WTF.......ICK????

[becky412]

Hello all, I have a 55 gallon aquarium that I have been cycling since July 12th. I had 7 feeder goldfish in it the aquarium to help with the ammonia load. On 7/23 I acquired a used filter cartridge to help with adding beneficial bacteria into my aquarium. On July 25th the tank went to zero ammonia, zero nitrites and 10 nitrates. I have continued to monitor this aquarium daily, doing 10-15% water changes as needed when the nitrates start creeping up to 30ppm. Knowing that I was going to order angels for this tank, I purchased a 2nd hand tank (36g) to move the goldfish to until I can find a home for them. I cleaned it out really good with vinegar, let it sit outside in the sun for several days. I set it up and started the cycling process on that aquarium on 7/31 and then moved 5 of the smaller fish over to that one and left the larger goldfish and one small one in the 55g. All was going well, daily water parameter checks being done on both tanks.

Last night I noticed the largest gold fish (about 2.5-3 inches) zooming back and forth in the 55g tank. I thought it strange but when I looked at him, all looked fine. All fish are eating and, except for this larger one, all are acting normally. This morning I turn on the light and WTF!!!!! The large fish has white spots all over fins and tail and also the smaller one. I immediately turned on the light on the other aquarium where the other fish are being held and they ALSO have the white spots on them. I have treated both tanks with API super ick cure. So, my question is WTF!!!!! How is it that after this period of time and no additon of any other fish did this happen? My friend's fish, where I got the filter cartridge from, all are visibly healthy and no white spots at all. The only common denominator is that I move the used filter cartridge over to the 36g. Could that have been the culprit?

So, can someone please inform we how this can happen? Here are my parameters:

Tank 1 - 55 gallon - pH 7.2, ammonia 0.5 (not sure why it has spiked), nitrites 0, nitrates 20-30, kH 35.8ppm, gH 53.7ppm.
Tank 2 - 36 gallon - pH 7.6, ammonia 0.25, nitrites - 0, nitrates 5.0, kH 35.8ppm, gH 35.8ppm

 

[Colin_T]

Are you sure it's white spot?
Can you post some pictures so we can confirm it is?

It is possible some white spot parasites got transferred into your tank from an outside source. If the aquarium is unheated, the parasites won't grow & breed as quickly and it can take several weeks before any fish show symptoms. Even if the aquarium is heated, it can take a few weeks for 1 white spot parasite to turn into hundreds and infect the fish.

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You don't need to cycle the new tank, just take half the filter media from the established tank and put it in the new tank's filter. Instant cycled aquarium.

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Small water changes are useless when it comes to diluting things in the water. You are better off doing a bigger water change (at least 50%) to dilute things more effectively.

If you do a 25% water change, you leave behind 75% of the bad stuff in the water.
If you do a 50% water change, leave behind 50% of the bad stuff in the water.
If you do a 75% water change, you leave behind 25% of the bad stuff in the water.

 

[becky412]

Here is pick of smaller fish. Bigger fish is camera shy but will continue trying

 

[GaryE]

Hmmmm. July 12 to August 1 is a hair over 3 weeks - not very long but longer than is usual with Ich. The cycle it lives in is well shorter than that, but it may have kept a toehold and not taken off. It's why 3 weeks is the bare minimum quarantine. Maybe the parasite was in the gills of a fish, or unnoticed. Conditions may not have been to its liking (it is a living creature), but a cyst may have burst and flooded the tank with freeswimmers. If you accidentally transferred water in that time, it could have harboured the parasites.

There is a different parasite sometimes called "neo-Ich" that has a slower life cycle and doesn't have a freeswimming stage (which makes it hard to treat and often fatal in spite of things that work on Ich). It looks like Ich. I hope it isn't that.

 

[becky412]

Ok, here is bigger fish in 55g

 

[jaylach]

Even if the source tank seems OK the problem MAY have come with the established filter media.

 

[becky412]

Yeah, that us what I am thinking........

 

[jaylach]

Yeah, that us what I am thinking........

You have to consider stress. Seems that you have been moving the fish around so they would naturally be stressed. A stressed fish is much more likly to get any illness whether it be bacterial, fungal or parasitic. This could possibly explain why your fish were affected while the source tank seems to be not.

 

[Alice B]

stress does not introduce parasites. It may make the fish more vulnerable but in a brand new tank that either came in on a goldfish or on the used media, I don't have a good treatment for the current ich or neo ich. I got one of them in January 2020 with some tetras from a small petshop that uses no meds and imports from southeast asia. And only one group of fish exposed to them did not die of the ich or neo ich. I ended up bleaching my tanks. The one group that didn't die of ich darn near died of my treatment.

 

[becky412]

I have only moved these fish once since buying them almost 3 weeks ago. I put all 7 of them in 55g and I only moved 5 if them 2 days ago into the 36g in anticipation of stocking the 55g with angels soon.....which now is on serious hold. Otherwise their little lives has been stable. Even if I did water changes, i was careful not to upset their world and they did not show signs of stress during the water changes.

 

[jaylach]

I have only moved these fish once since buying them almost 3 weeks ago. I put all 7 of them in 55g and I only moved 5 if them 2 days ago into the 36g in anticipation of stocking the 55g with angels soon.....which now is on serious hold. Otherwise their little lives has been stable. Even if I did water changes, i was careful not to upset their world and they did not show signs of stress during the water changes.

But that actually means two or three changes

1) The fish getting to the store and tanked. Of course there is not a feasible way to know the length of time between this and your getting them.

2) Your getting the fish and putting them in the initial tank is another change.

3) Moving 5 to another tank in less than 3 weeks is another move. Even the 2 left in the initial would experience stress while you were catching the others.

This is a lot of stress put on the critters.

stress does not introduce parasites. It may make the fish more vulnerable but in a brand new tank that either came in on a goldfish or on the used media, I don't have a good treatment for the current ich or neo ich. I got one of them in January 2020 with some tetras from a small petshop that uses no meds and imports from southeast asia. And only one group of fish exposed to them did not die of the ich or neo ich. I ended up bleaching my tanks. The one group that didn't die of ich darn near died of my treatment.

Granted in that stress does not introduce parasites but I would think a stressed fish would be more likely to not be able to resist a parasite...

 

[Colin_T]

Looks like white spot so keep treating.

 

[becky412]

So good news is Ich is subsiding. In 36g I see no spots on anyone. In 55g, I see spots subsiding on larger goldfish, small one in there no spots. I am using API Super Ich Cure and dosed to tank size, right or wrong, not the estimated amount of water and everyone has survived.

So, questions -

1) are water changes necessary and if so how much.
2) suggested time of treating tank before the all clear can be assumed
3) should I change out my sponges, ceramic rings and biohome out of both cannisters

Athough I have read the bottle directions and it states a water change, I have heard that sometimes the labels/companies are conservative on their instructions. In fact, it states that you should dose and then wait 48 hours to dose again. Right or wrong, I did a 1/2 dose for each tank the next day and it seems to have kicked it in the keester. I am assuming that since you have to redose in 48 hours, then the potency of the medication in the water has dropped significantly to be theraputic.

Thanks