may not be sucessful. This would be an example of the potential for hybridization. Whenever an organism has mismatched chromosomes, there are physical repercussions. Sometimes it results in a child that grows stronger and larger than either parent; this is known as "hybrid vigor" and is seen in lion/tiger crosses. Other times this produces a sickly or deformed child organism. It almost always results in sterility.

Because the issues that result from chromosome mismatch are present from the moment the egg is fertilized, there are some cases in which the child organism is just never sucessfully brought to term. This is regularly seen in hybridization of fish where obviously fertilized eggs never hatch or are pruned away by one of the parent fish. This result is considered to be a failed hybridization.

I hope this helps a little with understanding why certain crosses just won't work.
 
sorta but not quite :p all these labels that we put on species are really just labels--meaning that they don't always describe what we think they do. but the method you just described is a good quick method for predicting the potential of a succesful cross. :good:
That's just my method and like you said, it is a quick and easy way, but not always correct! :)
 
Swordtail guppies are just guppies, but it's a nateral tail type thats been deloped, you can get top, bottom and doubble swords in the guppy but these was devloped by breeders selecting fish which show these tail types, how ever their are yeat another 10 types if guppies which have been devloped but it's only the delta and lyretail's that you see in the shops.

Hope we have helped you though.
 
Swordtails and guppies cannot hybridize because of genetic barriers. For example, Humans and Chimpanzees share 98% of their DNA. however, if a sick person went and mated with a chimpanzee, it would not produce offspring at all (humans have 46 chromosones, chimpanzees have 48)
 
Swordtails and guppies cannot hybridize because of genetic barriers. For example, Humans and Chimpanzees share 98% of their DNA. however, if a sick person went and mated with a chimpanzee, it would not produce offspring at all (humans have 46 chromosones, chimpanzees have 48)
Hi. In Fact being a RN of 20 yrs... I do know for a fact that test were done and yes there can be a child/ape hybrid produced...The Gov. scraped the program... This is like the zebra X Horse...But our human morrales want let further test be done...The project went to south AM, back in the late 90's..Now thats scarry..... Everyone said my Gambusia affinis X Poecilia ret. would not work...WRONG!..There very healthy and fertile... I would love to send a sample fish to any lab to varify my hybrids...Thanks. Toni-Marie. :*
 
I do know for a fact that test were done and yes there can be a child/ape hybrid produced

firstly
a human/ape cross is a chimera and not a hybrid.

secondly
that is science fiction and I defy you to show us some proof that it happened outside of the BBC/Hollywood
 
I would love to send a sample fish to any lab to varify my hybrids...Thanks. Toni-Marie. :*
I would love for you to as well. Not saying it isn't possible, but what with you believing the junk about human-chimp hybrids, I can't help but be skeptical.

While recent research suggests that there was some hybridization between human and chimp ancestors much later than previously thought, there has never been a confirmed case of a hybrid in modern times, and all genetic research on the subject would indicate that it is an impossibility. A chimera would certainly be possible, considering the human-rabbit chimeric embryos produced in China, but I'd bet my life that a straight-up hybrid would not be, at least not without some significant genetic dabbling.

There was some experimentation done, you are right, and the government did scrap the program... but were hybrids found to be possible? Not even close. Soviet researchers only got to test human sperm with chimp ova before the program was done away with, and no fertile zygotes were produced.

I would love for it to be possible, don't get me wrong. I'd get a good laugh seeing the indignation on the faces of those who think humans are "special" when they found we could interbreed with another species, but it just ain't gonna happen.
 
The only mammal hybrids I know of are Mules. HorsexDonkey. And whatever mammal hybrids there are, I doubt any would produce fertile offspring.
 
Mammal hybrids you say? Here is a huge list of felid hybrids with pics. Ever seen wolfdogs? Zebra x horses? Mammals can hybridize just like everything else :)
In very rare instances a female mule will be fertile. The same is true for ligers, though it's less rare in them than mules. I think all wolfdogs are fertile, but I may be wrong on that one.
 
Swordtailed guppys are not a hybrid, i have a full tank of them, they are 100% guppy; just another morph. If you were to see actual wild guppys, you would probably not be able to ID them as so because they only vaugly resemble their domesticated kin.

Without being a jerk, id like to ask what is so hard to understand? In almost all cases one can look up the scientific name and tell right away weather that pair of fish can produce viable offspring; i think our fish index actually has the scientific names in each profile.

A guppy/swordtail cross would look pretty neat if it were possible, then again, so would a cross between a human being and a leopard (presenting the same challenges as the odd fish mixes.)
 

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