What Have I done?

[paleprincess]

I have done the most stupidist thing, I am a complete novice at this ...
Me and my ex bought a 3 ft tank set up for our son, we let it cycle, the water levels were tested at the LFS, they said it was fine, then I went and bought some rock last week, and my ex bought 10 new fishes(plec, 2 kribs,2 swordtails,4 mollies, catfish) to add to the four guppies that had been in previously.Female swordtail died this morning. LFS did a test today, it was off the scale!! He said he didn't know how the fish had survived such a high ammonia level, he advised on alternate day water changes (%25), and to not feed them for a few days, and to go again during the week to get another test.
My ex came around and noticed something terrible, i have accidentally dislodged the filter(I use a UGF), when I bought the rock, I have somehow knocked it out from the hole the tube was in, and basically for a week, they have had no filtration whatsoever!Luckily because I noticed quite a lot of poo in the water, I have been doing little water changes every alternate day anyway, thank god .
So, my ex took over, emptied the tank, kept the fish in a big bucket I have, condemned the stones which he said were tufa rock, which he said was too porous and crumbley, and basically done a complete water change and redone my filter and partially cleaned the gravel.
I told him to not do this as it would wipe away any bacteria and the tank would have to start from scratch again, he wouldn't listen.
Now the tank is filtering beautifully, but because of new tank syndrome, my plec has now died aswell.
I am doing %20 water changes as directed by LFS, and not feeding them, is their anything else I can do to help the tank cycle quicker.

 

[Mamaschild]

Well, the first thing you need to do is go buy yourself a test kit. You will need to be able to test Ammonia, NitrItes and NitrAtes to see how your cycle is going, as well as Ph. Being able to test the Gh and Kh is helpful in many cases, as well. After your Ammonia and NitrIte readings peak and drop back to 0, the Nitrates will be present. This is normal and exactly what you want your tests to show.

How did you cycle the tank? How long? How did you test to see if the cycle was complete? Or did you go by the LFS saying the test results were "Fine".

Just a note, Your choice of fish is Ok with the exception of the Mollies. They need salt in their water, but the rest really do not. Mollies are Brackish (at least most of them are) and the others are all Freshwater.....may want to rethink that. Some Mollies will be fine, others will not.

Also, for a 3' tank, I wouldn't use an Undergravel filter. They really are more hassle then they are worth. Do your self a favor and get a Hang-on-back or canister filter. Much easier to work with and keep clean.

HTH

 

[paleprincess]

I cycled the tank for just over a month with stuff from my friends tank, which they've had for a year now.
If I get a new hang-on filter, do I have to remove all the gravel and take out the UGF , or can I use them both simultaneously?
Going to buy a kit tomorrow.
Thanks.

 

[lgreenmk]

Not sure what you have in the UK, but there are also products that I have had success with that help "cycle" your tank. Specifically, I have used a product called Cycle. It might be something to consider since you still have some fish in there.

Good luck and keep us posted.

 

[rsz]

my filter broke down i didnt notice at first, so i think my fish went without filtration for a week too . only i didnt get any deaths i did little water changes daily to clear the water

 

[Mamaschild]

Ok, the way you cycled (if I'm reading it right) is fine, but did you have fish in there while you were doing it? If not, the bacteria you put in from your friends tank simply died off during that month. Still need to know how you knew your tank was cycled, however. It may not have been...... Do you have a test kit? I figured from your first post that you didn't, but didn't ask )

For the UGF, remove it. They are poop traps. All the "STUFF" will get trapped under it and you have to remove it every 6 months or so to clean it out. That's even more of a hassle then pulling it out now. Try to get a HOB with a biowheel or internal sponge (or a canister with the sponges inside) that will house the bacteria even when you replace the filters.

 

[semper fi]

ugf's are out of date with all the other filters that they have on the market. they trap the waste underneath it and ammonia levels can rise. when doing water changes get a smaller hose and remove the lift tubes one at a time. suck out the gunk and replace the lift tube. still will not remove all of it, but will do some. you can remove the ugf without taking out too much of the gravel. you have to disconnect the ugf and raise the plates not letting the gravel come out of the water. suck out the gunk that is under there as much as you can and slide out the ugf. would put the fish in a seperate bucket while you do this.

if your tank was cycled, what you probably did was crash the tank by adding that many fish at a time. the ammonia levels would be off the charts. fish in a newly cycled tank should be added slowly to allow the bacteria colony to reproduce to handle the increase in the bio load. adding that many fish at one time on a newly cycled tank is a big nono. fish should be added slowly even on established tanks. one or two every three or four days.

 

[paleprincess]

Still need to know how you knew your tank was cycled,

My LFS offers a free testing service. After cycling the tank for several weeks I took a sample down , they gave me the all clear. I originally only bought two guppies, and then was given two kribs from a freinds father.
It was my ex who came around with ten fish he'd bought for our son the week later, it was my mistake of knocking out the filter tube by putting in new rocks which dislodged it. I am buying a testing kit tomorrow, subsequently.
####
"you can remove the ugf without taking out too much of the gravel. you have to disconnect the ugf and raise the plates not letting the gravel come out of the water. suck out the gunk that is under there as much as you can and slide out the ugf. "
I am a little confused about this. Do you mean , just lift up the plate with the gravel on top of it?Wouldn't that be heavy. Why not let gravel come out of water?And if I am replacing the UGF for another filter, why bother sucking the gunk from underneath it?
Sorry for so many questions, but
a) I'm a girl
b)My ex, despite having kept fish for years knows absolutely nothing so I'm doing this all on my own

 

[semper fi]

it will be heavy but you do not want to lose any of the bacteria that is living in the gravel. that is why you do not want it to come out of the water. you also do not want to have to empty the entire tank and start out fresh. if you try sucking out the debris through the gravel you will also lose some of the bacteria. leaving the plates in will just continue to keep debris trapped and decaying in your tank. this will cause your ammonia levels to raise also.

when i removed the ugf from an 85 i broke it. did not really care but always had problems with the tank before that. now the tank is perfect and i do less frequent water changes on it.

having your own test kit is also a valuable tool in maintaining your tank. counting on the lfs is unreliable. they are not always open or convenient. i check my water in my tanks every morning or any time there is a problem with them.

take a flashlight and look at the underside of your plates of the ugf. you will be amazed at the amount of debris there is in the tank.

 

[Lithril]

Paleprincess if its any help there is a really good website Aquatics Warehouse they're also Eheim specialists, you can be an ehiem canister filter (highly recommended) for a 22 (UK) gal tank for 45 pounds and I think the next one up is 54 pounds that includes all the pipes fittings and media - personally I don't think you can beat the filters.

Totally agree on the need for testkits I wouldn't be without mine and if you want to make life really easy get a liquid based kit.

Does anyone you know have a tank set up that you could nab a couple of sponges from them to put into the filter to get it seeded?? (Assuming you get a canister filter?)

 

[paleprincess]

it will be heavy but you do not want to lose any of the bacteria that is living in the gravel. that is why you do not want it to come out of the water. you also do not want to have to empty the entire tank and start out fresh. if you try sucking out the debris through the gravel you will also lose some of the bacteria. leaving the plates in will just continue to keep debris trapped and decaying in your tank. this will cause your ammonia levels to raise also.

when i removed the ugf from an 85 i broke it. did not really care but always had problems with the tank before that. now the tank is perfect and i do less frequent water changes on it.

having your own test kit is also a valuable tool in maintaining your tank. counting on the lfs is unreliable. they are not always open or convenient. i check my water in my tanks every morning or any time there is a problem with them.

take a flashlight and look at the underside of your plates of the ugf. you will be amazed at the amount of debris there is in the tank.

But my ex cleaned the ugf and the gravel three days ago( I know he shoudn't have), so It wouldn't have lots of gunk would it not?
So, if i am taking the ugf out, just basically try to pull it out from under the gravel, and if there is any gunk underneath the filter, this is to be thrown away, or is it full of helfull beacteria?
Wouldn't there be lots of stuff then floating around in the water?Will the new filter get rid of this, or would it harm the fish to put them back in cloudy water?

 

[Lithril]

A new filter will clean any debris out of the water in a couple of hours, what you MAY find is that you can a white cloud formed which would be a bacterial bloom, this shouldn't hurt the fish except by taking up lots of oxygen (make sure you've got plenty of surface movement from either a spray bar on your filter or an airstone).