Talk Me Through Led Lights, Please

[the_lock_man]

On my larger tank, I got PS3Steveo to build me a LED set-up, which just looks fantastic.
 
Therefore, I am considering replacing the flourescent on my smaller tank. I have the DIY skills to get it to fit, but I'd like people to recommend the LEDs I need to use, and where to obtain them.
 
The tank is a 34l AquaOne, with the lights enclosed in the hood - so potentially heat dissipation may be a problem. It currently has a single 11w tube, which I feel is a little bright, the tank has a Crypto Wendtii and some java moss, both of which have grown strongly, but I also have a bit of a GSA problem. Therefore, I would like to lower the light levels somewhat.
 
What help can you guys give me?

 

[dgwebster]

off-topic I miss-read this as "talk me through RED lights" and thought " I cannot condone illegal activities that put lives in danger or demean women!
 
on-topic, I have a bit of an issue with WATTS and LED lights. Years ago I bought some LED light bulbs for my hallway as they are on practically all the time due to the design of the house. They are 1W each and said "equivalent to 15W incandescent" which was going to be really poor compared to the 400W I was running on the halogen bulbs. But I plunged for them anyway and discovered they were far, far brighter feeling than the W conversion let on. It was more like in the middle of 40W and 60W bulbs.
 
I therefore prefer to deal in Lumens, the measurement of light rather than the power used and their equivalents. If you tell me bulb A produces 1600lm at 1 meter running me 50W but bulb B produces 1200lm at 1 meter running me 1W I can make a much better comparison and I can calculate the values I need to be same, higher or lower than current versions.
 
The good news, LED are almost always quoted with their lumen measurement. Bad news, other bulbs can be harder. Google the manufacturer of your 11W bulb, see if you can get the stats for it and be prepared for a bit of mathematics if the measurements are take slightly differently (e.g. measured at 10cm vs 50cm.)

 

[the_lock_man]

It's the AquaOne bulb, best I can say (don't know if it's relevant) is that it's 7.1k - no site that I've found gives a lumens figure.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Do you mean 7.1k K - 7100 Kelvin?  

 

[the_lock_man]

I would assume so - there are a couple of sites I got that info from, but they had no further information. AquaOne's own site has even less info - as much use as a chocolate teapot.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Yum.. chocolate tea!   Actually, I don't think its good.

 

[ech0o]

I've been exploring linked LED modules, .7w per bulb, 4 bulbs per module.  They are waterproof and you can build/glue them right into tank canopies.   
 
I just ordered 20 RGB/White modules, and an IR remote interface, to be able to control the colors and brightness with a remote control.  This cost me little over $25 and what I should end up with is 80 .7w LEDS that produce very high lumens for the wattage, which are run through an IR controlled interface to control every aspect of the lights down to the degree of shading of each color to mix colors.  
 
I feel like this can be done on an even larger scale for big tanks, resulting in a far better priced method of lighting than ANYTHING I have seen available for purchase, AND IT'S WAY COOLER.   Also, you can build them right into the hood, and each 4 bulb module is very easily removed and replaced if bulbs get weak/die on you.
 
I have a couple tanks laying around here that have the plastic hoods that I am going to rip all the lighting out of and replace with these things!!
 
 
ANYWAYS, I am unsure if these are quality lights yet, its the 5050LED bulbs, apparently they stack well against a lot of other LED's out there, but for a buck a module can you really go wrong?
http/www.amazon.com/LEDPRO-Waterproof-Module-Changing-10-Pack/dp/B00B2HOLZU/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1370617674&sr=8-5&keywords=LED+module+5050
http/www.amazon.com/LEDwholesalers-Remote-Controller-LED-Strip/dp/B004IJFAMW/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1370617719&sr=8-1&keywords=LED+ir+remote
 
I of course found american sellers for both, HERES TO GIVING IT A WING!!

 

[dgwebster]

Whilst those SMD LEDs are good, for systems like ps3steve does is using much more powerful units like this

http/pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&id=200793522055

Here just one LED burns 3W but its putting out about 200lm.

Consider an office projector, cheap ones will run at 1200lm - 1600lm so you see here about 6-8 ought to light a 4' tank well enough of low light plants. Double that for really bright systems. These also make a tonne of heat, needing usually passivel cooled, sometimes actively. So quickly, the energy savings can drop from being fantastic to alright.

 

[the_lock_man]

Whilst those SMD LEDs are good, for systems like ps3steve does is using much more powerful units like this

http/pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&id=200793522055

Here just one LED burns 3W but its putting out about 200lm.

Consider an office projector, cheap ones will run at 1200lm - 1600lm so you see here about 6-8 ought to light a 4' tank well enough of low light plants. Double that for really bright systems. These also make a tonne of heat, needing usually passivel cooled, sometimes actively. So quickly, the energy savings can drop from being fantastic to alright.

 
Do you think that two or three of those would do my 34l? What about the LED holders that Steveo uses?

 

[DrRob]

LED's come into their own when you're burning a lot of power, which is why the reefkeepers love them. Otherwise the differences in power usage, as Dgwebster says, are somewhat offset by the cost to make em, and you end up with no great savings overall.

Where you do win is with better colour rendition, generally, on LED's, meaning that you can select the exact colours you want, wheras T5's will always produce some light that isn't in the spectrum you're after, but still counts towards it's lumen output (which measures all human visible light).

What you'll find is that a lower lumen, high colour rendition LED light will produce more of the light you're actually looking for, will therefore look brighter to your eye in the tank, and will therefore use less power for the same, or better, visual effect. This is where you win (and hopefully produce less unwanted photosynthetic stuff by keeping the overall light levels to a dull roar).

It does, however, make comparing the numbers a bit like plucking straws until you've had a play or seen some rigs to compare to.

 

[dgwebster]

Very true regarding the wave length range produced DrRob and a serious consideration too. If you look at zikofskis tank stand build in DIY he has sone pics of his tank with pure white and pure white + blue running at the same time which is a bit more "daytimey" in how our eyes perceive it. You may find that the limited projection (lenses help) and colours that you would prefer a 3+1 mix for the 34L
Just remembered, you want a slightly softer feel, you can either make your LED dimmable or make some of them individually switchable?

 

[dgwebster]

Hi,

My systems were having teen drama movie hissy fits in work today and I used the time to locate the following link for you from some searching.

http/playsofrays.blogspot.in/2012/12/leds-made-easy.html

 

[the_lock_man]

Hi,

My systems were having teen drama movie hissy fits in work today and I used the time to locate the following link for you from some searching.

http/playsofrays.blogspot.in/2012/12/leds-made-easy.html

 

 

[dgwebster]

haha thought you would like the article

 

[DrRob]

tis a good article. I now simply need to source a heatsink and some sensibly priced LED's along with a whole pile of time in the UK.