Are My Turbo Snails Dead?

[joel_mcfetridge]

i introduced my snails (4 of them) into my 30gal tank on tuesday night and have only ever saw very minimal movement from 2 of them (2 have not moved at all). i also introduced a regal tang and a flymo which are doing great.

how do you tell if a snail is dead? does the door bit open or what? the doors are shut on 3 of them, and open on the other although he moved slightly a while ago.

thanks guys.

 

[Ranger]

Sorry, I couldn't tell you... BUMP

 

[Mr.September15]

Pick them up and see if they react to movement.

 

[SkiFletch]

Wierd, what kind of snails?

 

[Donya]

As is done with freshwater snails, I would try the sniff test on the ones that are closed up and showing no movement. Sometimes snails will die with the operculum shut tight. When they do die, open or not, they start to smell like spoiled seafood in a few hours and that's the indication to get them out quick. How did you acclimate the snails?

 

[Mr.September15]

Sniffing pets has become a solution

 

[Donya]

Sniffing pets has become a solution

Hey, it's how us freshwater snailers do it LOL. It's simple and effective, and will tell quickly whether the snail is dead or simply stressed/unresponsive for other reasons. Stressed/shocked/poisoned snails can be completely unresponsive and appear dead when they're really not, and if the operculum has been closed so tightly that it's stuck, the snail could already be long gone.

 

[sothoth]

My wife is too impatient with acclimation and has killed countless turbos. I'm told snails are robust but our experience seems to suggest otherwise, at least to some extent.

We've resorted to me acclimating them for her (I don't mind sitting with a glass of my favorite beverage and doing this over 2 hours while listening to good music), and so far they all seem to live and do just great in her tank. So it wasn't a problem with the tank, she was just doing it too fast.

The only turbos I've ever lost have been quite old, so I think if you acclimate correctly you'll do great.

And I agree with the sniff test, we weeded out several carcasses and they indeed smelled HORRIBLE.

 

[Mr Miagi]

You will know when they are alive. They come out and move/eat straight away if you acclimate them properly. How did you acclimate them? You should drip acclimate them, by keeping them in their bag, and slowly syphoning tank water into the bag, drip by drip over the course of two hours. Use a tap or a not knot in the airline to control a drip, like one drip every second. When the bag water is doubled, empty half of it, and repeat the process.

Yes, some snails can be hardy, but they do need proper acclimation, especially if your water parameters are vastly different from your LFS's.

 

[Donya]

I'm told snails are robust but our experience seems to suggest otherwise, at least to some extent.

Snails are only hardy in comparison to things like echinoderms, corals, etc...meaning that once in the tank they can be fairly resilient to tank parameters (provided there is enough food--Turbos are one type that starve easily), but for acclimation...no way can they just be dumped in. That's instant death. They need drip line acclimation, especially if they are bagged up in only a couple cups of water.

 

[ostrow]

I don't necessarily agree with this. First, there's not much reason to move them in a bunch of water. If shipped, they should be shipped with wet paper towel or newspaper. From a store, just wet brown paper is fine in a bag. Temp acclimate for maybe 20min and then put them in gently, right-side up, and you should be fine.

The reason for this is, these snails need to be kept at reef-safe water in the first place, 1.023-1.025, and so should be very close in salinity to your water. Ditto on pH.

These animals are not the best for reef tanks though, presuming you are talking about Astraeas, the most common snails sold as "turbos" which are not turbos.

You would have much better luck with trochus snails.

But I have never seen any need to do a long drip acclimation with snails before.

 

[Donya]

But I have never seen any need to do a long drip acclimation with snails before.

Some species are hardier than others. Nerites for example can handle pretty big water differences, but they are probably one of the exceptions given their natural habitat range. I've heard/seen too many cases of Turbo species and others to be killed from improper acclimation (although not in my tanks, since I always use a dripline). There is nothing wrong with doing a longer than necessary acclimation; better to be safe than sorry.

If shipped, they should be shipped with wet paper towel or newspaper.

Can't say I've ever seen them come in that way at an LFS. Most freshwater snails do just find shipping in wet paper, but I've seen lots of shipments comming in at local stores, and none of the marine inverts have ever been packed that way.

1.023-1.025, and so should be very close in salinity to your water. Ditto on pH.

...all the other water parameters don't matter all of a sudden?

 

[ostrow]

Temp matters. I don't think you will find that snails are affected too much in the short run by changes in calcium or magnesium levels. Alk yes but if pH is close then it should be pretty fine.

The BEST way to acclimate virtually all snails is really a PITA:

Remove from the bag, and hold against the glass, above the water line with water just touching the bottom of the shell, until the snail grabs onto the glass. It will acclimate itself. This from Dr. Ron Shimek.

But doing this for an order of a dozen, not to mention several dozen, snails is just not realistic.

LFS do not get them in the wet paper towel. But hobbyists ordering from online sellers should demand they be shipped that way -- much less stressful on the animal, many fewer deaths in shipping, and better results in your tanks.

If a store puts your snails in water, at home I'd pour out almost all of the water, float the bag for temp, and then add the snails. I've never, ever had a problem adding snails this way -- trochus, pacific striped turbo, tongan nassarius, nassarius vibex, cerith, nerites, margaritas, and others. Astraeas, as I mentioned often sold as "turbos" and I am guessing what you are calling turbos, are dicey at best anyway and are best avoided altogether. No matter how you acclimate, they are likely to have 50% fatality rates at least within 6 months at most.

This info, by the way, is from personal experience, stories from countless other hobbyists, the most respected shops, and Dr. Ron's prolific writings.

 

[richard t]

i introduced my snails (4 of them) into my 30gal tank on tuesday night and have only ever saw very minimal movement from 2 of them (2 have not moved at all). i also introduced a regal tang and a flymo which are doing great.

how do you tell if a snail is dead? does the door bit open or what? the doors are shut on 3 of them, and open on the other although he moved slightly a while ago.

thanks guys.

Off topic i know.

What is a flymo?... And why are you putting a Regal tang in a 30g tank?

 

[Donya]

Astraeas, as I mentioned often sold as "turbos" and I am guessing what you are calling turbos, are dicey at best anyway and are best avoided altogether. No matter how you acclimate, they are likely to have 50% fatality rates at least within 6 months at most.

I am refering to the Turbo genus, and I'm not fond of Astreas for the reason you mention. Margarites species can also have similar problems from temperature issues. The snails I was refering to earlier are most certainly Turbo species, like Turbo fluctuosa, which I keep currently.

Remove from the bag, and hold against the glass, above the water line with water just touching the bottom of the shell, until the snail grabs onto the glass. It will acclimate itself.

And, in the event it doesn't hold onto the glass or gets frightened and lets go immediately? Such a method doesn't work for snails that are not glass climbers or easily frightened. Trochus are good about sticking onto the glass, as are some Turbo species (Turbo genus, not Astrea), but others don't always support themselves well right off the bat reliably. Can't really do the described method with a conch or other snails that don't support their weight well in the air.

You also seem to be assuming the water that the snail came home in tests out well and close to your water, and also that the LFS really is keeping the water at reef quality. Although that's the case for the best/ideal LFS, not all stores are that good. I baught snails once that, although proclaimed to be in reef conditions, were really in 1.019(!)sg that was very soft. Needless to say, I havn't been back there, but in a case where the water is really that different and the snails are stressed out and closed up at the bottom of the bag, there really isn't an excuse for not dripline acclimating.

Alk yes but if pH is close then it should be pretty fine.

That's a bad assumption I made once. I had an 8.2 pH in one of my tanks-in-the-making once with a disastrous 19-20dkH. I took the water in to be tested for other things, and that showed up as a surprise among the battery of tests the LFS did along with the 8.2 pH tested at the same time.