40 gallon / 155liters - silent cycle - green or red? Stocking suggestions please!

[Bruce Leyland-Jones]

I have Salvinia, lovely plant, but not what you want with any gourami. They need the more substantive root systems of the earlier mentioned species.

I believe that any of my photos or videos will suggest that you are quite wrong with regards Salvinia and gourami.

 

[Byron]

Gourami live among tangled vegetation. The less than 1-inch length of the root system of Salvinia does not provide what they expect according to their habitats. The photo below is of my 70g SE Asian tank of various gourami and rasbora that ran in 2010. The surface is fairly thick with Water Sprite (look at the massive root systems) and Wisteria.

 

[Bruce Leyland-Jones]

Gourami live among tangled vegetation. The less than 1-inch length of the root system of Salvinia does not provide what they expect according to their habitats. The photo below is of my 70g SE Asian tank of various gourami and rasbora that ran in 2010. The surface is fairly thick with Water Sprite (look at the massive root systems) and Wisteria.

Each to their own experiences and knowledge.

EDIT: For literacy.

 

[Cmdr_DASh]

On the pH, there is no problem sorting out exactly what it is, but no not under any circumstance considering messing with it. The pH is very closely tied to the GH and KH. Given the numbers for these, the pH is likely going to stay pretty much where it is. However, pH in tap water can be very different from in the tank.

Confirm, my only intent is to find out more precisely what it is.

When you test pH in tap water, let a glass of fresh tap water sit 24 hours, then test. This will give you a more reliable reading. Tank water does not need this step, unless it is just filled. The biological processes in an aquarium will impact water chemistry naturally, and there is no value in trying to force them otherwise. Let the system stabilize so you know what you are dealing with.

Will do.

Update from today:
- did some maintenance and approx 20% (30 liter) water change and added some plant fertilizer
- got 16 cardinal tetras from the LFS (impossible to count 16... I seem to get 15 when I try to count)
- discussed about substrate level fish with LFS employee - he said that corys are fine with <3mm gravel that'st not sharp (mine has rounded edges special for aquariums). To make sure I checked the description of the 1-2mm gravel I have and it's specifically intended for bottom dwellers such as catfish and invertebrates. I did see some corys that I didn't dislike... I will do some more research on them
- LFS employee recommended I raise the temperature to 25C which will work better for tetras and will be fine for shrimp too. I've upped the temp on the heater, but I'm suspicious of the heater as it seems not great quality. I had bad experiences with heaters in the past, so I ordered another one to avoid any issues.
- added 4 leaves to the tank
- after acclimatization, introduction to the tank, I fed the tetras some live daphnia. We're making friends I think.
- did another set of tests with the same results are yesterday: 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, 0 nitrates

Pic:

 

[Byron]

discussed about substrate level fish with LFS employee - he said that corys are fine with <3mm gravel that'st not sharp (mine has rounded edges special for aquariums). To make sure I checked the description of the 1-2mm gravel I have and it's specifically intended for bottom dwellers such as catfish and invertebrates. I did see some corys that I didn't dislike... I will do some more research on them

He is wrong, period. Those who collect cory species in South America know that they occur over sand (or in some few habitats it may be mud, dried leaves, with or without sand mixed in). The sharpness is one issue but not the only . This family of fish are filter feeders; there are dozens of videos online showing how they upend into the sand, take in a mouthful of sand, filter out insect/insect larvae, and expel the sand via the gills. They cannot do this with gravel. To be honest, it is cruel to force them to live over anything but sand. Know the species, know its habitat, and be prepared to provide what the fish need.

 

[itiwhetu]

He is wrong, period. Those who collect cory species in South America know that they occur over sand (or in some few habitats it may be mud, dried leaves, with or without sand mixed in). The sharpness is one issue but not the only . This family of fish are filter feeders; there are dozens of videos online showing how they upend into the sand, take in a mouthful of sand, filter out insect/insect larvae, and expel the sand via the gills. They cannot do this with gravel. To be honest, it is cruel to force them to live over anything but sand. Know the species, know its habitat, and be prepared to provide what the fish need.

Please stop posting this about Corydoras. You need to realize that what you are saying is not factually true. These fish are not filter feeders.

 

[itiwhetu]

I am surprised that this system is going ahead, I wish you well and will interested to see how these fish get along.

 

[itiwhetu]

I have done some research for you.

Axelrod's Atlas states pH 6 DH 6 for cardinal tetras, so on his system you work 0.2 either side of that figure.
Seriously Fish states pH 3.5-7.5 hardness 18-215 ppm. In other words, Seriously Fish says these are hardy fish put them into basically any freshwater tank.
I know from experience these are fussy fish that need to have very precise water parameters to survive long term

 

[NannaLou]

I am surprised that this system is going ahead, I wish you well and will interested to see how these fish get along.

@itiwhetu , I’m not trying to be rude, but I’ve been reading through this thread quite carefully and I’m getting a bit confused with the details - please can you tell me why you are, “surprised that this system is going ahead”..? As a new fish keeper, can’t see what’s wrong with the planning.

 

[itiwhetu]

@itiwhetu , I’m not trying to be rude, but I’ve been reading through this thread quite carefully and I’m getting a bit confused with the details - please can you tell me why you are, “surprised that this system is going ahead”..? As a new fish keeper, can’t see what’s wrong with the planning.

You are not being rude. Cardinal Tetras are delicate fish requiring precise conditions to survive and then be able to spawn. The conditions in this tank are way beyond their comfort zone. They may survive. Will they every reach their reason for life, that is to spawn. I doubt it.

 

[NannaLou]

You are not being rude. Cardinal Tetras are delicate fish requiring precise conditions to survive and then be able to spawn. The conditions in this tank are way beyond their comfort zone. They may survive. Will they every reach their reason for life, that is to spawn. I doubt it.

Thank you for that reply, I’m worrying about hijacking this thread but I will ask one more question if that’s ok? Can fish do more than just survive (be happy and healthy) even if they don’t get to breed? (I know there is a whole thread on the breed/not to breed question).

 

[itiwhetu]

Thank you for that reply, I’m worrying about hijacking this thread but I will ask one more question if that’s ok? Can fish do more than just survive (be happy and healthy) even if they don’t get to breed? (I know there is a whole thread on the breed/not to breed question).

What is, any animals purpose in life, it is to reproduce? Therefore, my suggestion is that if you don't give your fish the opportunity to reproduce you haven't allowed them to fulfill their purpose in life. So, ask yourself the question has your fish been completely happy and had a fulfilled life.

 

[Cmdr_DASh]

He is wrong, period. Those who collect cory species in South America know that they occur over sand (or in some few habitats it may be mud, dried leaves, with or without sand mixed in). The sharpness is one issue but not the only . This family of fish are filter feeders; there are dozens of videos online showing how they upend into the sand, take in a mouthful of sand, filter out insect/insect larvae, and expel the sand via the gills. They cannot do this with gravel. To be honest, it is cruel to force them to live over anything but sand. Know the species, know its habitat, and be prepared to provide what the fish need.

I may be causing some confusion here by using "gravel" as a term for coarse sand. I'm no rock expert, so I gave the grain size 1-2mm of the top substrate. The quite enlarged picture with the small snails is very likely contributing to this impression of large rocks, but that's really not the case. It's not the finest sand, but probably can still be called sand. Here's the the description of what I have:

Our water-neutral fine-grained Olibetta natural gravel is an ideal aquarium sand for your freshwater aquarium. The fine grain has rounded edges and offers you a super great alternative to coarser gravel. This fine aquarium sand is ideal for aquariums with bottom dwellers such as catfish and invertebrates. For example, armoured catfish love to search for food in sand and fine gravel.

Fine-Grained aquarium gravel prevents the seepage of feed, which can otherwise begin to rot between the gravel grains. This fine gravel prevents this and contributes indirectly to improved water quality. The Olibetta aquarium gravel does not compact even in this fine grain, so the roots of your aquarium plants can still provide enough nutrients for good growth.

You can use our fine natural gravel alone or as a combination with other grain colours or grains, or in the aquascape or aquarium. For example, consider a stream or a path through the aquarium.

Our Olibetta natural gravel for the aquarium not only has a great look, but also uses the ecosystem in the pool as an effective biological filter. It can perfectly fulfill this task in conjunction with a floor washer or floor heater. The natural gravel should be thoroughly rinsed with cold water before use to remove any abrasive debris and dust.

Our expert Oliver Knott recommends:

This fine-grained aquarium sand is used really well alone, and together with other aquarium giants, it is also really beautiful. The aquarium sand is particularly suitable for aquariums with bottom-dwellers and invertebrates.

I have done some research for you.

Axelrod's Atlas states pH 6 DH 6 for cardinal tetras, so on his system you work 0.2 either side of that figure.
Seriously Fish states pH 3.5-7.5 hardness 18-215 ppm. In other words, Seriously Fish says these are hardy fish put them into basically any freshwater tank.
I know from experience these are fussy fish that need to have very precise water parameters to survive long term
View attachment 146150

Thank you kind sir. I've also researched them and agree the interwebs is full of various info. For example here ( https://www.fishkeepingworld.com/cardinal-tetra/ ) it says "Cardinal tetras are the perfect beginner fish" which is I don't believe is the case. I also think they are fussy, maybe not as fussy as the neons, but still fussy. I was initially considering going with embers instead because of this reason.

I am surprised that this system is going ahead, I wish you well and will interested to see how these fish get along.

Thank you! I will continue to post progress and be open to any suggestions. I'm hoping your fears will not materialize. For now the fish are doing good, and a couple pairs are doing a mating dance. They started to swim in a school and they are eating well. One of them is a bit of a loner, perhaps a bit stressed even though it's not showing. I'll keep an eye on it.

 

[itiwhetu]

I will make one more comment. I don't won't to distract from this thread. If you won't to learn more set up another thread.
Anyhow I have learnt that community spawning fish is the most rewarding part of this hobby. I have learnt a lot about how to setup tanks to allow each fish to spawn and watch some of their young grow up. It is not perfect, but it allows fish to fulfill their destiny. Look at my profile I am happy to advise.

 

[itiwhetu]

I may be causing some confusion here by using "gravel" as a term for coarse sand. I'm no rock expert, so I gave the grain size 1-2mm of the top substrate. The quite enlarged picture with the small snails is very likely contributing to this impression of large rocks, but that's really not the case. It's not the finest sand, but probably can still be called sand. Here's the the description of what I have:






Thank you kind sir. I've also researched them and agree the interwebs is full of various info. For example here ( https://www.fishkeepingworld.com/cardinal-tetra/ ) it says "Cardinal tetras are the perfect beginner fish" which is I don't believe is the case. I also think they are fussy, maybe not as fussy as the neons, but still fussy. I was initially considering going with embers instead because of this reason.



Thank you! I will continue to post progress and be open to any suggestions. I'm hoping your fears will not materialize. For now the fish are doing good, and a couple pairs are doing a mating dance. They started to swim in a school and they are eating well. One of them is a bit of a loner, perhaps a bit stressed even though it's not showing. I'll keep an eye on it.

If you do nothing else, look at the photo I posted. That is the environment you need to create.