Biting Bird --help

[Synirr]

Ok, here's the deal... Several months ago I came across a young parrotlet in my LPS and decided to get him. He has been a terror and pain in the butt ever since, and I need some suggestions before he takes my fingers off!

He was hand raised and is tame, but has some serious aggression issues. He doesn't bite out of fear, he will outright charge you! He is EXTREMELY territorial with his cage and starts fluffing up his feathers and verbally fussing at you when you even come near, much less put your hand in... the only way I can add a new toy or something like that is to hold up his squirt bottle, which he knows means he'll get wet if he bites. Only then will he reluctantly leave you alone. The thing is, the second he knows the squirt bottle is out of reach he won't hesitate to bite, and this extends to when he is out of his cage for play time. He normally doesn't bite your neck or face, but he HATES hands. Sometimes he does ok and will step up on your finger alright for a while, but the eventual bite is inevitable. It has gotten to the point that I wear gloves whenever handling him and I just don't trust him at all. Is there anything I can do??

I've been handling him almost every day for months and am trying to be patient, but the improvement he has made has been very minimal. I'd love to be able to scratch his neck like I can do with my other parrotlet, but I can't get a finger near him! Please, does anyone have any suggestions or a link to a bird forum where I can get some help? I was told he came from a breeder, but obviously something in his background has made him a very irritable little guy.

 

[Shelly_Otterkin]

I sent you a link in a PM. But if anyone else wants a great site go here.http/www.lovebirds.co.nz/forum/index.php

 

[black angel]

Dont know if this will help but keep his cage lower than you and move it around the room now and again and cuddle the cage when he is in it.
its supposed to show that you are the dominant one of the group.

For the biting, use a large feather such as a crow or seagull and use that to stroke him with and he will see that he doesnt get a rection when he bites it and then gradually make the feather smaller and smaller until its your hand that is touching him.

Got those from a tv programme i watched so hope some of it was of some use.

 

[Synirr]

Ooo, the feather idea sounds good! He'll probably tear that feather down to size himself though

 

[Pixie25]

mmm its a great idea to go picking up seagull feathers and touching your bird with them when bird flu is only 20 miles away (probably nearer by now).

how often do you change the cage arrangements? try changing it round more frequently. territorial aggression can also be curbed by moving the cage itself to a different location frequently and providing several playstands in different places to avoid the parrot over-bonding with a 'location'.

does he bite out of the cage? i would suggest using a dowel perch (at first, then your finger) to fetch him out of his cage and then work with him away from his cage, and so he cannot see his cage. take him to an unfamiliar (bird safe) room in the house.

the worst thing you could do is wear gloves. this will only increase his fear of hands and make his behaviour worse. also, i wouldnt use a squirt gun either, birds need water to maintain their feather quality, having a bath should be encouraged, not a punishment.

is he clipped? it might be a good idea just to have his wingings trimmed once, so that you can get him used to being on his playstands outside of the cage and work with him intensively during this time. you can do all sorts of things to get a parrot to bond to you. you can get shower perches to take him into the shower with you, a small stand that could sit on the dining table so he can join you and your family for breakfast?

parrotlets are known for being 'bitey', some may never change, but there are things you can do to try and help it.

good luck

 

[pica_nuttalli]

you can buy sterilized large feathers from craft stores.

 

[Synirr]

I'm in the US, bird flu isn't so much of a worry here yet

I have heard the exact opposite as to using gloves. A gloved hand is still a hand, and that way when the bird bites you are better able to show no reaction, which is desired. Petri is not at all frightened of gloves and treats gloved and bare hands the same. How exactly are gloves supposed to be scary, anyway? The plain fact is that as of right now I don't have a choice, because it's either gloves or Petri stays in his cage and is never played with again... I don't like bleeding all over the place too much. I think maybe you have heard of this when gloves are used to grab a reluctant bird to remove it from its cage or hold it while its wings are clipped, but I use a bath rag whenever I have to grab him for whatever reason so that gloves are not the enemy

I am trying to work away from the squirt bottle, but Petri never liked being squirted with it in the first place... he prefers baths in his bath dish, and the squirt bottle treatment hadn't altered this. He likes doing things on his own terms in general, I think.

He has been clipped pretty recently, but at the moment has enough feathers to allow minimal flight. However, he only flies when he has lost his balance and is about to fall or is startled, so he might as well be freshly clipped.

I'm happy to report we are making progress (!!!) with a new method I read about and tried... I've been thinking of it as the "I'm going to drop you" method
Whenever he bites, I jerk my hand down a bit to throw him off balance. He HATES this, and it is very effective in getting him to stop. Today I had him sit on my finger and would move my thumb in front of him, which normally causes a bite. Whenever he bit, I'd jerk my hand down. After about 4 times, he definitely understood what was causing the earthquakes, and instead of biting just stepped up on my thumb (without being given the command) to get it away from him!

He can step up almost every time without a fuss now, but is still suspicious of all other hand movement near him.

 

[Shelly_Otterkin]

I am so glad its all working out for you!

 

[pica_nuttalli]

I'm happy to report we are making progress (!!!) with a new method I read about and tried... I've been thinking of it as the "I'm going to drop you" method
Whenever he bites, I jerk my hand down a bit to throw him off balance. He HATES this, and it is very effective in getting him to stop. Today I had him sit on my finger and would move my thumb in front of him, which normally causes a bite. Whenever he bit, I'd jerk my hand down. After about 4 times, he definitely understood what was causing the earthquakes, and instead of biting just stepped up on my thumb (without being given the command) to get it away from him!

brilliant! i hope this keeps working for you; keep updating us!

 

[Pixie25]

gloves are bad because many birds have early experiences of gloved or clothed hands when they were younger, once they get that fear it is hard for them to forget it. also the bird see a gloved hand differently to a bare hand, by working with gloves on i dont think it works in that any progress you make with the gloves on may not have any affect on his behaviour when you dont have the gloves on. it depends on the bird, some birds have a fear of bare hands from when they were tiny anyway - in which case you would need to address this fear by working without gloves on, otherwise the fear is never going to go away. lol, that all sounded very confusing in my head, i hope you can see what im trying to say!

have you read ' a guide to a well behaved parrot'? its a really good read, might help if your problems continue, its a general guide but applies to most birds, i think.

 

[Synirr]

Pixie25 -- My bird has apparently had bad experiences with hands when he was younger, period. Gloved, clothed or bare, it doesn't matter, he'll bite them all. I know what you mean about some birds seeing gloved and bare hands differently, as Joule is like this and more wary of bare hands (I don't think anyone at the shop she came from would handle them with bare hands, she and her cagemate were nippy,) but Petri isn't phased by the difference at all, I think possibly because he sees me putting on and removing the gloves all the time. I do see what you're trying to say and appreciate the advice, but I also know my bird and my own limits, and I know the gloves aren't affecting him and that I would be literally unable to handle him otherwise at this stage. He has drawn blood on me many a time before and loves biting the sensitive skin between my index finger and thumb, there's no way I could trust him and handle him with the calm assertive aura I need. Even if he did see a difference between my gloved and bare hands, I'd have to use the gloves as a stepping stone to at least get him used to having hands near him.

Anywho, we had a good bonding session today. He only bit twice, which is amazing... I was doing the thumb wiggle thing again, and after the first two 'earthquakes' the serious biting stopped, just a few open-mouthed threats after that. I tricked him into letting me put my finger near his face, too, which is a first!! We played the "kissing game", where I draw out the kissing noise as I get closer ("MMMmmmmm...") and then either kiss his beak or touch my nose to him ("...mmmWAH!"). He loves this, and after a few times he let me do it with my fingertip!! I thought it might be a good way to associate my hands with me, you know? He still won't let me get close enough to scratch his head, but we're getting there I think. I was even brave enough to let him sit on my ungloved hand for a while and step up on ungloved fingers a few times, but I was terribly nervous. Glad to report that there were no bites to exposed flesh though, whew!

His cage aggression is getting better too, I think because hands don't pose such a threat anymore. He sat quietly on his perch while I changed his water and put some sunflower seeds (his fave) in his treat cup today
I'm honestly amazed how fast he's progressing with this method, especially considering I've had him since August of last year with almost no progress whatsoever!! If only I had figured this out sooner!!!

 

[Pixie25]

have you tried changing things around at all, that was the main point i was making - not about the gloves. it sounds like an over-bonding issue with his cage or the location of his cage. does he bite outside of the cage at all? if it is his cage he would need to be removed from it to make any real progress.

glad to hear your getting there though! keep it up

 

[RandomWiktor]

One thing that has worked for me for cage agression, in addition to Ken Globus's methods to simply stop biting and agression in general, was turning feeding and cleaning time into a positive and rewarding experience instead of a battle. I did this by training my birds to stand on a particular perch in the cage while I work inside the cage. They get praise and a food reward, or something to hold and play with, when they stay on the perch and behave in a mannerly fashion. Considering both used to violently attack anyone coming into the cage to such an extent that my mom had to wear gloves 24/7 and chase them back with a towel, it has worked amazingly well. Birds LOVE getting rewards and praise; they'd prefer not to put up a fight every day (no matter how much it seems like it ) as they are peaceful social animals when not removed from thier natural habitat. Remember, most birds and basically all parrots are not domesticated; they are tame or semi-tame wild animals, so everything we do to them is unnatural.

Sounds like you are making very good progress. Keep up the good work, and do keep us updated!

 

[Synirr]

That's a great idea, RandomWiktor! I'll have to try it, though I'm not sure how easy it will be since Petri is constantly fussing at me when I'm in his cage and there's basically no way to make him stop that... he might think I'm rewarding him for being grumpy

Pixie25 -- Yes, I rearranged his cage entirely today, infact. He does bite outside the cage, and I take him into a different room whenever I handle him, so the cage isn't the sole problem, it's just one of the main issues. He let me work in the cage today after an initial fuss, but every time I touched one of his toys he'd complain (think ruffled feathers and a shrill "Eeeeee....EEEEEE ") I think he may have developed an attachment to one toy in particular, as every time I handled it and he saw he actually flew out of the cage to try and retrieve it! He didn't want me to touch that one AT ALL. I think I may try removing it as soon as I get him a replacement toy tomorrow and see if it helps. I notice he sort of cuddles with that one and rubs his head on it a lot. Once all his toys were removed and it was just the perches and food bowls he wasn't aggressive with me at all, so I think it's all his toys he's protecting in there

 

[Pixie25]

ahhh that may well be a big factor. i would definitely remove it, and perhaps try to change all of the toys in the cage every week, just rotate them, see if that helps.

let us know how you get on.