The worst ICH infection I've ever seen

[Narideth]

Hey guys, I'm not exactly new to the fish hobby, but this... I don't know what to do about this.

This is the worst outbreak of ich I have ever experienced. I've lost half of my tank already. The explosion of infection just seems to be getting worse and I'm running a full gambit of treatments.

Water temp at 86-88 degrees, with salt added, and today will get the 2nd dose of API Super Ick Cure. Salt was added 4 days ago as soon as I saw this becoming an issue, as well as some older medicine I had, the Jungle ick tablets that have worked fine before on small outbreaks. Then 2 days later the temperature was pumped up and I purchased the API meds, assuming the other maybe was too old and the infection was getting way out of hand. (Did a couple of 20% water changes and left a carbon filter in for about 12 hrs between these two medication uses to try and take out some of the original medication and not overdose the tank. Carbon filter was removed again when the new meds went in.)

This morning after another night of hoping to see some improvement, it's still spreading and fish that only showed a couple of the typical little white spots are wearing more of them as well as another casualty.

These two are the worst off of the tank, they're covered head to tail and they brought it into the tank. I thought maybe it was velvet which I've never encountered but it looks just like ich to me. I haven't started the second dose of the API meds yet, that comes later today, but they're technically half a week into treating and it's still getting worse.




Should I be treating for something else? Is this the super resistant ich that I've heard lives in FL? I'd love some help on direction or if I've misdiagnosed. I can get more pictures if needed. Thanks in advance.

 

[Stefan3289]

based of my experience with diseases, that looks like a bad case of ich. When I treated my tank before, I used the API one and did not find it to be that effective for most of my tank. I recommend switching to “Rid-ich plus.”

Action: Move the fish to a quarantine tank that way the only ich present in the quarantine tank is what is visible. This will help the fish fight of the parasite with the meds. As for the original tank. Leave it empty for about a week with high temps and since there is no host, they will cycle out and die. Just keep syphoning and cleaning out the original tank AND the quarantine tank.

The only thing I don’t know is how it effects plans, which is why I suggested moving them to a quarantine tank and it will help the fish recover since there will be less ich in the water.

 

[PheonixKingZ]

based of my experience with diseases, that looks like a bad case of ich. When I treated my tank before, I used the API one and did not find it to be that effective for most of my tank. I recommend switching to “Rid-ich plus.”

Action: Move the fish to a quarantine tank that way the only ich present in the quarantine tank is what is visible. This will help the fish fight of the parasite with the meds. As for the original tank. Leave it empty for about a week with high temps and since there is no host, they will cycle out and die. Just keep syphoning and cleaning out the original tank AND the quarantine tank.

The only thing I don’t know is how it effects plans, which is why I suggested moving them to a quarantine tank and it will help the fish recover since there will be less ich in the water.

The first part I agree with, good job.

The second part is less true... if that fish is that bad, the probably that the whole tank is infected, is very high.

I would keep that fish in there, and just treat the whole tank. The most effective way to treat ich, is heat. Raise the water temperature to 30C (86F) and keep it there for 2 weeks. Then reduce the temperature. (@Colin_T’s advice)

 

[Stefan3289]

The first part I agree with, good job.

The second part is less true... if that fish is that bad, the probably that the whole tank is infected, is very high.

I would keep that fish in there, and just treat the whole tank. The most effective way to treat ich, is heat. Raise the water temperature to 30C (86F) and keep it there for 2 weeks. Then reduce the temperature. (@Colin_T’s advice)

The whole tank is definitely infected, but the amount of ich that’s present (based of the amount of spots) I feel like is overwhelming the fish. Moving them to a separate tank means the all the ich floating or in the substrate now cannot affect them and will make it easier when treating them. However, I have only dealt with ich three times. Maybe @essjay can help?

 

[Stefan3289]

I also feel like since the tank looks pretty planted, it just give more places for the area than just the fish to breed and develop, making the outbreak very big...

 

[fish48]

Waterlife Protozin is one of the best white spot treatments

 

[Narideth]

The temperature is already holding steady around 87-88 degrees, and there's no trouble with holding it there. I'm concerned that the two week wait is going to kill of my remaining fish though. Out of a tank of 20, 6 are left, the largest and strongest who have mostly resisted the disease except for small spots and the two carriers I posted pictures of.

I just scooped out two more bodies... my tiger barb and cory schools have been almost completely wiped out.

 

[Narideth]

I'm down with getting another medication if needed. Hikari Ich-X, the Rid-Ich plus... whatever.

 

[Stefan3289]

I personally feel like removing them and treating the fish separately and worrying about the main tank later is the best option, especially if you have a quarantine tank. Whenever my tank had ich, I did extensive research, and the main points are

1) The ich goes in cycles, with high temperatures increasing the speed of the cycle, making them go to the vulnerable stage Faster, where the medication actually works

2) The spots you see on the fish is not how many are actually in the tank. Doing water changes and syphoning the gravel is also a very important part as most of them lye in the gravel/substrate.

3) If there is no host (pretty much anything living in the tank) the parasites cannot live and will die off on there own after about a week (with high temps)

The only thing I don’t know is how the medication would affect the plants?”, but I know plants can carry ich.

 

[Narideth]

My quarantine tank is currently being used as emergency housing for my shrimp colony while I verify that the 10 gallon I had to nuke a couple of weeks ago is stable. I have my 5 gallon water change bucket that I could probably use as temporary housing if absolutely necessary, but that wouldn't be ideal.

edit: This is why I made the obviously terrible mistake of not quarantining these new fish who looked deceptively healthy. Ugh.

 

[PheonixKingZ]

The whole tank is definitely infected, but the amount of ich that’s present (based of the amount of spots) I feel like is overwhelming the fish. Moving them to a separate tank means the all the ich floating or in the substrate now cannot affect them and will make it easier when treating them. However, I have only dealt with ich three times. Maybe @essjay can help?

Ahh... Makes sense now.

My quarantine tank is currently being used as emergency housing for my shrimp colony while I verify that the 10 gallon I had to nuke a couple of weeks ago is stable. I have my 5 gallon water change bucket that I could probably use as temporary housing if absolutely necessary, but that wouldn't be ideal.

edit: This is why I made the obviously terrible mistake of not quarantining these new fish who looked deceptively healthy. Ugh.

A 5g bucket would be good for now, if you have a heater and an air pump. (As long as it’s clean)

 

[Bub]

That doesn't look like ich to me. It looks like epistylis, which is an organism that generally indicates a bacterial infection has taken hold of the fish. It needs to be treated by a broad spectrum antibiotic in the food. You can read about the difference, and how to treat here. Here are some quotes from this site on how to treat:

"Bacterial diseases need to be hit with a broad-spectrum antibiotic. These need to be obtained from the internet. They include Thomas Labs Fish Mox, Midland Vet Service Aqua-Mox, VetDepot Amoxicillin, SeaChem KanaPlex, Fishbiotic Ampicillin, Mardel Maracyn 2, Thomas Labs Fish Min and Thomas Labs Fish Doxy. They are ONLY effective when mixed with the food"

"It is easy to make medicated food. Heat 1/4 cup water (one ounce, not a lot) in the microwave. Then blend one 1/4 ounce of plain animal derived gelatin (Knox gelatin, one envelope) into the hot water with vigorous stirring. Take two tablespoons of dry commercial fish food (pellets or flake) and mix it with just a little of the hot water/ gelatin mixture. Add hot water/gelatin until you get a paste like consistency. If it gets too watery just add more food.

Then add roughly 1/16 teaspoon (a 1% to 2% addition) of the medication to the mud. Mix and mash the whole mass thoroughly. Spread it out into a pancake about 1/8th inch (3 mm) thick on a plastic film or a plate. Then put in the refrigerator. If you plan on keeping it for more than two weeks put it in a small plastic bag and freeze.

Feeding should be at least for a week and longer if the fish doesn’t respond."

 

[Narideth]

So is the suggestion removing the fish to the bucket for approx 2 weeks, keep the temps high in the tank and just treat the bucket? I don't have an extra heater for the bucket, especially not one for so small of an amount of water. The best I could manage is snagging a betta heater from my betta tank and hope the cooler water wouldn't hurt him much for a 2 week period.

Air pump is no problem, I could even put a seeded sponge filter in the bucket.

 

[Narideth]

That doesn't look like ich to me. It looks like epistylis, which is an organism that generally indicates a bacterial infection has taken hold of the fish. It needs to be treated by a broad spectrum antibiotic in the food. You can read about the difference, and how to treat here. Here are some quotes from this site on how to treat:

That.... looks almost exactly like that I'm seeing. If it is epistylis with columnaris then the higher water temperatures are only making it worse.

 

[Essjay]

That doesn't look like ich to me. It looks like epistylis,

My first reaction to the photos was 'that doesn't look quite right for ich' but I had never heard of epistylis until Bub's post.

@Narideth as you are in the US you should be able to treat with antibiotics.