Aquatic Fertilizer and Snails

[Aroc2226]

I’m not sure if I’m right on this but I thought copper was bad for some fish and especially snails.

I was reading some ingredients of a popular fertilizer recommended here for some issues I’m having with plants.

One of the ingredients was copper sulfate.

Anything to be concerned about?

 

[Donya]

Depends on the amount of copper sulfate -and possibly also on whether it could build up over time if used a lot. Copper can be used to eliminate snails from a tank in high enough concentrations. Does it give any kind of measure or percentage associated with that ingredient or is it just in a jumbled list of stuff? If there's no percentage then there would be no way to know what concentration you'd be producing once mixed in the water. I don't know enough about fertilizers to know what sorts of amounts would be normal to expect.

I gather there are specifically invert-safe fertilizers on the market although I can't vouch for how well they work as I've never used fertilizers myself with aquatic plants. The ones I looked up in a quick just now search did not list any form of copper as an ingredient.

 

[Aroc2226]

Depends on the amount of copper sulfate -and possibly also on whether it could build up over time if used a lot. Copper can be used to eliminate snails from a tank in high enough concentrations. Does it give any kind of measure or percentage associated with that ingredient or is it just in a jumbled list of stuff? If there's no percentage then there would be no way to know what concentration you'd be producing once mixed in the water. I don't know enough about fertilizers to know what sorts of amounts would be normal to expect.

I gather there are specifically invert-safe fertilizers on the market although I can't vouch for how well they work as I've never used fertilizers myself with aquatic plants. The ones I looked up in a quick just now search did not list any form of copper as an ingredient.

It says .0001% copper

The ingredients say it is derived from copper sulfate.

It also says it’s safe for invertebrates like shrimp but doesn’t say anything about snails.

I’m not sure I want to use fertilizer of any kind.

It just doesn’t seem like something that’s safe for fish.

 

[Boundava]

Thrive makes a fertilizer that's safe for inverts and the Seachem Flourish fertilizer has a extremely low dose of copper that is also safe for inverts. It's the liquid Flourish, I'm not 100% sure about their fertilizer tabs.
I have used both and they are very good fertilizer.

BTW snails are inverts too...

 

[StevenF]

Ihave been making my own micro fertilizers for some time. One of my first micro fertilizers used copper sulfate and that tank I was using it on was a 5 gallon with shrimp and pond snails and Nerite snails. I experimentally ran it up to 20 Parts Per Billion (PPB). Shrimp and pond snails continued to reproduce. No obvious change in behavior. normally you want 3 to 10 PPB.

I didn't try a higher copper dose but I believe i could have gone higher.

Many sites say 1 part per billion of copper is harmful but I have not seen any scientific studies saying that. Addionally Shrimp have copper based blood. Not the iron based blood in humans. So Shrimp need copper to live. Same for plants. And many fertilizers have little to know copper.

Most of the copper in Aquariums comes from Tap water. Copper pipes are widely used to deliver water to homes.Typically copper is probably around 10 PPB. But it is entirely possible for bad pipes in a home to push the copper level much higher. The EPA limit for tap water is 1.3 parts per million which is 1300 PPB. I use 100% RO water in my tanks so my water has no copper.

 

[Donya]

Also worth noting that toxicity of copper to inverts (snails included) depends on pH. Low pH increases toxicity while high pH decreases it (ornamental snail species need >7 to avoid shell erosion).

0.0001% sounds small but the conversion to ppm is x10,000, so 0.0001x10,000=1ppm. Now, of course that would be diluted by tank volume quite a lot I assume. I'm guessing very sparse usage of the fertilizer would be fine because of that, but I would still recommend choosing a copper-free option since if that copper isn't taken up by the plants at the rate its added, it would build up over time and add to whatever is already present from tap water if that's what you're using.

Most of the copper in Aquariums comes from Tap water. Copper pipes are widely used to deliver water to homes.Typically copper is probably around 10 PPB. But it is entirely possible for bad pipes in a home to push the copper level much higher. The EPA limit for tap water is 1.3 parts per million which is 1300 PPB. I use 100% RO water in my tanks so my water has no copper.

Snails are more sensitive than shrimp where copper is concerned. When I first started keeping snails I lived in a house where the copper pipes put enough into the water to make apple snails sickly so I had to use chelating agents and keep the pH up too. I don't know the exact value of copper in the water of that house; it was considered "safe" to drink but it tasted terrible and metallic. I believe lengthy exposure to 1.3ppm would be lethal for a lot of snails.

 

[Byron]

Copper is one of the heavy metals--copper, iron, manganese and zinc--that are plant nutrients. Animals including humans have a need for some of these. But in excess the metals can kill plants, fish and humans. So it is down to keeping them at safe levels. Any quality comprehensive supplement will do this. Dosing you own may not, or adhoc dosing of specific minerals may not be at all safe.