Sammydee....if you need a 'manual' on how to make your own live rock, there is a downloadable manual for a small fee at thelebos.com. SH
Cheap live rock
- Thread starter sammydee
- Start date
Dragonscales
Fishaholic
Thats all fine Ed, although I fail to see anywhere in my post that I said not to use limestone. I was pointing out that limestone isn't the only way to go when it comes to creating artificial liverock, and there are alot better (and cheaper) alternatives out there.
Personally I am thinking of making my own in the near future as I believe it to be the best alternative to ocean rock I have yet seen. You have full control over it's contents, how porous it is as well as being fairly cheap compared to alot of rock. There is also a far less chance of it containing anything that may leach into the tank (as is the case with any rock, limestone included, simply based on how it has been used in the past, where it's been stored, etc, etc), besides the aforementioned ability to shape the rock however you see fit, a win/win alternative in almost every area I tend to think. About the only drawback I can see is in the long curing time and possibly in mistaken additives being used (this, of course, is down to human error and avoidable).
With that in mind, I think my post was as warrented as your own and factual down to the last word. It was meant only to advise the poster in question of a better alternative to limestone and alot of other rocks, and let's face it, the more information and choices one has, the better armed they are in this hobby.
Personally I am thinking of making my own in the near future as I believe it to be the best alternative to ocean rock I have yet seen. You have full control over it's contents, how porous it is as well as being fairly cheap compared to alot of rock. There is also a far less chance of it containing anything that may leach into the tank (as is the case with any rock, limestone included, simply based on how it has been used in the past, where it's been stored, etc, etc), besides the aforementioned ability to shape the rock however you see fit, a win/win alternative in almost every area I tend to think. About the only drawback I can see is in the long curing time and possibly in mistaken additives being used (this, of course, is down to human error and avoidable).
With that in mind, I think my post was as warrented as your own and factual down to the last word. It was meant only to advise the poster in question of a better alternative to limestone and alot of other rocks, and let's face it, the more information and choices one has, the better armed they are in this hobby.
Yes your post was informative, and certainly worthwhile for the person who started the thread- I never said it wasn't! My post clearly said:
Limestone is used in a vast amount of calcium reactors where the dangers of substances being released are far greater (due to the rock being dissolved) but you dont see every tank using one suffering terribly from leached substances.
Do I think that limestone is the absolutly ideal rock for use in a reef tank? No and I never said it was.
Are there alternatives for creating your own 'live rock'? Of course there are.
Is it right that when someone asks :
My post was not aimed primarily at your reply, however I still don't understand the leaching issue compared to artificially created rock. You also need to appriciate not everyone wants to be building their own rock, which is why I felt it nessassary to point out that limestone is a reasonable choice for a base rock.
Sorry I really dont understand this. The rock you are making contains cement doesnt it? This cement is made from (amoungst other things) limestone! Only when the limestone is in the form of cement you haven't got a clue what type of limestone was used, how it has been transported, what has been added etc. etc.
Limestone is used in a vast amount of calcium reactors where the dangers of substances being released are far greater (due to the rock being dissolved) but you dont see every tank using one suffering terribly from leached substances.
Do I think that limestone is the absolutly ideal rock for use in a reef tank? No and I never said it was.
Are there alternatives for creating your own 'live rock'? Of course there are.
Is it right that when someone asks :
they get told "NOOOO"? Not in my opinion
Dragonscales
Fishaholic
I know your post wasn't directly aimed at myself, I merely thought I should reiterate my standing on the issue since my post was one that was quoted.
I will also concede the fact that the contents of cement can sometimes contain impurities as any other rock can. The point I am making though has to do with rock from an average lfs, many of whom deal in second hand rocks, as well as other sources which have been out of the ground for extended periods. These are prone to be more likely sources of contaminants due to various ways the previous owners may have treated it like (harsh chemicals, copper based medications, etc). On the other hand most cement grade limestone and most sands you will find are fresh from the ground as they are mined specifically for that purpose. Both do carry a risk, I will admit, but I would prefer to use cement due to the vast majority of it's limestone being straight out of the ground and the fact that there is alot less of it going into the tank to begin with. I tend to think that with any rock personally, I aren't only biased towards limestone.
I will also concede the fact that the contents of cement can sometimes contain impurities as any other rock can. The point I am making though has to do with rock from an average lfs, many of whom deal in second hand rocks, as well as other sources which have been out of the ground for extended periods. These are prone to be more likely sources of contaminants due to various ways the previous owners may have treated it like (harsh chemicals, copper based medications, etc). On the other hand most cement grade limestone and most sands you will find are fresh from the ground as they are mined specifically for that purpose. Both do carry a risk, I will admit, but I would prefer to use cement due to the vast majority of it's limestone being straight out of the ground and the fact that there is alot less of it going into the tank to begin with. I tend to think that with any rock personally, I aren't only biased towards limestone.
Aquascaper
Fish Aficionado
I have the aforementioned file, it is goodsteelhealr said:
Great Lakes
Always do right, not popular...
Not realy laughing at you Dragon.
Just at the notion that the cement is "fresh".
I live a stones throw from the largest cement factory in the world.
It may not be as fresh as you think.
GL
Dragonscales
Fishaholic
I was speaking metaphorically GL.I know it ain't gunna be as fresh as a midmorning shower, but it is about as "fresh" as rock can be. It certainly isn't going to contain anything a rock could pick up from a person's tank like copper based medications or insecticides due to being used in a garden, etc. That's why I think it is the best alternative (well, one of the reasons) to ocean farmed rock. Now if I could only find a way to make the missus let me whip up a batch and let it cure in the toilet sump then life would be ace
Aquascaper
Fish Aficionado
'Whatever they have marked as "base rock"' may be non-porus and unlikely to seed to any beneficial extent, probably best to ask firstFishy411 said:
Another problem that no-one has mentioned is that quite often rock is stacked on the LFS floor which is washed down with bleach & detergents every now and then
sammydee
Fishaholic
I'll have a bash at making my own out of cement and stuff. Thanks for the help
Similar threads
Most reactions
-
553 -
308 -
270 -
249 -
239 -
188 -
185 -
153 -
152 -
145 -
113 -
109 -
105 -
95 -
86