Aufwuchs ( can I say that here ) "Biofilm" anyone actually tried to increase the growing of it in your tanks???

Magnum Man said:

@Aqua67 ... that sounds like what I was thinking... wondering if anyone ever tried "seeding" a 55 gallon tank with something like that??? & maybe the introduction of of small, live foods, Copods, Scuds etc.

there are quite a few larger fish in this tank, but if the organisms are small enough, to go un noticed by the bigger fish???

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When I was in a hurry to start a brand new 3 gal tank for some shrimp that were on their way in the mail, I sprinkled Bacter AE on the inert small gravel substrate before I filled the new tank with water. It seemed to help get things started and give them something to graze on when they arrived. (I did everything else I could to “speed cycle” the tank and was successful, adding caridina less than a week later and had 2 berried females in less than 2 months, now with babies beginning to arrive. The tank is 2.5 months old.)

Please don’t put scuds in your shrimp tank when you start one. You will be sorry that you did if your purpose is to grow a shrimp colony. Scuds are great though. I love them in my fish tanks, especially with bottom dwellers like cories or kuhli loaches. Anytime a scud swims in the water column the other fish will excitedly hunt them and keep their numbers down. Inevitably you will lose some when you vacuum the gravel, but worry not, your colony will likely survive. You will rarely need to scrape algae in a tank with a good scud colony. They will eat plant debris, but they will also eat meat and a freshly molted shrimp hiding in a pile of driftwood will be a sitting duck for the amphipods (scuds) that are hiding in that driftwood also. Anyhow, my colony was crashing but the scuds were abundant. I’m eliminating them manually now, likely a never ending endeavor.

Copepods and cyclopods, I can’t say anything negative about them in my shrimp tank. Both of my shrimp tanks have those as well. I have thought of acclimating and dropping in a single schooling fish (neon, ember, etc) and letting them eat up those tinier critters, but right now I don’t see the need to do that. If anyone else had a bad experience of those in a shrimp tank, please do share.

Over the years I have learned to adopt methods which do not make a lot of extra work in tanks. So my usual goal is to do things in a way that the amount of work needed to maintain tanks is as little as possible. There is a limit to how little one can end up needing to do to keep a tank healthy.

It matters how many tanks on has. After just under a decade of keeping a high tech planted tanks with pressurized CO2 etc., I realized this tank required that I spend about 3 times what it took me to maintain any of my other tanks, even those bigger than this planted tank.

So I took it apart and repurposed it. I sold the co2 system. I still do planted tanks but they are much simpler with easier care needing plants. My other problem is that I am a serial heavy stocker. This makes for more work. But I am a fish keeper above all and I do plants because it is beneficial for the fish. The more tanks one has, the greater the need to find ways to reduce the average time one must spend on maint. if possible.

So, the idea of trying to create a tank which produces sufficient aufwuchs to feed the inhabitants is out of the question. It is also not necessary as there are plenty of other food forms one can feed which provide what the fish need.

One can argue that it is more natural for fish which are aufwuchs feeders in the wild should have the same in captivity. But then what about the rest of "natural?" Most aufwuchs feeders live in huge volumes of water which we do not replicate this in their tanks. Many of them live in rivers which tend to have unidirectional flow. Do we also create river tanks for such fish?

edited to fix typos

@TwoTankAmin ... I agree, & I have some repashy here to supplement... just want to try to offer at least some of the natural diet items in the variety of food I feed...
for instance, my Zebra Oto, has been here over a year now... to begin with, it went into a tank that was 3-4 months old, so even if it was the only Aufwuchs eater in that tank ( which it wasn't ) it would have had to eat something other than Aufwuchs... algae & bio film, but I'm sure there was no micro fauna... my Gold Dust Pleco, has been here long enough, that it would have starved, if it was only eating Aufwuchs... but between what bio film, & the drift wood, where it spends the bulk of it's time, it's at least getting enough to survive... my goal here is to have everyone not just survive, but thrive... back to my Hillsteam loaches mentioned in my 1st post, all are growing, & seem to be thriving, only one out of 6 looks to not have grown much... & as mentioned, there are some really amazing Hillstream loaches out there, out of stock right now, I'm on a list, when some come in, I just want to be ready to have everyone thriving... so as much Aufwuchs as I can produce, should be a great help in supplementing their diet...

This one is well out of my price range, but they are available... & I think this is the top of the pile... but one would certainly need to be in the right Aufwuchs range to spend the money...



these are in stock at Dan's for 3 times the price they were listed at Aqua Imports, but with no pictures, & no info on the fish... Aqua has a lot of info on this fish in the link

I'm more looking at a Zebra, & a couple lizard Hillstream's, & or Saddled Hillstream's, but man! would a couple of those neon Hillstream's be nice...

You got me curious about Dans again. I have a number of the rarer plecos he now only has on his wish lists. Maybe I can help him out with that. I am trying to retire from most of my tanks this year.

I have never kept any of the hillstreams. *sigh* Limited space.....
Spend the money, you can't take it with you in the end.

MaloK said:

Bacter AE is a game changer. It takes about a week to kick-in. But now the shrimps are less interested in pellets and are grazing all around the tank. Also the babies have jumped growth in the last 2 weeks and the adults are showing beautiful colours and healthy shells.

I forgot to say, Copods and Scuds will be direct competition for food with your shrimps. If you have fishes that keep their population under control, it could be nice to have them though .

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MaloK do you use it per the instructions? I put some in when I change water, and I turn the filter off for a few minutes to let it settle in, but the amount to add per the instructions seems like a lot (and I'm already struggling to keep the nitrates down).

MuddyWaters said:

MaloK do you use it per the instructions? I put some in when I change water, and I turn the filter off for a few minutes to let it settle in, but the amount to add per the instructions seems like a lot (and I'm already struggling to keep the nitrates down).

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For the 2 last weeks I used it as instruction states, dosed the tank everyday, for 4 gallons of water with 0.041 gram soaked in water. while it seems not to be much it's still enough to cover the whole tank bottom and decor. I also stop filtration to let it settle.

My tank was already pretty clean and nitrogen are always 0/0/0 since the minicycle I when trough that was stabilized on the 23 jan. I'm due for 1/3 water change next week. I tested before posting and it's still 0/0/0.

And I sure overfed profusely. With 13 teenagers eating all day, loll. In 2 weeks they sprouted like magic beans. They are now very active and playfully wonder around the tank chasing each other and racing against the outflow of the filter, bothering the adults to the point they hide to have some peace. 2 of them are already reaching adult size and look like beautiful ladies. The trick is to have and maintain a never clogged pre-filter.

Srimps lift a lot of matter that they don't eat while foraging for food. All these uneaten particles end up quickly in the pre-filter and process an accelerated decomposition. Partly enhanced by Bacter AE and the abundance of oxygen flow because of the water circulation. Keeping it very clean helps having an higher oxygen level in the tank by removing the principal nitrate fueling matter at the same time.

MaloK said:

For the 2 last weeks I used it as instruction states, dosed the tank everyday, for 4 gallons of water with 0.041 gram soaked in water. while it seems not to be much it's still enough to cover the whole tank bottom and decor. I also stop filtration to let it settle.

My tank was already pretty clean and nitrogen are always 0/0/0 since the minicycle I when trough that was stabilized on the 23 jan. I'm due for 1/3 water change next week. I tested before posting and it's still 0/0/0.

And I sure overfed profusely. With 13 teenagers eating all day, loll. In 2 weeks they sprouted like magic beans. They are now very active and playfully wonder around the tank chasing each other and racing against the outflow of the filter, bothering the adults to the point they hide to have some peace. 2 of them are already reaching adult size and look like beautiful ladies. The trick is to have and maintain a never clogged pre-filter.

Srimps lift a lot of matter that they don't eat while foraging for food. All these uneaten particles end up quickly in the pre-filter and process an accelerated decomposition. Partly enhanced by Bacter AE and the abundance of oxygen flow because of the water circulation. Keeping it very clean helps having an higher oxygen level in the tank by removing the principal nitrate fueling matter at the same time.

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This is good news. I have a pretty big container of Bacter AE, especially if I only use it for water changes. I'm going to follow your lead.

On the "pre-filter" - what is that, like a sock around the filter intake or something? I have a 3 chamber filter. The first chamber is the intake and has a grate at the bottom and another at the top to take in water. Then the sponge/bio-media, then the return chamber. I typically vacuum a little on the bottom, then put the siphon in the intake chamber and shake the sponge filter which loosens some junk that gets sucked up. About once a month I will also siphon out the return chamber, as it gets gunk in it over time also.

I clean the 2 intake grates about every other time. I did have sponges behind the grates, worried about little shrimpies getting into the intake chamber, but I was thinking it stopped the flow and I wanted all the junk to get back there and get caught by the sponge.

Does that sound similar to what you have or do you do something additional?

MuddyWaters said:

This is good news. I have a pretty big container of Bacter AE, especially if I only use it for water changes. I'm going to follow your lead.

On the "pre-filter" - what is that, like a sock around the filter intake or something? I have a 3 chamber filter. The first chamber is the intake and has a grate at the bottom and another at the top to take in water. Then the sponge/bio-media, then the return chamber. I typically vacuum a little on the bottom, then put the siphon in the intake chamber and shake the sponge filter which loosens some junk that gets sucked up. About once a month I will also siphon out the return chamber, as it gets gunk in it over time also.

I clean the 2 intake grates about every other time. I did have sponges behind the grates, worried about little shrimpies getting into the intake chamber, but I was thinking it stopped the flow and I wanted all the junk to get back there and get caught by the sponge.

Does that sound similar to what you have or do you do something additional?

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What is the model of the filter you use ? If I see it I will understand, I don't like the socks thingy, they clog much too fast. I use one that is made for this purpose, my filter is an Aquaclear mini.

My filter is built in to the back of the tank. My sponge is pretty close to that picture, but it's a rectangular block with sections cut out for bio-media. It comes with bio-media and charcoal, but I put media in both of the sections cut in the sponge. Here's a diagram of how it works (it's a Fluval Flex 15):

MuddyWaters said:

My filter is built in to the back of the tank. My sponge is pretty close to that picture, but it's a rectangular block with sections cut out for bio-media. It comes with bio-media and charcoal, but I put media in both of the sections cut in the sponge. Here's a diagram of how it works (it's a Fluval Flex 15):

View attachment 337054

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Ok, now I see... it's very close to the Fluval Betta Premium Kit I have for Big.

I don't think pre-filtration is really necessary with these. But it is feasible. If your flow drops too fast and you are forced to pull out the whole thing often, it could be bothersome. But adding another sponge covering half the first compartment, could be easily removed rinsed and reinstalled. Without disturbing the principal compartment.

ex:

And the empty space at the bottom middle could be filled with plastic dish scrubbers to give more living surface to bacteria.


It's what I did with mine.

Fishmanic said:

I learned a new word today.
How to pronounce Aufwuchs (ala Elmer Fudd :)

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Hey, watch your language, mister.

I'm not a huge fan of the Gastromyzon species. I have one in my tank, and he's cute, but kind of looks like a little slug. The Sewellia are much more pleasing to look at, at least to my eye. I like some of the more fish-shaped ones, too, like the lizard loaches, but I've never tried them. Sewellia just have such an interesting body shape, and really cute eyes.

WhistlingBadger said:

Hey, watch your language, mister.

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You’re not a moderator wiseguy!