Angel X Blue Ram

[MasterP]

I was going to the lfs to bet blue rams and saw thee hybrids that were between angels and blue rams. They were colored like a blue ram and shaped like one, but the body shape in the middle was more vertical like an angels. Their fins were more like angels. They were pretty cool but idecided not to get one. I was wondering if anyone else has seen it and if it is a rare find or pretty common.

 

[Nevergone815]

i, myself have never seen or heard of this before, but i just got into hybrids so who knows. it just doesn't seem like a pair that would real readily breed (i may be wrong). but if they actualy did breed i might say that it can't be all that common of a cross as it probably isn't all that desireable or hard to accomplish. like i said, either way i am new to hybrids and am probably wrong.

 

[plecoguy]

im pretty sure thats not a hyrbid of an angel and a ram, could be but it sounds more like what i have seen called a "balloon ram", just a deformed ram that is bred over and over again for that look

 

[cichlidtank]

Your inquiry made me interested, is it possible that an angel and ram were crossed? I would have to say, "It doesn't seem possible." You sort of described a "Balloon Ram" which is a strain of the common Mikrogeophagus ramirezi (German Blue Ram) which was inbred to excentruate body proportions. Here is a link to a site devoted to the "Balloon Ram" (http/www.geocities.com/yutaka_loo/). The main contention that I have with the theory of a "ramirezi" mating or at the least, crossed via artificial insemination or other means, with an angel (Pterophyllum scalare) is that their genera are so far diverging and that there is an unusually high amount of genetic divergence, when compared to African cichlids as outlined by I.P. Farias et. al. in the link included (golab.unl.edu/publications/Farias-JME1999.pdf)- look at page 709, under the caption "High Rate of Molecular Evolution of South American Cichlids." But on the other side of the argument, the other people who I have seen posting essentially the same question said that their LFS employees stated that the fish were hybrid results of crossed angels and rams. Here's another of those angel rams (http/www.aquariumadvice.com/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=9349&cat=534), but "possible- yes, for all intensive purposes, probable- no." If it is a balloon ram, or a variant strain of a blue ram they are probably very difficult to keep alive (rams are inbred enough without purposefully trying to selectively inbreed- i.e. common spinal afflictions) due to a quick development of "alien" body types without evolutionary (selective fitness) constraints (quick as in, under 30 years). On the other hand, if they are hybrids, then they are probably mules (sterile), since the parent species are from relatively "far" relating genera, although I. P. Farias et. al. consider the genera relatively close while genetically divergent (in cichlid terms).

Hopefully that wasnt too confusing. And as far as hearing of them before, nope cant say I have... but I have seen and heard of the Balloon Rams before and know that they are pretty sought after, albeit commonly sterile and genetically mal-afflicted.

 

[Genesis]

http/www.aquariumadvice.com/photopost/sh...to=9349&cat=534

thats one bad-ass feeshie!

 

[fish_keeper2]

IMO that fish is rather ugly but thats just my opinion. anyway there is no way to prove that that is a pic of a true angelXram hybrid, it is possible but i dont know........

 

[plecoguy]

looks like a selectively bred gold ram

 

[cichlidtank]

Yeah, I agree. To me it looks like gold rams have gone through the same selective breeding processes (again, the first time being the breeding to yield gold color mutations) that the blue rams went through to yield the "common" balloon ram.

 

[Synirr]

That is definitely just a balloon ram. You've got to have a pretty big imagination to see it as anything else

 

[afireinside]

Well then I got a pretty big imagination

 

[beanersaurus]

We have an angel/blue ram hybrid.

It was less agressive than the blue ram we housed with it was. They were pretty together in a 10 gallon. Then the blue ram died so I moved the hybrid into my 20 gallon community tank [and sold the 10 gallon]. Now it's housed with 6 balloon mollies (they ignore eachother), 2 small angelfish (the hybrid is agressive towards them), a school of neons (neither the angelfish or hybrid bother them), and a female betta (she is the only fish that bullies the hybrid).

Except I suspected that it developed a gill fluke (what killed the blue ram) so currently he's hanging solo in a 3 gallon until his clout treatment is over.

http/bl104w.blu104.mail.live.com/att/Get...CB5F4AEA1CEEF0|

There is a picture of him in the 3 gallon hospital tank. He changed his color from dark blue to a orange/peach color to match the rocks.

 

[Truck]

We have an angel/blue ram hybrid.

no you dont, because its physically impossible AND why did you dig up such an old thread

 

[pica_nuttalli]

pic doesn't work. and i agree that there is no way you actually have a ramxangel hybrid.

 

[Davo86]

The fish in Question is commonly sold as an Angel Ram but is just a deformed/Balloon long finned blue Ram

 

[powerbows]

I actually have a Gold Ram/Angel cross. It is acutally very nice looking. I also have a Blue Angel Ram - Simply Beautiful. They are somewhat agressive but also take the attitde of a angelfish.