What's wrong with swimmy?

[AL_G]

Can anyone tell me what's wrong with this fish? I noticed a problem with this fish so i've taken him out of the pond and hes in the hosptial tank. I gave it some treatment for ulsers (as that's what i thought it was) but now it's so bad he's lost his eye, he's been like this for a couple of weeks now. All the other fish in the pond are very healthy and have been for a while. Is it in the fishes best interest to put it out of it's misery?

 

[black angel]

Eeep, poor fish.

It could have been lost in a fight and an infection has set in. If you can keep him in isolation then you can use salt to gently clean the area and hopefully kill off any infection. Add 1 teapoon per gallon and then again 12 hours later. Keep the water in really good condition and re add the salt you take out in water changes. Hopefully he will get over it and fish can still manage with one eye.
Can you get a spare filter and air stone to help while he recuperates?

 

[AL_G]

Eeep, poor fish.

It could have been lost in a fight and an infection has set in. If you can keep him in isolation then you can use salt to gently clean the area and hopefully kill off any infection. Add 1 teapoon per gallon and then again 12 hours later. Keep the water in really good condition and re add the salt you take out in water changes. Hopefully he will get over it and fish can still manage with one eye.
Can you get a spare filter and air stone to help while he recuperates?

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I have added salt to the container he is in and changed the water periodically. Thing is i don't want to add him back to the pond unless i'm certain it's not something he's going to spread. We had a few fish die from similar looking infections after a heron attack a while back which i guess introduced new disease to the pond Prob is i don't have any spare pump or filter so this poor little guy is living in a water butt right now. The infection started off as a red eye/gills then the eye looked like it was popping out now it looks like the picture.

 

[ncstater1919]

Thats so sad Part of me would liek to put it out of its misery,and another part of me says no you can't you have to give it a chance! please update as soon as you can

 

[black angel]

To be honest i dont know what happening but if the infection eats away any more of the head then i would seriously think about putting it to sleep.
Maybe it got jabbed by the herons beak which punctured somewhere near the eye letting bacteria in.

 

[GuppyDude]

you could try takeing the fish out of water and gently dripping somy hydrogen paroxide on his wounds, that will kill the bacteria, but at this point he is pretty bad. i would not blame you for putting him down, but if he's lasted this long he may have a good chance of survival.

 

[ncstater1919]

Just saying he/she is a beatiful goldfish

 

[RandomWiktor]

Many different things can cause ulcerations like that, but I think that the animal is probably suffering and will not recuperate well. My advice would be scooping him into a container that is about 1/2 full of water from his tank. Then take an equal amount of water to that which he is in, add a good lot of clove oil, shake vigorously, and pour into the container he is in. Let him sit in it for a few hours - until you know he is DEFINATELY dead - then freeze him just to be extra sure. It is the most humane thing you can do for him at this point.

 

[AL_G]

Many different things can cause ulcerations like that, but I think that the animal is probably suffering and will not recuperate well. My advice would be scooping him into a container that is about 1/2 full of water from his tank. Then take an equal amount of water to that which he is in, add a good lot of clove oil, shake vigorously, and pour into the container he is in. Let him sit in it for a few hours - until you know he is DEFINATELY dead - then freeze him just to be extra sure. It is the most humane thing you can do for him at this point.

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So poisoning and freezing to death is the best way? Is it not more humane to simply cut it's head off or something? I may leave it a few more days and and monitor it's progress, my biggest concern is that it may be contagious and i don't wanna put it back in the pond and make all the other fish sick as they're all doing really well right now. Maybe i'll get a goldfish bowl, bring him indoors for a while and buy him a friend when he looks better? Really don't know what to do for the best.

 

[black angel]

Please dont put him in a bowl, get him a 20 gallon rubbermaid and a filter and im sure he will be fine in that.
If you can bring yourself to cut his head off then that is the quickest way.

 

[AL_G]

Please dont put him in a bowl, get him a 20 gallon rubbermaid and a filter and im sure he will be fine in that.
If you can bring yourself to cut his head off then that is the quickest way.

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Ok, forget the bowl idea. What i'll do is get another tank (which i'll keep outside in the shed) that i can use for my pond fish when they get poorly. Got to be better than the water butt i currently have him in

If i do have to put him out of his misery I just wanna do the best for the animal. If it were me, i'd want the quickest, most painless way out possible.

Thanks for all your advice peeps

 

[pica_nuttalli]

euthenasia with clove oil is similar to putting a cat or dog to sleep with anesthetic. if its too painful to cut off its head, clove oil is the way to go. RandomWiktor is one of the most "obsessively" humane people on this board; you can rely on her suggestions to be cruelty free. (sorry about the o-word, Random. i'm having synonym issues today.)

 

[black angel]

I believe to put a fish to sleep for doing operations is around 5 drops per gallon and for euthenising it is 12 drops per gallon.
Never had to do either but it comes from a good source.

 

[RandomWiktor]

Thank you, pica (I think )

Clove oil is not "poisoning" by any stretch of the immagination. It contains an element that anesthetizes the fish, meaning that it "falls to sleep" almost instantly (the higher the dose the faster), sortof like using ket/val on dogs and cats going in to surgery. However, just like any anesthetic, if you overdose, the animal will die. The reason I suggested freezing afterwords is that, if you put too little of a dose, there is a chance of the animal recovering. By freezing it while it is still anesthetized (and hopefully dead!), you offset the chance of it ever waking up again, and freeze when it is insensitive to pain rather than when it is still responsive. I did this with my own goldfish, and he barely swam an inch before his gill movement halted entirely and he was completely unresponsive to his surroundings; no signs of life. In less than an hour, his eyes were glazed and his slime coat had shed, so he could definately be considered officially deceased. It was an extremely fast "knock out," and probably an almost instant death; and even if it did take the hour to pass on, the animal was not feeling anything.

Cutting off the head is only humane if you also destroy the brain; being cold blooded animals, fish and reptiles can survive long enough with thier head cut off to be in agonizing pain, as it takes them longer to suffocate than warm-blooded animals. There have been numerous accounts of snakes in particular living for hours after being decapitated. So, if you would rather cut off the head (though I think my suggestion is perfectly humane...), you need to insert something into the skull and "scramble" the brains immediately, to ensure that the animal doesn't live for a while after being decapitated.

 

[AL_G]

Thank you, pica (I think )

Clove oil is not "poisoning" by any stretch of the immagination. It contains an element that anesthetizes the fish, meaning that it "falls to sleep" almost instantly (the higher the dose the faster), sortof like using ket/val on dogs and cats going in to surgery. However, just like any anesthetic, if you overdose, the animal will die. The reason I suggested freezing afterwords is that, if you put too little of a dose, there is a chance of the animal recovering. By freezing it while it is still anesthetized (and hopefully dead!), you offset the chance of it ever waking up again, and freeze when it is insensitive to pain rather than when it is still responsive. I did this with my own goldfish, and he barely swam an inch before his gill movement halted entirely and he was completely unresponsive to his surroundings; no signs of life. In less than an hour, his eyes were glazed and his slime coat had shed, so he could definately be considered officially deceased. It was an extremely fast "knock out," and probably an almost instant death; and even if it did take the hour to pass on, the animal was not feeling anything.

Cutting off the head is only humane if you also destroy the brain; being cold blooded animals, fish and reptiles can survive long enough with thier head cut off to be in agonizing pain, as it takes them longer to suffocate than warm-blooded animals. There have been numerous accounts of snakes in particular living for hours after being decapitated. So, if you would rather cut off the head (though I think my suggestion is perfectly humane...), you need to insert something into the skull and "scramble" the brains immediately, to ensure that the animal doesn't live for a while after being decapitated.

So it looks like clove oil is the way to do it? Just gotta find somewhere that sells it? Poor swimmy isn't looking any better (or worse) I guess he's about as good as he's going to get which is sad and although i have no idea if he's suffering or not i think i'll have to do the deed so to speak. Thanks for all your advice.