Questions About Sumps?

[aaronnorth]

Hi,

when you have a sump, do you have 2 pumps for the water at the same l/ph rating (1 to siphon out & other for returning the water) or would you just need a return pump?

I dont fully understand them so any other advice would be great

Thanks.

 

[adamgreen240]

you only usually have one as the return pump. the tank is usually drilled so the water flows into the sump with out the use of a pump. or you can have an overflow box fitted which siphones the water.

 

[BigIan]

It depends how you have your sump set up.... if your sump is gravity fed i.e a pipe at water level feeding down into the sump then you only need a return pump.

using 2 pumps is a nightmare on tanks as if algae builds up on one or some debris blocks the pumps inlet and the other pump is still going you

A) have no filter,
B) will probably flood your house.

your best getting 2 pumps rated the same and then having some method of ajusting the flow of water through the pipes.

 

[aaronnorth]

you only usually have one as the return pump. the tank is usually drilled so the water flows into the sump with out the use of a pump

how would you know how much water is leaving the tank? or would the return pump help siphon it out at he correct speed? Are these the things that are called 'weirs'?

you only usually have one as the return pump. the tank is usually drilled so the water flows into the sump with out the use of a pump

so that would be fitted near the top of the tank correct? Like what you have in the bath & sink?

 

[squeakytoy]

No expert, but as I have just started using one, here's what I know. I know I need a bigger pump...

lol, anyway, the pump feeds water into the tank, causing the water level to rise. This rising water will overflow into the drain that will feed the sump and pump. Now the pump has more water to pump, and the cycle continues. As long as there is water going into the overflow, the sump will continue to pump water. The bad news is if the the water level drops below the point of overflow, then the cycle is broken and the pump cannot move filter water back through the tank. The good news is that using one pump will not overflow your tank unless your overflow drain is too small for the pump volume. the pump cannot fill more than it is already pushing down the drain.

pump volume goes in, pump volume comes out.

 

[hollanda88]

Ahhhhhh.

I have been trying to find out how these things work over the last week and i didn't realise that the cycle starts by intentially overflowing the tank with a water pump from the sump


It all make sense ish now lol

Cheers

 

[Rooster]

Most folk drill their tank when using a sump.... either in the rear pane (or side) a couple of inches below the top, this houses a connector that mates with a pipe - which goes below the tank to the sump.
The water level is self regulating, because if the water drops below the hole, then it cannot leave the tank !
In the sump you have a single pump "emptying" the sump up to the tank (via a sheperds crook maybe - as with a canister filter) so the water level in the tank rises, until it overflows down the hole/pipe back to the sump... so the levels are automatic, and you can loose a lot of water (evaporation etc) before the cycle stops... in fact if it gets to this point, then you are VERY lazy !

The best method IMHO is to drill a hole in the base, then you fit something like an undergravel filter "up lift tube" sealed to the tank APART from its open upper end... here is the "wier", same theory as above, the water simply drains down it to the sump.

This is all a simplified account, just to give an idea..... in fact the sump doesnt need to be below the tank - it can be above, or at the side or rear.... and the plumbing arranged accordingly.

 

[WoodenChair]

Im in the middle of moving and breaking down all my tanks and setting up new ones so i happen to have a small DIY sump out gathering bacteria and growing moss. Heres the rub.

Mind you, its really DIY, and far from its final destination, or its final product for that matter. But it works, and will suit until i can finish sanding / varnishing / edging all the oak for the base of the 72G with overflows drilled that i am working on.

Water flows from an Eshopps 800GPH overflow box on the back of the tank (not pictures here, was too excited taking pics of sump)

Down the hose into a home made PVC rig because of no drip tray yet.

Using filter pads from a Eheim can filter which is now where it belongs (in the trash).

Water then falls down over bioballs. I have 3 different types, i have red nanos from a cube blue big ones and the black smaller ones. i like the black ones the best as you can get an obscene amount of them in just about anywhere.

Sorry about the condensation, but after all, it does kind of belong there.

After the water hits the dry section of bioballs i have a wet section underneath. Most sumps you find dont actually have a wet section of bioballs but as i said earlier, i am trying to culture as much bio as possible.


There are two red sea protein skimmer air blocks in there to add air to the submerged section of balls they got pushed around a bit normally they are equidistant from on another and more towards the middle. Once i put these babies in, not a week later the amount of bio on them was incredible, adding air to the submerged balls works amazingly.

Using Eggcrate between the bubble traps (Baffles) keeps the bioballs from exploding into the fuge and anything from the fuge from getting sucked into the pump baffle. Now, these pictures were taken pretty much right after setup which was over a month and a half ago, that egg crate is pretty much brown / green now with biocoat as is everything else. Ill be adding some shrimp to clean up the java moss as alot of food / detritus still makes it into there. also i have made several modifications i have a bubble filter in with the java moss now because the surface tension was next to none due to a design flaw with the baffle closest to the pump chamber being too low, it should have been raised to meet the water line, ah well gotta learn somewhere. That bubble filter actually has about 10 of those black bioballs in it instead of any sort of other media as im just using the bubbles to break the surface tension (it was gathering film)

And last but not least the actual sump (pump chamber). Again these pictures were taken a while ago and show NO bacteria. Believe me, the story is quite different now. ALSO, i have REMOVED the heater, and ADDED a small powerhead to the sump area with a rotating exit that sits right at the top of the water (its actually really cool) to disturb the surface and keep the film away as well as keep anything from settling.

Currently here you can see im using a rather interesting pump, its older then time itself, something i found while rummaging through the parents old house. "Little Giant Sump Pump" from back when our basement used to flood, does about 175 at 5 feet. I had to use this pump because its pumping into a 10 gallon tank!!! i have a mag drive 5 and 7 but all my plants would be blown flat and my fish would be surfing!

Final shots backing off a bit you can see the jalli HO light strip 10k daylight bulb. that's the 13 inch, snaps PERFECT to the 10G sump.

Believe me, i know everything is jury rigged to the hilt, i live in a diy work in progess world folks i do the best i can

I hope having a more personal visual account helps you on your path to the lovely land of sump. If you have any questions don't hesitate to PM!

-Chairman Wood

 

[SMAUG]

that was a great photo explanation. nice and clear.
looking to refurbish my sump,and you've given me some good ideas, thankyou.