Beginner Anemone Suggestions?

[sothoth]

I'd like to set up a 50gal salt tank with an anemone and two clowns (hoping to breed them) and one snowflake eel.

First, can anyone recommend a good anemone for a person who has never kept one (hardy, not as toxic, etc) and comment on campatibility of the eel with the clowns?

I haven't decided on the clowns but I'm thinking of an ORA-bred percula.

Thanks!

 

[SkiFletch]

Start by reading the anemone guide atop this forum

 

[enjoiskater158]

tank bred clowns don't host anemone's as much as clowns from the ocean, i tryed it with mine and no luck but if u get tank breed there is alot better chance of them spawning. if you want to get one anyway which you probley will, the percula clowns will have the best chance of hosting in a carpet or ritteri anemone which are some of the harder types of anemones to take care of they also will host bubble tipped anemones but there is a less chance than with the carpet or ritteri although the bubble tipped is the easiest anemone to keep. you do not need an anemone for clowns to breed though they will do fine without one. percula clowns are one of the easiest fish to breed so good luck

 

[sothoth]

Thanks for the suggestions.

I should be more specific I think, so I looked into the suggestions and narrowed it down a bit.

I was looking at bubble anemones: E. Quaricolor

I think, after reading the anemone primer that was suggested, I'd go with either a clarkii, frenatus, or melanopus.

If I set this up in a 50gal, I'd add live sand and a moderate amount of live rock. If I add that anemone and a pair of clowns, would I be OK with just a skimmer or would you recommend a wet/dry system as well?

Any incompatibility with the eel (snowflake) and clowns? I would have minimal corals in this tank, if any.

Thanks!

 

[enjoiskater158]

all those clownfish will host the BTA's, I personally like the melanopus they have some beautiful ones at my LFS.
if you have 50 lbs of live rock you'd be fine with just a skimmer. you'd probley do well even without a skimmer if you only have the pair of clowns. If you are trying to breed clowns IMO you shouldn't add the eel. but if you want to make sure that when you buy ur clowns they almost or fully grown.

 

[Lynden]

The Snowflake Moray would be fine with the Clownfish, so long as he is kept from starvation. A well-fed, flat-toothed Moray poses no risk to fish, and even less of a risk to eggs and fry.

However, there is an often overlooked incompatabilty regarding Eels and reef tanks; they produce quite a bit of waste, raising nitrate levels, creating poor conditions for Cnidarians (Anemones, Corals, Hydroids, et cetera) and small eggs and fry. Frequent water changes, Granular Ferric Oxide (or similiar phosphate remover; GFO is the most effective) or a thriving photosynthetic refugium will allieviate these effects.

Bubble-tipped Anemones are a good choice for a first Anemone, but a very reliable source (Great Lakes) on this board says that Seba's Anemone (Heteractis sebae ?) may be an even better choice. Remember that Metal Halide lighting is usually considered the minimum for any photosynthetic Anemone.

-Lynden

 

[suggs]

you will need perfect water conditions and metal halide lighting these creaturs can live for many many years so only have one if your sure you can offer the best care for it, they are not easy by any means.

Eel's are ok but can and oftern do climb out of the tank and die on the floor, some are hard to feed.

 

[sothoth]

you will need ... metal halide lighting these creaturs can live for many many years so only have one if your sure you can offer the best care for it, they are not easy by any means.

Do I really need metal halide lights for a bubble anemone? I think I've settled on that type. I thought bubbles were OK with moderate light, and by that I mean 3W/gal or so, like for a normal coral tank. I'm thinking about a few tank scenarios, first a 50 gal but now I'm wondering if I should do a 35 gal with 2x65W (1 actinic, 1 10,000k) or 2x95W (even more, but probably that's overkill too). I don't want to be a bad anemone owner but I always hear MH proponents act like everything needs metal halides but my experience is that MH's are overkill most of the time, and frankly are a hassle so why use them if you don't need them?

 

[andywg]

you will need ... metal halide lighting these creaturs can live for many many years so only have one if your sure you can offer the best care for it, they are not easy by any means.

Do I really need metal halide lights for a bubble anemone? I think I've settled on that type. I thought bubbles were OK with moderate light, and by that I mean 3W/gal or so, like for a normal coral tank. I'm thinking about a few tank scenarios, first a 50 gal but now I'm wondering if I should do a 35 gal with 2x65W (1 actinic, 1 10,000k) or 2x95W (even more, but probably that's overkill too). I don't want to be a bad anemone owner but I always hear MH proponents act like everything needs metal halides but my experience is that MH's are overkill most of the time, and frankly are a hassle so why use them if you don't need them?

Almost no success stories of nems are from people without MH. The vast majority are from people with MH. This is the same as SPS. A few people have success with T5 or PC, but the vast majority of people require MH to have success. On the flip side, most failures of both nems and SPS are from people who have not got MH. There are a couple of nems that can (not will) do ok without MH, but they are the exception.

If you really want a nem then I recommend you read this guide by members of RC: http/www.carlosreef.com/AnemoneFAQ.pdf

 

[Lynden]

There is hardly such thing as lighting "overkill". The animals found in a reef tank live, day after day, under the blazing tropical sun. The lighting they get is equivalent to hundreds of watts per gallon. Trying to get an anemone to adapt to only a few watts per gallon is like trying to plant a tree in a dark cave. They will not survive long, and certainly not to their full lifespan. Consider the fact that trees and Anemones can live potentially forever, and suddenly a couple weeks or months doesn't seem like much.

I'll tell you what I know; even though I like my PC's, I would have never of bought them knowing that MH was so much better. I will be upgrading within a few months.

-Lynden

 

[Javeo]

It is perfectly possible to keep anemones under T5 lighting. I have a GBTA, RBTA, LTA, H.sebae, condy, and two unknown species that are doing wonderfully under 159w of T5. All are in a 30 uk gallon reef. The trick is to keep the water quality perfect, while feeding the anems well. My pair of A ocellaris are hosted by the GBTA which is the oldest and largest anem in the tank. The other anems are host to various shrimps and crabs.
Heres my GBTA

 

[Lynden]

Here we have it, my friends, the exception.

 

[SkiFletch]

How many T5 tubes spanning the length of your tank are there? A 6 tube T5 setup will put out similar PAR numbers to a metal halide setup IME and wouldnt necessarily be an exception to the rule. But then a 6-tube T5 setup may cost you mroe than a MH setup to begin with . A 4-tube T5 setup would be closer to an exception to the rule. If so, well done, how old is that nem?

 

[Javeo]

How many T5 tubes spanning the length of your tank are there? A 6 tube T5 setup will put out similar PAR numbers to a metal halide setup IME and wouldnt necessarily be an exception to the rule. But then a 6-tube T5 setup may cost you mroe than a MH setup to begin with . A 4-tube T5 setup would be closer to an exception to the rule. If so, well done, how old is that nem?

Its a 4 tube arcadia luminaire, 36" tubes. two 14000K marine white, a deltec 60/40 tube and one actinic blue.
Well the GBTA has been in my tank about a year and a half and its more than tripled in size. The rbta just over a year, the lta, sebea, and other two unknown one about 9 months. The condy Ive had for 2 months and its was from a shop display under 150W halides. Since Ive had it it has grown many new tentacles and it has gone from a brown colour to a nice snowy white with bright purple tips. The sebae has gone from a bleached cream to a deep brown with purple tips.

unknown and sebea before

uknown, tulip maybe?

I agree perhaps it is the exception but I cant keep coral so I have to keep something!

 

[sothoth]

Several comments:

First, the comparison to tank lighting with the outdoor reefs is apples and oranges. Sure the sun puts out a lot more power (W/gal), but that's not what we're talking about. The sun doesn't emit photosynthesizing wavelength light in as tight a band as bulbs, so while the total W/gal might be less in a tank, that has nothing to do with whether the right wavelength is reaching the corals in sufficient quantity. Also, large portions of reefs are much further under water than most tanks, so the amount of light that hits the water is not the same as what's reaching them, nor does it correlate perfectly with what the sun puts out. The ocean water filters and refracts light (that's why it looks blue) but bulbs are designed to give corals exactly what they need.

Having said that, I'm sure natural light would be the best thing but since we don't have that it still means we have to replicate it the best we can, which is obviously sloppy seconds but it's all we've got.

Second, I think MH's have other problems, esp the heat generated, and the cost. In a perfect world I'd have all my tanks with MH's and not worry about it, but even CF's at high wattage produce enough heat that in my part of the world I'd need a chiller to keep the tank cool or keep an open lid. The latter isn't possible if I want a snowflake eel, which I want.

So... the real question is what can I get away with without the problems produced by MHs. If my temp spikes because I can't afford a chiller, it matters very little what kind of W/gal I put in there. The anemone is dead from excessive heat, so the question is how many W/gal do I NEED as opposed to how many are ideal in a perfect world.

Also, anemones can photosynthesize and eat solids, both methods are probably needed to keep them healthy, but I'm sure there are feeding approaches that can be used to help offset imperfect (but not horrible) lighting, since both things (food and light) basically provide energy for the animal (ie do the same thing at the end of the day).

Finally, I go to a salt store in Milpitas, Cali, about 2x/month that keeps very lovely anemones under CF's. They have a very nice selection of corals and several display tanks (the anemone is in a display and has been for several years, it's about 12" diameter and orange, but I haven't looked up the species). I don't know the W/gal range they have but if I were to guess it's probably about 5-6W/gal at most. I'll find out for sure, but I'm pretty sure several people have managed to find ways to keep anemones without MH's, especially the less demanding species I would like to start with. The CF's I'm leaning towards are 95W and I could drop the tank size to 35gal which would make it about 5W/gal. According to liveaquaria.com, the bubble I like is fine with "moderate" or "bright" lighting. Moderate is defined as 4-6W/gal and Bright is 6-8W/gal. So my question is what are Javeo and the salt store are doing to make the lower light tolerable for the anemones. If they're an exception they must be doing something else right.

I will also look more into solutions to the heat and lid problems with MH's so if I'm missing the mark on my reluctance to use them please set me straight, I would be more likely to use them if I wasn't worried about baking corals with them. My CFs have done very well for me in the past with Zoa's, Xenia, Anthelia, Star polyps, Acropora, etc, as long as I replace them every 6-9 months. I use one actinic and one 10000K, but total i've only got 4W/gal in my tank and everything is flourishing.