Tiger Barb Bullies

[xautomaticflowersx]

Hi all.
I've got a group of 5 tiger barbs (3 normal, 2 green) in a 30"x12"x18" planted tank. I've had them for several months, but lately (last couple of weeks) one of the green ones and one of the normal ones have started hiding a lot... behind the filter, behind pieces of wood etc. Which is obviously worrying. They come out to feed and dart around normally after the food along with the others, but once they've eaten they go back into hiding. They are a little bit smaller than the other 3, which made me suspect that they were being bullied. So I bought a load of vallis plants for the back of my tank to break up the lines of sight and give extra cover in the middle/top areas.
I thought it might coax out the smaller shy fish, which it seems to have done. And now that the smaller fish are out and about a bit more than usual I've been able to have a proper look at them (when they previously were coming out to feed I couldn't get a good look at them because they were darting around too quickly). There are no obvious signs of disease, but unfortunately both fish have lost both of their pectoral fins... the normal one has small stumps, but the green one has almost nothing left . They mostly try to keep out of the way of the other fish as the larger healthy ones will chase them around a bit, but I have even seen the two injured fish having a go at each other! Picking at each others stumps where the pectorals used to be! It's all really quite upsetting to see and I really don't know what to do for the best. Adding more barbs would create a larger group, thus easing the tension a bit, because I know that barbs are less agressive in larger groups. But at the same time, the more healthy fish there are I would imagine the weaker ones will be bullied more! Should I get some clove oil in and euthanise the injured fish and get some more barbs to keep a bigger group and try to start again and keep agression down? I don't want to euthanise them. But I really don't know what to do.
So far I've given them extra cover with the vallis plants and I've been dosing the tank with melafix and doing small water changes every few days, but other than that I'm a bit lost. Since adding the plants they are out and about more, but they are still being picked on.
If anybody has any ideas, I'd be really appreciative. Many thanks in advance for any responses

 

[RushingChamp28]

Hi all.
I've got a group of 5 tiger barbs (3 normal, 2 green) in a 30"x12"x18" planted tank. I've had them for several months, but lately (last couple of weeks) one of the green ones and one of the normal ones have started hiding a lot... behind the filter, behind pieces of wood etc. Which is obviously worrying. They come out to feed and dart around normally after the food along with the others, but once they've eaten they go back into hiding. They are a little bit smaller than the other 3, which made me suspect that they were being bullied. So I bought a load of vallis plants for the back of my tank to break up the lines of sight and give extra cover in the middle/top areas.
I thought it might coax out the smaller shy fish, which it seems to have done. And now that the smaller fish are out and about a bit more than usual I've been able to have a proper look at them (when they previously were coming out to feed I couldn't get a good look at them because they were darting around too quickly). There are no obvious signs of disease, but unfortunately both fish have lost both of their pectoral fins... the normal one has small stumps, but the green one has almost nothing left . They mostly try to keep out of the way of the other fish as the larger healthy ones will chase them around a bit, but I have even seen the two injured fish having a go at each other! Picking at each others stumps where the pectorals used to be! It's all really quite upsetting to see and I really don't know what to do for the best. Adding more barbs would create a larger group, thus easing the tension a bit, because I know that barbs are less agressive in larger groups. But at the same time, the more healthy fish there are I would imagine the weaker ones will be bullied more! Should I get some clove oil in and euthanise the injured fish and get some more barbs to keep a bigger group and try to start again and keep agression down? I don't want to euthanise them. But I really don't know what to do.
So far I've given them extra cover with the vallis plants and I've been dosing the tank with melafix and doing small water changes every few days, but other than that I'm a bit lost. Since adding the plants they are out and about more, but they are still being picked on.
If anybody has any ideas, I'd be really appreciative. Many thanks in advance for any responses

I have had this happen over the course of my fishkeeping with different barbs, sometimes even keeping them in the "recommended" size group wont prevent it. If you are worried that the fish will not be able to recover in the community setting, perhaps you need to remove the fish to another tank for a little bit. Do you have a small quarantine tank/empty tank that you could keep them in? Another option is to us small breeder nets and isolate them in these (they fit inside your tank, basically just a tight mesh over a square frame). Personally I like the breeder net method because there is no change in the water parameters, not to mention you can continue to maintain your one tank rather than an additional one. Just keep them in clean water and unstressed, make sure they get a good balanced diet, and in a few weeks they will be fine.

I have done this in the past with a gold barb, black ruby barb and a clown barb, all with great sucess. Breeder nets are extremely cheap, you can order them online from petsolutions or other places for $3.00 US i think, certainly not a huge investment. If for some reason you cannot afford a breeder net, you could use a regular aquarium net. You may want to throw a few pieces of gravel in the bottom to weigh it down and give the fish some room.

Hope this helps...
-Evan

 

[xautomaticflowersx]

Thanks for the reassurance and the advice. Adding extra plants really seems to have helped them have the confidence to venture out a lot more. I've been off work lately and able to sit and watch them, and they seem to be getting bullied less as well. They still get chased away occasionally, but to be honest even the healthy ones chase each other sometimes and flare their fins.
Will their pectoral fins grow back? Or will they just have to heal up and manage without? They seem to be able to swim around just fine without them, poor little things.

 

[RushingChamp28]

Thanks for the reassurance and the advice. Adding extra plants really seems to have helped them have the confidence to venture out a lot more. I've been off work lately and able to sit and watch them, and they seem to be getting bullied less as well. They still get chased away occasionally, but to be honest even the healthy ones chase each other sometimes and flare their fins.
Will their pectoral fins grow back? Or will they just have to heal up and manage without? They seem to be able to swim around just fine without them, poor little things.

Assuming the fins are not damaged SEVERELY, they should grow back (they can grow back from almost nothing). Give them a week or so before you might see any real regrowth. Keep pristine water conditions and make sure they are not stressed because of over aggressive tank mates. The regrowing fins usually form a clearish border around them (the new tissue, not darkened like the rest of the fin) as the fins heal. Make sure the torn fins do not continue to tatter or become infected (finrot, fungus, etc). Perhaps avoid adding new fish to the tank while these heal to prevent infecting these fish in a weakened state. You should see a full recovery in almost all situations.

 

[xautomaticflowersx]

Excellent. Thanks again for all your input. I'll be doing another little water change tomorrow and I've been dosing the tank with melafix (and pimafix as well now), to help them heal and to try and minimise any chances of infection.
I'm sure balance will return to the tank, especially once the vallis really takes off and forms some good cover

 

[LetsBeFriends]

a little side note for you, iv kept many different combination of green/regular tiger barbs. and while yes they are the same fish, i believe that for whatever reason (captive breeding maby) that the current generations of green and regular tiger barbs are not compatible in the sense that u cant have 3 of each and expect a school, a group of lets say 8 tiger and 8 green tigers would work and look beautiful. however in my experience mixing the two without sufficient numbers of each type wont kill the fish, but will result in the behavior you have described. especially if one male happens to gain complete dominance over the others

 

[xautomaticflowersx]

I see, that's rather interesting... I've never heard that before. I always thought that you could mix and match with tiger barbs. Worth bearing in mind though for the future certainly.

 

[xautomaticflowersx]

Oh dear . One of the green tigers who had his pectoral fins nipped off has become very thin over the last 3 or 4 days. He looks really sorry for himself... his abdomen is almost concave from where he's so thin. I've been keeping the water clean and dosing with melafix and pimafix for the wounds.
I've also been keeping their diet as varied as possible: TetraMin flake as a staple (I soak it in tank water first so they aren't gobbling air at the surface), frozen bloodworm, squashed shelled peas, Nutrafin Max Spirulina Algae Tablets, plus the Nutrafin Max Sinking Complete Tablets which I pop in there for the loaches. I'm not over-feeding as the food is always gone in a very short time, but the fish in question does manage to eat what I put in there. It seems like his food isn't doing him any good because he remains very thin. All my other fish look the absolute picture of health and the second damaged fish is not thin (although he still doesn't look 100% healthy obviously, because he has significantly more fin loss than the thin one - his pectorals and his pelvic fins are gone).
The healthy ones seem to be leaving the injured ones alone now that they have had their fun. The normal tiger with the missing pectorals and pelvics even swims among the healthy fish again now. However, after he has finished eating, the thin green tiger hangs around at the surface (not gasping) looking pretty listless so I'm expecting to find him dead in the next few days, which will be rather sad. Thanks for all your sensible advice. Hopefully this little fish will turn around and get better. If not I at least hope that the other damaged fish does not go the same way.