New 110l Tank.. stocking level suggestions.

Light is the single most important factor for live plants, and there are two aspects...intensity and spectrum. Aquatic plants, like terrestrial plants, have varying requirements when it comes to the light intensity so once we have the light determined, we only have to select plants suited to that light. You have two fluorescent tubes, and at the link you posted it says T8, so this sounds very good. Can you give me the length of the tubes, and the wattage? The wattage should be printed at one end of the tube. I use T8 fluorescent lighting so this data will help.

The spectrum is also important. Plants need red and blue wavelengths to drive photosynthesis, and adding green to the mix seems to improve things. The Kelvin (a number followed by a K) will tell me what you have, this also may be at the end of the tube (see if they are the same or different here) or on the instruction sheet or packaging. It is simple enough to buy new tubes to get the best spectrum if needed, depending what you now have.

Plants will grow in any substrate, the only problem being if it is for example large-grain sized gravel. But fine gravel (no larger than pea gravel) or sand works well. You do not need any so-called plant or enriched substrate. The substrate is more likely to affect fish; catfish like corys for instance should always have sand.

If you do decide on live plants, floating are always a wise addition as these are fast growing and the easiest, and being fast growing they use a lot of nutrients like the ammonia produced by fish. If you do have live plants, and especially floaters, I personally would not add any form of ammonia to "cycle" the tank, but let the plants deal with it. The bacterial supplement that came with the aquarium (according to that link) is fine to use once everything is running and you are ready for the first fish.

Byron.

Ok... You have convinced me. Am going to give plants a go.
After looking at pictures of tank set ups I like I think it is the only way I will have an aquarium that looks the way I want it to. I pick up the tank Saturday so will check the tubes then. The tank is 80cm and the tubes are almost the full length of the lid.

Have seen some plants that are growing on bits of wood or lava? Are they worth having? Thought they might be useful as they would be easier to move around whilst I get a handle on things... Not sure what is the best place to put the filter or heater yet etc..
 
Great :)

I would highly recommend to use plain and simple not colored quartz sand as substrate. It will make maintenance easier as there is nearly no need to vacuum any more. Furthermore it is better for many fish so you have more options for later.

The light you have will surely be good enough for some plants as it is especially designed for a tank. There is a great website about lighting in aquaristics. Unfurtunately it is in German. I don't know if a comparable website in english exists:

http://www.hereinspaziert.de/colors.htm
http://www.hereinspaziert.de/Sehlicht_2009/Vorwort.htm

Key take home messages and they are backed up with numbers etc.:

1) No need to exchange T8 or T5 lamps every year. Use them till they die and save yourself some bugs. (Yes they will lose a little output (about 10%) but its not enough to justify some early exchange)

2) Most "special" lamps (only talking about T8 and T5 here) are simply re-branded standard lamps. And the few lamps which indeed are different and are especially designed for aquaria are in practice still not significantly better than standard lamps (better spectrum but less light), meaning they are not worth the money at all either. So save and buy standard lamps if you need replacements.

Those plants which grow on top of other things are very worth having: Anubia, Java fern and Java moss.
Furthermore, they are also very easy plants which require not so much light. Other easy plants are Vallisneria, Cryptocoryne and some others. My approach always is to get as many different plant species as possible (of course only the easy ones :D). For to me unknown reasons under the given conditions some will drive and others not and I will then stick with those growing well. One more thing: Most beginners start with too few plants. Get as many as possible (I know it is also a cost factor, but maybe somebody here has to spare some). And don't forget those floating plants already mentioned by Byron. They have the additional effect of dimming to strong lighting and all fish love cover on the top. So your fish will be much more relaxed.
As soon as your plants start growing the only thing you usually have to worry about is removing excess :D

A very good addition even though many people don't like them are snails. Imho the best to have are any of the melania (not Clea helena!) and great ramshorn snails.

I very much love your idea with a platy only tank. They will use all the space of your tank from bottom to top. The only thing I would recommend is to start with a larger number (5-6 at least) as they will establish a hierarchy and can be a little "unfriendly" to each other (nothing to really worry about but still). So the larger the group the better aggression gets distributed.

Don't know about your set maybe the filter is already fixed, but usually one would try to hide any canister filter in one of the back corners. Some even have space to put the heater inside. If not put the heater somewhere in the current, so it will heat the whole tank and not only one corner.
 
Ok... You have convinced me. Am going to give plants a go.
After looking at pictures of tank set ups I like I think it is the only way I will have an aquarium that looks the way I want it to. I pick up the tank Saturday so will check the tubes then. The tank is 80cm and the tubes are almost the full length of the lid.

Have seen some plants that are growing on bits of wood or lava? Are they worth having? Thought they might be useful as they would be easier to move around whilst I get a handle on things... Not sure what is the best place to put the filter or heater yet etc..

Aquarium plants can be divided into four groups that I term substrate-rooted, non-substrate rooted (attached to wood, rock, etc), stem (these are usually stuck in the substrate but some also float nicely), and true floating.

Non-substrate rooted plants like moss, Anubias, and Java Fern are slower growing and thus need less intensity and nutrients. I have used these (attached to a chunk of wood or rock) to hide filter tubes and heaters. They tend to be best when you have a good cover of floating plants to reduce the light. I will attach a photo of my 33g Sri Lankan stream habitat, which has Java Fern attached to the wood on the left and right and a bit mid-tank. The floating plants are Water Sprite. [There is also an Aponogeton in the back whose very long leaves float on the surface, but that doesn't matter.] You can do a lot with Java Fern once it settles down.

Moss, commonly Java Moss, will spread over wood and sometimes rock very nicely once it takes hold. This often arrives on bits of aquarium wood.
 

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I am going to have to disagree with these statements (which I gather are from the linked website).

1) No need to exchange T8 or T5 lamps every year. Use them till they die and save yourself some bugs. (Yes they will lose a little output (about 10%) but its not enough to justify some early exchange)

Fluorescent tubes do lose intensity, and much faster than 10% over a year. T8 and T5 are different in their composition, but every planted tank source I have come across has recommended replacement of T5 as well as T8 long before the tubes actually burn out. I have experimented with T8 and I found that basic tubes (the less expensive but often suitable Daylight 6500K tubes like GE, Sylvania or Phillips) in 48-inch length need replacing no less than once every 12 months. The more expensive aquarium-specific tubes like the Hagen Life-Glo will go a bit longer, but in my case I found they had weakened sufficiently at 15 months the plants began to show it, and algae increased. The algae is a sure sign of weakening light, since it can make do with less light than higher plants.

I replace all my T8 tubes every 12 months. When the new tubes are turned on, there is a noticeable brighter light, and if I can see it, so can the plants even more.

2) Most "special" lamps (only talking about T8 and T5 here) are simply re-branded standard lamps. And the few lamps which indeed are different and are especially designed for aquaria are in practice still not significantly better than standard lamps (better spectrum but less light), meaning they are not worth the money at all either. So save and buy standard lamps if you need replacements.

This is partly true, but needs explaining, as it is not universal. It is certainly true that "aquarium" or "plant" tubes sold in fish stores are often weaker intensity, and can cause issues for plants and increase algae. But this is not the case with all aquarium store tubes, if you know what you are getting.

Over my larger tanks that take two 48-inch tubes, I use the less expensive Daylight tubes from Home Depot. Phillips and Sylvania both make a Daylight 6500K and a slightly warmer 5000K tube. This combo is ideal, as it is high in the red, blue and green wavelengths. And the 48-inch tubes are good value. I have tried the smaller tubes and they did not work at all, due to the intensity being too little by comparison.

Over m,y smaller tanks using a single T8 tube, I use a Life-Glo 6700K. This tube is twice the intensity of the Aqua-Glo in the same line, due to the phosphors. The Life-Glo is without question the best single tube in T8 for smaller tanks. Another identical is ZooMed's UltraSun at 6500K. There may be others, these are the only two brands I have found locally to try, and I will use either over my smaller tanks.

When a Life-Glo 6700K 24-inch was compared to a Phillips Daylight 6500K 24-inch over the same tank (each for several months) the plants began to die under the Phillips. There is no question that the intensity of the Life-Glo is much higher.

The spectrum of lighting is very important for planted tanks. Mid-day sun is somewhere around 6000K, so lighting in the 5000K to 7000K range should work best. This lighting also delivers a true colour rendition of plants and fish.

Byron.
 
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Love the setup of your tank Byron.... Especially like the leaves on the bottom. Stunning.

Attached is a photo of the kind of thing I would like to achieve.. But with plates, and the addition of some floating plants...
 
You should have no problem replicating either of those. We will need to sort out the light and different tubes may be needed but that is easily solved.
 
Have seen some plants that are growing on bits of wood or lava?
Anubias

You will have to try hard to kill Anubias. I use a drop of superglue to attach them to bits of wood or rock.

You could also try Crypts ( Cryptocoryne Wendtii ).

For floating plants, Water sprite is great these things grow like mad and the roots also look cool hanging in the water.

Have a look at this all low light low maintenance and should work well with the lighting you already have.
http://www.fishforums.net/threads/betta-being-a-betta.442007/page-3#post-3752825
 
This time tomorrow I will have my new tank back at home and filled with water. Can I put plants in straight away? (once i have dechlorinated the water, set the filter and heater up of course).

I will post details of the light tubes once I get home, but i think i know what to look for now and will see what replacement tubes they have in store too.

These are the plants that they have available at the moment. They get fresh ones every Friday ready for the weekend, so there should be a good choice.

Can you see anything there I should avoid?

I am soooo excited! Really can't wait to pick everything up! Am going to go with sand as I do quite fancy some corys at some point. saw some lovely false julii ones the other day.. they only grow to 3cm so a little school of those would be perfect... just need to check they can handle my water hardness first.... for the first year or so I will stick to Platies however. Learn what I am doing one fish at a time!
 

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This time tomorrow I will have my new tank back at home and filled with water. Can I put plants in straight away? (once i have dechlorinated the water, set the filter and heater up of course).

Yes. With live plants, I would not do any artificial cycling by adding ammonia, this can kill the plants if you do it wrong, so best to avoid the risk. Plants need nitrogen, and most aquatic plants (including those we have been discussing so far) prefer ammonia/ammonium so they take up a lot of it. Floating plants especially, which is why they are so helpful in new tanks.

I will post details of the light tubes once I get home, but i think i know what to look for now and will see what replacement tubes they have in store too.

I had been waiting for the data, but I will be off-line in a bit until tomorrow, so wanted to comment on this before you buy anything. The tubes will be less than 48 inches, so I find the "general" tubes I mentioned earlier do not work, it takes aquarium-designed tubes. You want those with a Kelvin between 5000K and 7000K, preferably around 6500K. In these sizes I have used the ZooMed UltraSun or Hagen's Life-Glo, on their own (two of them, whichever) or one of either in combo with ZooMed's TropicSun. The latter adds a bit of yellow to warm the colour. Avoid the others in either line, they are just not as good, and they can turn the tank purplish.

You mention sand, good choice, but never white. This is detrimental to fish, less so with platies than the soft water forest fish, but still something to avoid. Cories will also feel more relaxed over non-white sand. Aquarium sand is very expensive, so you can use play sand. I have Quikrete Play Sand from Home Depot (Lowe's also carry this) in all my 8 tanks.

As for the plants in the photo. On the very far left the large plant is Amazon Sword. This is a lovely plant, I have dozens of them (daughter plants off the original parents). I would say one for your tank, they do get large.

The other plants I cannot make out very well, nor read the tags...but though the red leaf ones look nice, they are likely to turn to mush. Red-leaf plants are high light and high nutrient because they reflect red light (which is why they appear red, just as green plants reflect green light to appear green) and as red is necessary for photosynthesis, this means there must be even more red light. Stem plants in general also need more light; pennywort is one exception that I have found does quite well with my moderate light (which will be what you will have) and is also a nice floating plant. On the far right there seems to be a crypt, the dark leaf plant, that should be fine. Maybe three of these; they are slow to establish. Plants do best as one or three or more, not two, because they appear more natural.

Byron.
 
so.... went to get my 110litre tank... came back with the next size up of the same model tank... so now have 160 litres!!!

Will set it up in a bit and post pics/ lighting data etc....

The thing is... now I have a bigger tank I am thinking maybe i should reconsider what fish to have. My husband looked around the fish shop and declared he would like to have a couple larger sized fish too.. (this is my christmas present!! )... just wondered what other options there are for my moderately hard watered tank that might be a little bigger.. would still like some platys too though...

If you all had 160l tank with moderately hard water.. what would you put in it?

I also managed to get some nice plants. .. two dark leaf cryptos and one lighter leafed one... an amazon... a few java mosses.... and another one i cant remeber the name of just yet.. will need more plants I know.. but thought they would be ok to start with...
 
The new tank!
Still trying to find the details of the fluorescent tubes... they are listed as
30watt tropical daylight lamps and are made by Interpet. Can't see anything written on them that list the Kelvins.

So... here is my tank... it measures 100cm x 40cm x 50cm high.
160 litres...

I haven't taken the plants out of their baskets yet.. will do it tomorrow once I am happy with where I want them.. will need to get some more and the one at the back on the right will need planting onto some bogwood... It is a Microsorium Pteropus?

The Tank.jpg
Tank left.jpg
Tank Right.jpg
 
Yes, leave the plants that are potted in the pots. It is easy to move them around until you decide, then you can unpot them, removing as much of the rock wool (careful not to break off many roots) as you can but a bit is OK.

And yes, that is Java Fern in the right rear. Attach the rhizome to wood, you can use black cotton thread or fishing line, just a couple pieces. The fine roots will slowly attach to the wood.

On the light, I can tell from the photos it is not sufficient. Don't fret, I have never yet been able to use the cheap tubes that come with tank units. Measure the length of the tubes...I am guessing from the wattage (being T8) they are probably 3 feet (60 cm roughly), but measure them end to end to see, then look for the tubes I mentioned previously in that same length (in T8, T5 will be available too but they won't fit). The ZooMed UltraSun and TropicSun combo, or if no ZooMed but Hagen, the Life-Glo.

Looking nice. Take a few days to work out this and that with the aquascape.

You mentioned larger fish previously...this needs careful consideration as larger fish have issues.

Byron.
 
Good news!! Just tested the water and the KH reading is only 10... so a little lower than intially thought based on the local water authority prediction. So once the tank has matured I will definitely be getting a little school of False Julii Cories :)... Have convinced my hubby that we a tank full of lots of little fish will look fine and that we dont need anything bigger.. so will be getting my first group of male Platies at the end of the week.

I am planning on 6 Cories and 14 Platies... starting with a group of 5-6... LFS has a really varied selection of colours at the moment so should be able to get a nice colourful little group. I have got some aquarium salt in anticipation of getting the Platies.. do you know if the Cories would be ok with it too?

Had a minor set back with the heater as the first one was faulty... it would only work for two minutes then shut off for 20mins... resulting in water that never actually heated up. Thankfully my LFS swapped it for another one with no fuss at all and (touch wood).. the new one seems to be working fine.. and the tank has maintained a steady temp of 26'c all afternoon.. going to see what temp drops to overnight without the lights on and then try and decide on what temp to run the tank at!

Hoping the shop will have some Anubis in next week too that I can add to my planting. Have just ordered a log tunnel to run at the back of my tank and that I can attach the Java Fern on top of.. that way the Cories will have somewhere nice and shady to hide and it wil make it easier for all the fish to swim around the whole tank.

Will order the new light tubes... do i need to order one of each of the Zoomed tubes? If so... which one goes at the front/back? How often do I need to add fertilizer or some form of CO2 to the tank for the plants? Would an airstone be beneficial ?

Can't wait to get my new fishy friends!
 
I am planning on 6 Cories and 14 Platies... starting with a group of 5-6... LFS has a really varied selection of colours at the moment so should be able to get a nice colourful little group. I have got some aquarium salt in anticipation of getting the Platies.. do you know if the Cories would be ok with it too?

No, freshwater fish do not need salt ever, except when used as a treatment for some disease. But absolutely not on a regular basis. Salt does nothing beneficial in small doses, and quite the opposite. Soft water fish in particular (and corys are such) will have serious consequences with any salt. Some plants have difficulty too. You can read why no salt in my article on salt here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/SaltArtHosking.htm

Will order the new light tubes... do i need to order one of each of the Zoomed tubes? If so... which one goes at the front/back? How often do I need to add fertilizer or some form of CO2 to the tank for the plants? Would an airstone be beneficial ?

Both tubes can be the same or mixed; the ZooMed UltraSun is 6500K, the Life-Glo is 6700K which is basically the same. The "K" is the colour temperature (nothing to do with water temperature) and the lower the number the "warmer" the light and the higher the "cooler." The nice thing with two tubes is being able to mix the spectrum, and by having one a ZooMed TropicSun which is 5500K and one the UltraSun which is 6500K it is the closest to mid-day sun, so plants respond well. I have this on my dual-tube tanks; with just one tube, the 6500K is better. I assume the tubes are parallel, side by side, so doesn't matter which is which. I tend to put the warmer tube (TropicSun) at the front but it really doesn't matter.

You won't need CO2 here. Natural CO2 will occur from the respiration of fish, plants and some types of bacteria, but primarily from the breakdown of organics by bacteria in the substrate. This obviosly increases as the tank ages, but I have never had initial CO2 issues.

As for other nutrient supplementation, that depends upon the plant species (some need more "food" than others), the GH, and the fish load and feeding. Initially a comprehensive liquid supplement is best. Seachem's Flourish Comprehensive Supplement is one; make sure it is exactly this, they make several different products in the Flourish line. Flourish Tabs are beneficial for large substrate-rooted plants like the swords.

There should be sufficient surface disturbance from the filter to deal with gas exchange. Too much can drive CO2 out faster than the plants can use it, but some movement near the filter is a good idea.

Byron.
 

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