All My Fish Are Dying!

[andypandy]

as previously mentioned, i had a sick male betta - suspected fin rot.

No3, no2 - 20 and 0
dunno ammonia
kh 16
gh 6

didn't manage to get any meds today as all 5 lfss were shut!

in other news... another female betta had his fins nipped by (i think) a gourami (who is now in a breeding net until further nootice). This betta is in another sick tank.

Both of these are now even refusing live food and look in dyer state - nose diving down, displaying horizontal stripes and i don't think they'll last the night. I have resorted to giving them some (2 years out of date) melafix as i don't expect them to last long anyway, it can't hurt, even tho it seemed to kill another guppy last week.

In the tank where the gourami is, i have a young angel, guppies and 2 other female betta and 2 sucking loaches and a shy platy. One of the bettas has just been bred unsuccesfully and now looks terrible, just generally ill. The other betta's fins have been nipped as has one of the guppies - i am sure it is the gourami as the angel is young and very well tempered whereas th gourami is rowdy. His gf also died yesterday as her senser thing had been bitten off too.

will administer meds to all remaining fish early tomoz morn but i dunno whats happening!!!!!! help please

 

[jollysue]

The first thing that jumps out is that you have stocking issues. Some of the fish are competing for territory. After a quick skim through, the Bettas, Gouramis, guppies and angel need to be separated. Your Bettas do not appear to be doing well in the community. Put them in individual tanks and keep their water clean and treat with a fin rot medication--I use Mardel products.

Start doing frequent small water changes and vacum the substrate and clean the plants etc.

MelaFix should be half doses for Betta--probably Gourami too and Cichlids (angel). I don't use MelaFix in community tanks anymore, because someone always dies from the medication.

All fin nippers need to be separated. Get some broad spectrum antibiotics.

Guppies, Gourami, Betta, angels are seldom a good mix--especially the Betta with any of the other three.

 

[andypandy]

ok the female betta had died, but the male hasn't. getting some meds 2day. the angels, guppies and betta have been fine together for months so thats not an issue, even the platy is best friends with the angel. The gourami has just suddenly become annoying. So ill do what you said and put the gourami in the sick tank now vacant - after a water change of course. So i can treat nipped fins with stuff for finrot yes?

 

[Spooky76]

Nipped fins dont need treating as such, the fish will generate them itself providing its in good water conditions.

I think Jollysue was meaning melafix at half dose to help promote the fins to regrow.

 

[jollysue]

As the fish mature you may see more territorial and aggressive issues with some of those fish. As fish mature they change their behavior. What was doesn't always stay that way. Bettas are particularly unpredictable. Bettas and Gourami and guppies are not traditionally recommended, because of nipping. Angels are a Cichlid, I believe, and may become more territorial as they mature. How many have you lost now?

The op said he suspects fin rot. I meant that if there are fin rot symptoms and nipped fins, Betta especially are suseptable to fin rot. I would treat. But that's me. I would treat with a round of Maracyn Plus for the mild cases of fin rot and more agressively for the advanced cases. Fish with their heads down and butts up are bad.

Have you bred Betta before? Was the female beaten badly?

I personally don't use MelaFix much. Many fish don't do well with it and there are more effective meds. I know lots of people are recommending it, and it is a debated issue, but it is not good with all fish. I have lost several from the use of MelaFix.

It sounds like there is advanced bacterial infection with several fish and it may have become viral. (I don't mean become a virus but become deadly, hard to control, endemic.

 

[-germ-]

Not read the replies, bit tired but i'd certainly think it was aggression based, your stocking with no offense intended is dire. You have a really bad mix of fish for loads of different reasons....
By sucking loach do you mean Chinese Algae Eater?

 

[jollysue]

As for the treatment of fin rot:

Usually fin rot shows a white ragged edge. The more ragged, shredded and dead looking the the more advanced. If the edges of fin/s on any fish are edged in white, ragged or shredding treat aggressively. If you see any fin loss, treat aggressively. If it is only a nip and there have been not deaths or evident fin rot then observe and keep the water clean and tolerate no more nipping.

The bacterial infection can result in more bacterial and fungal invasions and internal infections if not treated. Since fish are dying, I can only assume that it is more than a nipped fin here and there.

 

[andypandy]

1. yes i do mean algae eaters

2. the male betta died shortly before i got home with meds

3. have added melafix to main tank to treat 3 fish, all with nipped fins fromthe gourami, who will be separated tonight once the other tank is clean.

4. One female betta who bred was barely harmed at all in breeding. But i fear she may have beginnings of fin rot - not too bad fin loss or damage but (admittedly after mucking about with the tank adding plants for more hiding places) i noticed some grey tips all over the edges, so... is it possible to use anti biotics at the same time as melafix? i bought interpet no 8 - anti fungus and fin rot, and was wondering whether i could use both this and melafix to be on the safe side.

would it help if i took pics of the injured fish and uploaded them?

oh and btw no more damage since gourami went into net - so it must be him. and if and when angel gets a bit nasty i do have other tanks now available to transfer the guppies or remaining betta.

 

[andypandy]

pics:might not b able to see v well the grey bits on the red one, but there are slightish bits thereanother oneand the red one

 

[jollysue]

Do a major water change (if you don't want to treat the Betta in their own little hospitals) run a fresh carbon filter. Maybe do another water change. Remove the carbon and treat with the antibiotic. If only the Betta are affected, then I would treat them separately.

How many Betta are with the guppies? Betta can be sneaky. You may walk in some day and find your guppies torn up. They may also be messing with each other when they feel well enough. They are sick right now and need to be treated with the antibiotic. Betta do not really like MelaFix. It messes with their labrynth or something I heard recently. But it is debated.

 

[andypandy]

Do a major water change (if you don't want to treat the Betta in their own little hospitals) run a fresh carbon filter. Maybe do another water change. Remove the carbon and treat with the antibiotic. If only the Betta are affected, then I would treat them separately.

How many Betta are with the guppies? Betta can be sneaky. You may walk in some day and find your guppies torn up. They may also be messing with each other when they feel well enough. They are sick right now and need to be treated with the antibiotic. Betta do not really like MelaFix. It messes with their labrynth or something I heard recently. But it is debated.

only 2 bettas with 4 guppies, there were 4 a short while ago though and they get along fine - i have had them for over a year and both are now pretty much adults

and 2 guppies are a little ripped - but theyre so fast you cant get a good pic ! 1 has had his split improved remarkably since yesterday, which i can only put down to the melafix

i'd prefer to keep them together, especially the bettas, as they get really stressed out if i swap them over compared to other fish.

Do you agree the betta might have finrot then?

 

[jollysue]

From the pictures, the fins look like they are shredding (every time you look at them they have less fin and you may find shreds on the bottom of the tank) which is a symptom of fin rot. That may be why there is not much evidence of the white edges--the fins are shredding. In addition, it looks as though the fish has clamped fins. If the fish have clamped fins most of the time it is a symptom of a very sick fish. It they are not eating, sulking, staying off to themselves, you have an advanced sickness. At this point it is my guess that you have primary and secondary infections.

I cannot emphasize enough the importance of extremely clean water. I am not talking about stats. I am referring to the infective bacterial and fungal load.

I don't even see evidence of ventrals on these boys. You must chose your treatment, but you are resisting doing what experienced fish hobbyist are telling you is necessary. Post this in the Betta forum and you will be told in no uncertain terms that these fish need to be separated and treated. As soon as the fish feel well again the problem will return--if it is not too late.

 

[andypandy]

sorry didn't mean to offend anyone! they have been separated now and treated with anti fungus and finrot antibiotics - even though one really doesn'y look happy there when she was before

let you know if its succesful!

thanks for the help btw

oh and the reddy one does have ventrals, they are just close to her body.

 

[jollysue]

I'm, sorry, I am very confused as to whether you have male or female Bettas. If I was abrupt, forgive me. I was in a hurry and it is hard to diagnose from online pics. I would be perfectly happy to turn this over to someone else who is better at it.

Yes please let me know what is happening and how it is going.

 

[andypandy]

yeah they are females. one is sulking about a lot tho even more. hopefully she'll be ok tho.

Do i need to do water changes every day and re dose with the water change in the appropriate amount, or do i just leave it, as thats what the instructions say for 7 days, then do a water change and re dose then if needed