starting Zero Impact marine Aquarium

[Notshaz]

Hi

I have a tropical tank with a common mixture of community fishes and a collection of plants all triving well and looking good. I got a lot of help and advise from the local shop and have learnt alot. I now want to start a marine tank and the local shop does not supply marine fishes.

I've visited some other local shops that supply marine fished but I am not sure - dont come up to the standard of the tropical shop.

Anyway I searched the net and found a range of information read articles on ZIA, read the GRAFT site (total 2 days reading) and decided that I would like to try this.

Today my son and I made our first two rocks.

The tank

The tank we will be using is (l x d x w) 91 x 45 x 15 approx 135 lts

(l x d x w) 37 x 20 x 15 approx 30 uk gallons - this is not negotiable since it has to match the tank I already have. - Girly choice but some things has to be!

So now the questions. I have loads but I think I'll go step by step since I know that some more articles are comming.

1. How much rock will I need to make?

2. How do I make concrete rock into live rock?

3. Where would I get Coralline algea from partically since I have not built up a realtionship with the local marine shop?

4. When do I put in the animals to contol the algea? and what ones should they be GRaft do mension some but not sure if its the same in England?

I think this should help for the next few stages. I know I need filteration etc. I think I would like to use the berlin method but from what I've read I would need a p skimmer. And the last question is -

5. Would I really need a sump? It would mean altering the tank stand I think. If I had a sump how big would it have to be.

look forward to reading your replies B)

 

[Navarre]

If you are going down the route of manmade live rock then be very careful, this is not difficult to make but it needs to be the right mixture and not overporous.. also not underporous or the effect of live rock will not work. You also need true live rock in the tank to seed manmade stuff if you want life to emerge from it. (it will of course provide its bacterial filtration though)

1. I would recomend at ratio of 1kg of live rock per 2 gallon of tank. (preferably 1:1 ratio at best)

2. You can get it to act as a filter by just allwoing it to cycle but no life will grow on it. For this you need "real" live rock to seed it with life. (remember that manmade rocks cant be put in a tank right away... they have to wait at least 6 weeks to monitor the pH)

3. It comes on live rock. Not something that can just appeare to be honest. Normal algea will grow in a tank of course but coraline needs to be on the rocks already.

4. Astrea snail. Regleg Hermits are popular and a good start. Cleanup crew are the first to go in hte tank once its cycled. I recomend 1 crab/snail per gallon

5. You dont need a sump but it sure does help. Not only does it help hide all the heaters etc but it also increases the volume of the tank.

You live in london and you cannot find a LFS for marone? Here try this palce. (Probably the best in the country IMO)

They are off Junction 5 of the M25

STM


Im fro the UK myself, you will find there are alot of options near where you live to help you with your project.

Be careful with the man made stuff though, its not something i would recomend for beginners to the marine trade. Too much to monitor and if you dont know the warning signs it could be very expensive

Hope this helps

Navarre

 

[bgraber]

Also remember if you use concrete you have to soak it in water for like 4 to 6 weeks for all the bad stuff to leach out.. Otherwise it's bad news for anything alive. www.garf.org has instructional videos of a guy that does this for them. You can also look into "aquacultured" live rock which was placed into the ocean by a company only to come back and harvest it 6 years or so later.. Minimal ecological impact. Infact, supporting these companies assures them to stay in business and put the "rock poachers" out
Coraline algae come on most good live rock and thats how I got it started in my tank. nice purple stuff.. That garf.org site also sells something called Garf Grunge that is supposedly loaded with many different kinds of coralline algae.. Good to get your tank started.. A few lbs is all you would need.
As far as the sump, I've read people say that the sump would have to be like twice the size of the tank to actually do anything.. But I feel, a 20 gallon or so tank loaded with macro algae is better than nothing.. Adding the algae and extra water volume could only help on a smaller tank..
Protein skimmers are almost essential unless you want to change the water once a week or so.. A CPR BakPak is what I use.. Any of these models should be good on a tank up to 50 or 60 gallons.. Does that help?

Oh yeah, go say "hi" to the guys at the marine shop!

 

[Notshaz]

Hi thank you all for giving me your advise please keep it comming.
I know about some of the things you have all mensioned but it's great to hear it it means that I understood what I read. I know this is a longer process to a marine tank but if seen as a project it means I can save the pennies as I go. and have fun too.

yesterday we took out the first two rocks one broke but gave us two interesting smaller rocks and one made a good table shape.

Rinsed them off and we could see that they were absorbing the water well. Put them to soak and made three more. This is small amount I know but I have limited space and did not want to spend too munch on the sand to make the moulds. (used play pit sand figured it was the cleanest that could be brought without spending money for specialst sand)

OH Yes the moulds. if you are interested the advise on the site that I found the mixture I am using suggested that we use plastic boxes from DIY stores. But we used shoe boxes lined with black bin liners. Keep the sand moist so tha concreat can dry out over 2 days. saves money too! and I won't end up with loads of containers that I feel I have to keep.


I hape this is of interest to you please keep your ideas comming and I promis that things should get more intersting in say 6 weeks

Oh yest I went back to a LFS and I need to appologise V freindly and helpful amd marine fished look happy - happier than their tropical friends I think. any way got a while to look around some more. any suggestions Iam in Croydon. I can drive but dont like drivng too far. My son says its because I need a new car anyway they for a different forum.

 

[Navarre]

I would suggest you think twice about using play pit sand.
Play pit sand is usually loaded with silicate. (its usually silicate sand) and there is a great amount of evidence that using silicate sand will give massive algea blooms and cyanobacter gorwths as they thrive on this stuff. If its in the sand then its likely you will never get rid of an algea problem.

 

[bgraber]

You can get sand called "Yard Right" or "Southdown" which is Carribean aragonite! highly prized by reefers.. I believe the "Southdown" brand has actually changed to Yard Right and they are actually the same company.. or something
I was thinking of making some of my own rock like this.. I'm curious to hear how yours comes out. The only thing that really turned me off was how toxic cement is.. My friend worked at a cement yard for a bit and if you didn't wear gloves, you'd get nasty chemical burns.. So you have to soak the stuff till it can soak no more We want pics! Arches and caves would be super cool to have..

Oh yeah, instead of sand, you could just use Aragonite gravel.. Caribsea and some other companies make it. Very reef friendly.

 

[Notshaz]

"Play sand --OH S****"

Oh well I surpose thats what you call a learning curve. Good thing Iam going slowly.

Another thing I've learnt is how bad my typing (well I cant admits its my spelling) is. Glad you've got the gist any way.

Yes. I am tring to keep pictures but my camera is a bit naff. May need to borrow sisters but that another challenge

I went to a garden centre/ fish supplers not as far as I thought got sone ideas about sumps, skimmeres etc and saw some live sand (I know but I like to have pictures in my head of the things I need it helps me to plan.

Do you really think the sand will be a problem since its not actually in the rack just on the surface and it will be soaking for weeks. I also want to make a final bath of salt water could I use the salt used for water softerners I've loads (long story) I now I cant use it in the tank but could it help to finish off the rock?

We use gloves when we are making the rocks. Yes it does burn if it sits in the skin. I really think this should only be tried if you have the patience to wait. My son want to give up and its only a week. He wants the tank now!

 

[Navarre]

It also depends on the size of rock you are making.
A friend of mine makes his own rock and the smaller pieces can be purified in about 3 weeks. However, larger pieces can take up to 6 weeks per rock and sometimes even longer.