Water changes and fertilizer

[sharkweek178]

Generally, I do a weekly water change. I add liquid fertilizer after the water change. I do another dose mid week between water changes.
But I'm having some issues and I think I need to do large daily water changes. So how should I adjust my liquid fertilizer schedule? Do the plants absorb enough of the nutrients in one day that I can keep doing the same schedule? Or should I add smaller amounts of fertilizer after the daily changes?

 

[10 Tanks]

Hello shark. The most important thing to remember is that you add nitogen, (the bad stuff) to the water every time you add fertilizer. The next thing is, do your plants really need added fertilizer or will they do fine with just the fertilizers the fish produce? It might be worth the time to research each plant and see what it needs. You may not need to spend money on fertilizers.

10 Tank (Now 11)

 

[sharkweek178]

Hello shark. The most important thing to remember is that you add nitogen, (the bad stuff) to the water every time you add fertilizer. The next thing is, do your plants really need added fertilizer or will they do fine with just the fertilizers the fish produce? It might be worth the time to research each plant and see what it needs. You may not need to spend money on fertilizers.

10 Tank (Now 11)

I have a lot of fast growers; anacharis, salvinia minima, and water wisteria. I see a difference when I don't fertilize or even if I don't fertilize twice a week.

 

[sharkweek178]

I guess the issue is how fast do plants absorb the nutrients from liquid fertilizer. If it's immediately then no problem. I can just keep going with my regular schedule just making sure to go it after a daily water change. But if it takes longer, then I'm wondering if I should dose much smaller amounts after each water change.

 

[Byron]

There are several plant fertilizers that do not have nitrogen, and some with very, very little. These are the brands that several of us on TFF endorse. I certainly agree that one should never add nitrogen (as nitrate) to an aquarium with fish, but the levels in these is so low as to be negligible. With fast growing plants, it can be difficult to find all the micronutrients solely from feeding the fish and water changes.

To your initial question @sharkweek178 I do not have numbers. I do know that the uptake of ammonia/ammonium (the nitrogen) by fast growers is very rapid, within hours. But this is a unique nutrient. Plants take it up as fast as fish produce it, just about. But plants have storage for ammonia/ammonium as I stated in another thread this past week. I have no idea if their uptake of micros is anywhere as rapid.

I personally would be very careful...but that brings me to the question of why do you need daily major water changes?

 

[sharkweek178]

There are several plant fertilizers that do not have nitrogen, and some with very, very little. These are the brands that several of us on TFF endorse. I certainly agree that one should never add nitrogen (as nitrate) to an aquarium with fish, but the levels in these is so low as to be negligible. With fast growing plants, it can be difficult to find all the micronutrients solely from feeding the fish and water changes.

To your initial question @sharkweek178 I do not have numbers. I do know that the uptake of ammonia/ammonium (the nitrogen) by fast growers is very rapid, within hours. But this is a unique nutrient. Plants take it up as fast as fish produce it, just about. But plants have storage for ammonia/ammonium as I stated in another thread this past week. I have no idea if their uptake of micros is anywhere as rapid.

I personally would be very careful...but that brings me to the question of why do you need daily major water changes?

My neons are showing signs of fin rot. So first step is daily 75% water changes. Next step is salt.

 

[Colin_T]

Why do you have to do daily water changes?

If the fish are sick and you need to do daily water changes for a week or so then just don't fertilise during that time.

If the nitrates are going up rapidly, then either reduce the amount of food going into the tank, or reduce the number of fish in the tank, do bigger (75-90%) water changes and gravel clean the substrate, or grow lots of floating plants like Water Sprite.

You can check the nitrate level in your water source to see if that is an issue.

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If you do a daily water change and add fertiliser straight after the water change, the plants will have plenty of time to take up nutrients before the next water change. However, you will go through a lot more fertiliser doing daily water changes and re-dosing plant fertiliser each day.

 

[GaryE]

I don't think you need to dose each water change. The growth of the plants may slow, but if water conditions are leading to the relatively rare but often overdiagnosed fin rot problem, then you may be over-using ferts. First though, how large is the tank? What is the fish community? How many of each fish are in there.

I leave plant stuff to plant people. I go fish first....

 

[sharkweek178]

Why do you have to do daily water changes?

If the fish are sick and you need to do daily water changes for a week or so then just don't fertilise during that time.

If the nitrates are going up rapidly, then either reduce the amount of food going into the tank, or reduce the number of fish in the tank, do bigger (75-90%) water changes and gravel clean the substrate, or grow lots of floating plants like Water Sprite.

You can check the nitrate level in your water source to see if that is an issue.

-------------------

If you do a daily water change and add fertiliser straight after the water change, the plants will have plenty of time to take up nutrients before the next water change. However, you will go through a lot more fertiliser doing daily water changes and re-dosing plant fertiliser each day.

Neons are showing signs of fin rot. I've already lost some to what I think is neon tetra disease. I could be wrong here, but I don't think that fin rot is one of the symptoms of neon tetra disease. From what, I've seen on this site, large daily water changes and salt treatments are the best treatment. I haven't started the salt yet. I also have some Maracyn on hand but that is a last resort.
I've cut back their feeding schedule. It was once a day for 4 days then a fasting day. Now it's every other day.

 

[sharkweek178]

I don't think you need to dose each water change. The growth of the plants may slow, but if water conditions are leading to the relatively rare but often overdiagnosed fin rot problem, then you may be over-using ferts. First though, how large is the tank? What is the fish community? How many of each fish are in there.

I leave plant stuff to plant people. I go fish first....

I'll cut back the dosing of the ferts. Never thought that could be a side effect.
29 gallon. 1 honey gourami, 9 neon tetras (I started with a dozen but 3 have died and I'm not replacing them. Neons are beautiful but their health has been a constant issue with me), 16 or so pygmy corys (they're having babies, at least 2 fry survived and they hide a lot so a precise number is impossible), 3 assassin snails, 6 amano shrimp, and MTS.

 

[GaryE]

So that almost eliminates external attacks. I'd watch the honey gourami for fin nipping, as real honeys (T chuna) are sweethearts, but the fish now sold under the hijacked trade name is not the same fish. It's probably a hybrid form of T labiosa, and it can be a nasty character.

Nibbled fins will often get whitish at the bites and look like fin rot.

Neons can also nip each other a little, but your tank is large enough.

Having pygmy babies show up is a clear sign some things are going right - most things in fact. They don't breed in dirty water.

 

[sharkweek178]

So that almost eliminates external attacks. I'd watch the honey gourami for fin nipping, as real honeys (T chuna) are sweethearts, but the fish now sold under the hijacked trade name is not the same fish. It's probably a hybrid form of T labiosa, and it can be a nasty character.

Nibbled fins will often get whitish at the bites and look like fin rot.

Neons can also nip each other a little, but your tank is large enough.

Having pygmy babies show up is a clear sign some things are going right - most things in fact. They don't breed in dirty water.

The honey is no problem at all. He never causes any trouble. He spends most of his time in the back left corner building bubble nests in the feeder rings I put back there to allow light in for the plants back there. I've only ever seen him act aggressively one time when he chased a couple of neons out of his corner. Otherwise, he's very mild mannered. To give an example, I fed the tank frozen bloodworms once. The honey got one and it was hanging from his mouth. A neon came along and grabbed it from him. The honey didn't do anything about it except look sad.
I see the neons dance around and chase each other but no attacking. I've had issues with what I believe is neon tetra disease. White lumps on their mouths. Some are still showing that. I'm just letting these neons live out their lives until they're all gone then I'll replace them with something else.

 

[sharkweek178]

Having pygmy babies show up is a clear sign some things are going right - most things in fact. They don't breed in dirty water.

I have to say that I feel a lot better reading this. Reading up on fin rot and seeing that the number one cause is dirty water, I wasn't feeling so great about myself as a fishkeeper.

 

[Essjay]

What's the colour of the gourami? Wild coloured and yellow are real honeys, it's the red ones which aren't.

 

[sharkweek178]

What's the colour of the gourami? Wild coloured and yellow are real honeys, it's the red ones which aren't.

He's yellow with orangish highlights.