weird nitrite levels & fish won’t eat

[jennaa]

i’m new here so im not really sure if anyone will see this but i’ll give it a shot…
Alright so my betta won’t eat. She actually hasn’t eaten in 9 days !! here’s a little back story…

I got her about almost a month ago BUT i just learned about cycling my tank right after i got her bc the stupid petco employee said i only have to cycle my tank for 24 hours. ANYWAY, i bought the api test kit & tested for everything, & it said i had .50ppm ammonia but everything else was perfect. my fish was fine & she was eating & everything. i did a 50% water change & i eventually got my ammonia down to 0, so everything at this point is down to 0. I then got 4 ghost shrimp bc i thought it was safe & i fed them shrimp wafers. i accidentally fell asleep & left the wafer in the water all night. they all died & i read that it was normal for them to die when added to a new tank, i then added 7 more & they died too i took them out but it took me a while to find all of them. at this point she stopped eating so i tested the water again & my ammonia was 0, but my nitrite was 1.0ppm. i was freaking out !! so i did almost 100% water change, & it lowered it down to .50ppm. i’ve been changing my water constantly for about a week & a half now & she still won’t eat, my nitrites lowered, but they’re like a darker blue instead of purple, like in between 0 & .25ppm. my ammonia is at .25ppm again but my water is cloudy from too many water changes, should i keep doing them anyway until my ammonia & nitrites lower ?? idk what to do, i’ve tried everything !! i even tried feeding her dried tubifex worms, dried bloodworms & even frozen baby brine shrimp. i’ve been using seachem prime & stability & there’s a slight difference but still not at 0. i have a 10 gallon tank & have a Aqueon submersible aquarium heater & my aquarium is at 78 degrees Fahrenheit. I also have a MF10 internal TopFin filter, which i don’t know how to clean so i’ve been cleaning the spray bar (with aquarium water so i don’t ruin my beneficial bacteria). please help me. it’s been going on for too long now & im worried for my betta

 

[GaryE]

You lost control of the environment there. Now you need to step back and reduce to 25-30% water changes twice a week. In time, once a week.
Since you have a kit, test your tap. You're in the middle of the continent, and a lot of people in your region have pretty bad water.

Ghost shrimp die like flies. Bettas kill them too.

Slow on the feeding, add no more shrimp (Bettas have no friends, and like it that way). Start feeding sparingly in 3-4 days, and watch how the fish responds. Bettas are obligatory air breathers and handle ammonia much better than most other tropical fish do. They need clean water, and stability.

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

Try not to panic that she hasn't been eating, Gary gave great advice above. But remember that fish aren't mammals, they take their body temperature from the water, not by burning fuel to keep their body temp right the way mammals like us do, so fish don't need to eat every single day, and go for a while without food for much longer than a mammal. Nine days without eating is a sign that something is wrong, for sure, but she's also not on the brink of starving to death, so it's okay if she goes without for a few more days.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Do not change water. Read here and you will know what to do. All you will need is some salt.
https://www.fishforums.net/threads/rescuing-a-fish-in-cycle-gone-wild-part-il.433778/

This is the fastest way to finish the cycle and keep the fish safe.

 

[jennaa]

You lost control of the environment there. Now you need to step back and reduce to 25-30% water changes twice a week. In time, once a week.
Since you have a kit, test your tap. You're in the middle of the continent, and a lot of people in your region have pretty bad water.

Ghost shrimp die like flies. Bettas kill them too.

Slow on the feeding, add no more shrimp (Bettas have no friends, and like it that way). Start feeding sparingly in 3-4 days, and watch how the fish responds. Bettas are obligatory air breathers and handle ammonia much better than most other tropical fish do. They need clean water, and stability.

thank you so much ! i’m glad to know that i’m not the one killing my shrimp lol. i will lay back on the water changes & only change it 2 times a week. I know water where i’m at is terrible, so i use spring water that i buy from the market. i’ve tested that before & it always says nitrite and ammonia is 0ppm & then i add it to my tank & it says both are back up to .25ppm right away ! even sometimes .50ppm. i’m glad to hear they handle ammonia better than other fish, that makes me feel better but i’m worried for my lil girl. thank you for the advice !! i’ll follow it & hope she eats within a few days

 

[jennaa]

Try not to panic that she hasn't been eating, Gary gave great advice above. But remember that fish aren't mammals, they take their body temperature from the water, not by burning fuel to keep their body temp right the way mammals like us do, so fish don't need to eat every single day, and go for a while without food for much longer than a mammal. Nine days without eating is a sign that something is wrong, for sure, but she's also not on the brink of starving to death, so it's okay if she goes without for a few more days.

omg thank you for telling me this !! i’m sitting over here every night before i go to bed, scared bc i think i’m gonna wake up to find her starved to death. i heard they can go up to 14 days without eating, is after that when i should really start to worry ?? & if it gets to that point, then what do i do ?? i’m scared my water is never going to be fixed in time.. i’m scared she won’t survive & im sad that i didn’t know about cycling my tank until after i got her. i just want the best for her !

 

[jennaa]

Do not change water. Read here and you will know what to do. All you will need is some salt.
https://www.fishforums.net/threads/rescuing-a-fish-in-cycle-gone-wild-part-il.433778/

This is the fastest way to finish the cycle and keep the fish safe.

this article is amazing. thank you so much i put aquarium salt in a few days ago, hoping that would at least help her & it seemed like it did !! after adding it, she stopped flaring her gills & started swimming around more. she still hasn’t eaten tho i’m glad to know that adding salt makes the cycle go by faster !! i didn’t know water changes could slow the cycle, so i hope i didn’t ruin it too much by all my daily water changes.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Salt doesn't speed the cycle. The chloride in the salt blocks the nitrite from harming the fish. It takes from 24 to 48 hours for a fish to clear nitrite from its system. But this assume that there is no more nitrite getting in.

For the nitrite bacteria to reproduce, they need for there to be more nitrite than they need. But if you are doing water changes two things are going to happen. The first is the fish cannot clear the nitrite from its system because more is in the water. The second is that the nitrite bacteria will reproduce more slowly.

Unlike ammonia, we can deal with nitrite using chloride rather than water changes. One could use calcium chloride rather than salt, but the cost would be more.

The aquaculture industry has know about chloride for a very long time. When you are farming fish in huge ponds, water changes are not an option. Chloride from salt or even the calcium chloride can protect the fish while givinf bacteria and/or live plants a chance to deal with the nitrite.

You cannot ruin the cycle from water changes, you can only slow it. The fact that you do not have ammonia and do have nitrite means you are at least half way or so through the cycle. BTW, salt water fish are not as prone to having nitrite issues because they live in water with chloride.

Finally, when a fish is sick or suffering from cycling related issues it tends to hide and it can stop eating. Spotting this sort of thing is often the first clue we have that something is wring. I know when I am sick i retreat to my bed and want to be left alone until I feel better. For a fish the hiding is a way to reduce the risk of being picked on by other fish or even being eaten by a predator.

 

[Jamie D.]

i even tried feeding her dried tubifex worms, dried bloodworms & even frozen baby brine shrimp.

You've already gotten great advice on the cycle and water quality, but I just wanted to mention that freeze-dried foods can cause gut issues, especially if you feed them dry. I don't know if you were soaking them or not, but if you do try freeze-dried again, soak them in a bit of tank water before you feed them, so they won't expand after she eats them.

Frozen brine shrimp is great, frozen daphnia if you can get it, frozen bloodworms for a once or twice a week treat, and some good betta pellets would be better options than anything freeze-dried.

Hang in there! We all learn as we go, and bettas are sturdier than they look.

 

[jennaa]

Salt doesn't speed the cycle. The chloride in the salt blocks the nitrite from harming the fish. It takes from 24 to 48 hours for a fish to clear nitrite from its system. But this assume that there is no more nitrite getting in.

For the nitrite bacteria to reproduce, they need for there to be more nitrite than they need. But if you are doing water changes two things are going to happen. The first is the fish cannot clear the nitrite from its system because more is in the water. The second is that the nitrite bacteria will reproduce more slowly.

Unlike ammonia, we can deal with nitrite using chloride rather than water changes. One could use calcium chloride rather than salt, but the cost would be more.

The aquaculture industry has know about chloride for a very long time. When you are farming fish in huge ponds, water changes are not an option. Chloride from salt or even the calcium chloride can protect the fish while givinf bacteria and/or live plants a chance to deal with the nitrite.

You cannot ruin the cycle from water changes, you can only slow it. The fact that you do not have ammonia and do have nitrite means you are at least half way or so through the cycle. BTW, salt water fish are not as prone to having nitrite issues because they live in water with chloride.

Finally, when a fish is sick or suffering from cycling related issues it tends to hide and it can stop eating. Spotting this sort of thing is often the first clue we have that something is wring. I know when I am sick i retreat to my bed and want to be left alone until I feel better. For a fish the hiding is a way to reduce the risk of being picked on by other fish or even being eaten by a predator.

i’m really hoping the salt will work, it sounds like it will i feel bad for changing the water so much but i can only learn from here. thank you for telling me that water changes don’t ruin the cycle completely, it’s just slowed down. & you’re right !! i would want to be left alone if i felt sick as well. i was just scared that she was gonna die right away from the cycle. thank you so much for everything you just told me, it was really helpful & i know a lot more about it now !!

 

[jennaa]

You've already gotten great advice on the cycle and water quality, but I just wanted to mention that freeze-dried foods can cause gut issues, especially if you feed them dry. I don't know if you were soaking them or not, but if you do try freeze-dried again, soak them in a bit of tank water before you feed them, so they won't expand after she eats them.

Frozen brine shrimp is great, frozen daphnia if you can get it, frozen bloodworms for a once or twice a week treat, and some good betta pellets would be better options than anything freeze-dried.

Hang in there! We all learn as we go, and bettas are sturdier than they look.

oh wow i didn’t know that freeze dried foods could cause problems ! thank you so much for telling me. i actually just tried soaking the tubifex worms in tank water and she ate a few little specks that came off of it, but that’s all. at least she ate something i’ll definitely get some frozen daphnia bc i’ve heard rlly good things about it. i have betta pellets but i feel like they seem to big for her?? do they make smaller ones? thank you for helping me, i appreciate it so much.

 

[Jamie D.]

oh wow i didn’t know that freeze dried foods could cause problems ! thank you so much for telling me. i actually just tried soaking the tubifex worms in tank water and she ate a few little specks that came off of it, but that’s all. at least she ate something i’ll definitely get some frozen daphnia bc i’ve heard rlly good things about it. i have betta pellets but i feel like they seem to big for her?? do they make smaller ones? thank you for helping me, i appreciate it so much.

The Omega One pellets are pretty small. I know a lot of people use Bug Bites, too, though I haven't tried them yet. Maybe wait until she's eating again, and then see how she does. I don't know what you have access to, but you could try just a standard Hikari "mini" pellet too.

 

[jennaa]

i’m new here so im not really sure if anyone will see this but i’ll give it a shot…
Alright so my betta won’t eat. She actually hasn’t eaten in 9 days !! here’s a little back story…

I got her about almost a month ago BUT i just learned about cycling my tank right after i got her bc the stupid petco employee said i only have to cycle my tank for 24 hours. ANYWAY, i bought the api test kit & tested for everything, & it said i had .50ppm ammonia but everything else was perfect. my fish was fine & she was eating & everything. i did a 50% water change & i eventually got my ammonia down to 0, so everything at this point is down to 0. I then got 4 ghost shrimp bc i thought it was safe & i fed them shrimp wafers. i accidentally fell asleep & left the wafer in the water all night. they all died & i read that it was normal for them to die when added to a new tank, i then added 7 more & they died too i took them out but it took me a while to find all of them. at this point she stopped eating so i tested the water again & my ammonia was 0, but my nitrite was 1.0ppm. i was freaking out !! so i did almost 100% water change, & it lowered it down to .50ppm. i’ve been changing my water constantly for about a week & a half now & she still won’t eat, my nitrites lowered, but they’re like a darker blue instead of purple, like in between 0 & .25ppm. my ammonia is at .25ppm again but my water is cloudy from too many water changes, should i keep doing them anyway until my ammonia & nitrites lower ?? idk what to do, i’ve tried everything !! i even tried feeding her dried tubifex worms, dried bloodworms & even frozen baby brine shrimp. i’ve been using seachem prime & stability & there’s a slight difference but still not at 0. i have a 10 gallon tank & have a Aqueon submersible aquarium heater & my aquarium is at 78 degrees Fahrenheit. I also have a MF10 internal TopFin filter, which i don’t know how to clean so i’ve been cleaning the spray bar (with aquarium water so i don’t ruin my beneficial bacteria). please help me. it’s been going on for too long now & im worried for my betta

here is an update, my ammonia seems to have gotten back up to.25 & my nitrites seems a darker purple than yesterday morning,,, i haven’t done a water change since tuesday & i added salt. should i just use prime & not do a water change? or should i do another water change ?

 

[TwoTankAmin]

WAIT- depending on the pH and temp of your water .25 ppm of ammonia may not be a problem. That can be true with even higher reading if your pH is on the low side.

Next, the salt blocks the nitrite from getting into the blood of the fish, but is doen not lower it, the cycle will do that.

And do not feel bad about what you did. most fish sites sat the same thing- change water a lot. But that is not always correct. That article I told you to read re nitrite also talks about ammonia, please go back and read it.

Over time we do a lot of water changes for our fish. We usually accompany this with some cleaning and maybe vacuuming. So we are disturbing the fish. What you should notice when you have been at this for a while is that the behaviour of many of our fish will change from the time when we forst added them compare to months or more later.

Whe we add a nef fish think about what it has been and is going through, And then it ends up in a strange place with maybe tankmates it has never seen, Then there is us watching and feeding. That is enough to stress a fish and it is likely going to hide a lot earlt on when we approach or work in the tank. When we initially add food the fish may hide and down the road when we approach they ahave assumed their feeding positions waiting for the food to hit the water.

So when a fish is new to a tank, water changes are stressfull. Almost everything can be. So, one needs to balance the doing of the water change against the harm it might do to skip it. With ammonia this is how toxic it is, with nitrite this is whether one knows about using chloride (aka salt).

So take a deep breath and lets figure out if you need to change some water or you can wait and see where the numbers go. If nitrite goes higher, add a bit more salt. If it goes down you know that removing the salt will start with the next normal water change.

 

[jennaa]

WAIT- depending on the pH and temp of your water .25 ppm of ammonia may not be a problem. That can be true with even higher reading if your pH is on the low side.

Next, the salt blocks the nitrite from getting into the blood of the fish, but is doen not lower it, the cycle will do that.

And do not feel bad about what you did. most fish sites sat the same thing- change water a lot. But that is not always correct. That article I told you to read re nitrite also talks about ammonia, please go back and read it.

Over time we do a lot of water changes for our fish. We usually accompany this with some cleaning and maybe vacuuming. So we are disturbing the fish. What you should notice when you have been at this for a while is that the behaviour of many of our fish will change from the time when we forst added them compare to months or more later.

Whe we add a nef fish think about what it has been and is going through, And then it ends up in a strange place with maybe tankmates it has never seen, Then there is us watching and feeding. That is enough to stress a fish and it is likely going to hide a lot earlt on when we approach or work in the tank. When we initially add food the fish may hide and down the road when we approach they ahave assumed their feeding positions waiting for the food to hit the water.

So when a fish is new to a tank, water changes are stressfull. Almost everything can be. So, one needs to balance the doing of the water change against the harm it might do to skip it. With ammonia this is how toxic it is, with nitrite this is whether one knows about using chloride (aka salt).

So take a deep breath and lets figure out if you need to change some water or you can wait and see where the numbers go. If nitrite goes higher, add a bit more salt. If it goes down you know that removing the salt will start with the next normal water change.

yes, thank you so much for that article, it gives me a lot of answers to questions i have, but my nitrite seemed even higher today, she was swimming around more and stuff and she’s more curious about food, but she hasn’t eaten and she’s just chilling at the bottom of the tank which i’ve never really seen her so before besides the first day i got her ?? idk. i’m scared she’s going to die tonight. should i do a water change now??