Bacteria

[Bonnied2005]

I have obtained gravel from a cycled tank. I have hung it in self made nylong bags in all 3 of my tanks in the path of either the filter current or over the bubble wands.. How long should it be before I start to see a difference in the levels in my tanks.

Thanks in advance.

 

[wetwetwet]

Depends what you are trying to do - is it cycle the three tanks? But as your tanks have fish are they cycled ?

If the tanks have been running for a while I don't see the benifit



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[Bonnied2005]

5 gal tank has been up and running since November and still not cycled with fish... Ammonia is 4.0 all other levels 0 except for 6.2 ph level..

10 gal has been up since December and still not cycled. Ammonia has been a steady 8+, other levels at 0 with a ph of 7.0

2 gallon has only been set up a week using water from the 10 gallon and 1/2 tap water conditioned as an emergency hospital tank for my guppies.. hense not cycled... although happy with an ammonia level of 1.0 - 2.0 as compared to the other 2 tanks, but then again nitrites and nitrates are at 0... haven't tested the ph yet in that tank..

I can say that the 2 gallon was rather cloudy when i got home from work a few hours ago, i did a small 10% water change and added the established gravel it appears to be alot clearer now although I have not checked the levels yet.

So yes the purpose of the established bacteria gravel is to cycle my tanks because my fish are stressing!

 

[Squirrelbuddies]

Holy smokes -- I didn't think anything could live with ammonia at 8.0 or higher....what kind of test kit are you using??

 

[wetwetwet]

Ok - yes I can understand that the fish are stressing....

That is alot of fish for uncycled tanks, someone has given you bad advice.... - if you haven't done allready please read some of the pinned topics in beginners...

In the meantime, can any of the fish be rehoused to less hostile accommodation?

Also cut right back on feeding to lower the biological load and keep up with very regular small water changes.

try and get hold of a product like ammolock to netralise the ammonia soon.

I wish you luck but fear you maay be in for a rough time as your tanks cycle...



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[Bonnied2005]

I am using ammo lock and have been right along but these dang tanks just won't cycle... It was here on this board that someone told me to get my hands on either media or gravel from an established cycled system to get the tanks to cycle faster. I have to tell you though, for uncycled tanks these dang things are crystal clear... I went through the cloudy phase about 2 weeks ago, couldn't even see my fish in there for awhile, but now they are amazingly crystal clear.... So what could have happened bacterial boom that went no where?? and in both the longer standing tanks.... This is just driving me nutz I tell you.

 

[wetwetwet]

I've had a quick scan of some of your other posts and sorry didn't realise you've allready covered much of this....

A few problems have caused more - its a bit of a vicious circle....

Doing water changes prolongs the cycle - but keeps the fish healthier

In addition using ammolock saves the fish.... but brings its own problems. Now I'm no expert on this and luckily have not had to test it but I think ammolock just converts ammonia to a safer form - which is good. Ammonia though will still show up on your test kits - hence the very high readings you are getting and still having live fish. In addition (though not sure) this 'safe' form of ammoina won't actually allow the necessary benifical bacteria that we require devlope as quickly - the vicious circle.

Rehousing the fish while you get the tanks sorted would be best, but if not then minimal feeding and small daily water changes.

The difficulty here is that I don;t think your test kits can be relied upon for ammonia because of the ammolock.... As I said this is my thoughts I'm not a chemist but hope this helps (a little)


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[Bonnied2005]

It does help really and as long as i'm using the ammo lock i'm really not to overly concerned with the ammonia levels.. I had stopped using the ammolock and lost another fish the other day with visible signs of ammonia poisoning, a second was also showing drastic signs of same.... I again started with the ammo lock and was able to save the second fish, he is now happily back to swimming around the tank and has his coloring back.... the ammo lock however will only detoxify 3.0 ppm of the ammonia, so assuming I had a level of 8+ and added the ammolock i would still have a level of 5.0 to cycle with give or minus do to the water changes, feeding etc.....
What has me really puzzled and the reason I know the tank is not cycled since I can't trust the ammonia levels is there has been no nitrites and no nitrates registering in my tests... And I've been testing pretty much every 2-3 days praying to see some hint of these show up... not that I want nitrites but to see them would be a step in the right direction toward nitrates ....

I've tried everything..... StressZyme.... didn't do a thing.... Changed to using more concentrated form called Nitromax which from what I understand is the same as biosphere... still no change. I even thought that by having 5 less fish (4 moved to hospital tank, 1 death) that the decrease in waste would help but here a week later there is still not even a glimpse of change other than the water itself clearing up.

As for feeding, the 10 gallon gets fed every other day and only rationed amount of flakes or bloodworms, or plankton etc...... once a week the flakes are replaced with a tetratip so I can ensure the corys are getting their fill and the following day when I do my water change I make sure to vaccum the area the tetra tip landed in as to get the residual food that fell through the rocks.

My 5 gallon which really has me baffled because it doesn't contain that many fish. 2 itty bitty fry and 3 corys... gets baby bites daily but only a pinch... what they fry don't get either the corys do or the filter does.... it is so finely crused it gets swept up into the filter. And again once a week that get substituted for a tetra tip for the corys, but the babys get what flys into the water.

should i cut back further than that do you think??

 

[wetwetwet]

I'm a bit lost as to advice as I've never had to deal with anything quite like this.

If it were me I really be tempted to rehouse the fish and pretty much start again.

Alternatively I'd try and set up another tank but clone an existing one (not one of yours) so that you know the bacteria are present - transfer the fish to this and then do the same with your existing tanks... assuming you can get hold of another tank and know someone who could give you some mature filter material, again you would still need to feed very sparingly untill the bacteria has matched the load.

Or if not then maybe a product like biospria or as someone was mentioning in another thread recently 'pearls' - though I have no experience with either of these products (infact quite dubious) some people rate them...




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[paulthegreat]

I use a tab called Tetra Bactozym and was able to put in fish to a new tank after two days. Bactozym contains the bacteria that consume ammonia and turn it to nitrite, it also has the bugs that turn nitrite to nitrate and the way to get rid of nitrate is partial water changes. I also had my lfs squeze out a filter in a bag then poured the brown muck into my tank. It was clear again after a few hours.HTH

 

[gale]

I haven't read through all the replies, but it might work better if you let the nylon holders rest directly on your new gravel. It's my understanding that the bacteria can migrate directly to it from the old stuff.

 

[Bonnied2005]

I actually did that later that night because the water was seeping up through the nylons and acting as a siv... I had puddles on the floor and my desk ... Thanks for the tip though... Still no change in any of the readings 3 days later sigh.... thinking something in the tank is killing any good bacteria that may try to emerge just wish I knew what

 

[NickT]

im with wetwetwet, starting over will get you out of this mess.... see if you LFS can rehome your fish while you get things straitend out... maybe you can use this as an excuse to buy a 55g tank or somthing bigger

 

[Bonnied2005]

lmao, wish I had room for a 55 gallon..... The tank may not be cycling but I am getting success at lowering the ammonia levels.... fish don't need a cycled tank to survive just a not hostile environment... cycleing is a conveniece to me.... my main concern is for my fish right now and I'm happy to say they are doing well. Now purhaps if I can get the Ammonia to zero and keep up with the water changes there after I can get the dang thing to cycle properly....

 

[Jezah]

Ahem, I worked at LFS and just wanted to explain some things. You said your not reading any Nitrates or Nitrites? That makes sense cause the 'cycle' is for this reason...

1. A certain kind of bacteria converts Ammonia into Nitrates. If you dont have enough of that bacteria, from having your tank cycled, your ammonia will get really high.

2. Nitrites are another bad bi-product of Ammonia breakdown, so if you have too much ammonia your Nitrites will spike as the ammonia is getting turned to Nitrate.

3. WATER CHANGES! WATER CHANGES! WATER CHANGES! I seriously cannot stress that enough. It is the only good way to get rid of harmful substances like Nitrite and Ammonia.

4. I would also recommend adding salt to your tank. Just a little as it will help keep your fish healthier, because most diseases cant live with salt. I have had a 10 gallon with no diseases at all for over 6 years cause I add salt.

5. Last but not least...dont stress! At least you are smart enough to test your levels, most people lack even that essential brain power.